14:05:15 RRSAgent has joined #wot-td 14:05:19 logging to https://www.w3.org/2024/06/26-wot-td-irc 14:05:21 meeting: WoT-WG - TD-TF 14:05:29 s/TD-TF/TD-TF - Slot 1/ 14:06:13 present+ Kaz_Ashimura, Ege_Korkan, Luca_Barbato, Christiano_Aguzzi, Mahda_Noura, Tomoaki_Mizushima 14:06:27 cris has joined #wot-td 14:06:41 Ege has joined #wot-td 14:06:46 present+ Michael_Koster 14:07:31 mjk has joined #wot-td 14:07:34 scribenick: mjk 14:07:41 agenda: https://www.w3.org/WoT/IG/wiki/WG_WoT_Thing_Description_WebConf#June_26_and_27_2024 14:07:48 mahda has joined #wot-td 14:07:59 present+ Mahda_Noura 14:08:09 s/agenda/ topic: agenda 14:09:50 rrsagent, make log public 14:09:54 rrsagent, draft minutes 14:09:55 I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2024/06/26-wot-td-minutes.html kaz 14:10:02 topic: Minutes 14:10:05 topic: minutes review from June 5th 14:10:19 -> https://www.w3.org/2024/06/05-wot-td-minutes.html June-5 14:10:51 s/5th/5th and 6th 14:11:09 s/ topic: agenda/agenda/ 14:11:27 q+ 14:12:15 ege: any changes? 14:12:36 ... minutes are approved 14:12:42 ack k 14:13:11 https://www.w3.org/WoT/IG/wiki/Wiki_for_WoT_Week_2024_planning 14:13:12 i|any change|-> https://www.w3.org/2024/06/06-wot-td-minutes.html June-6| 14:13:17 rrsagent, draft minutes 14:13:18 I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2024/06/26-wot-td-minutes.html kaz 14:13:29 topic: WoT week plugfest 14:13:48 s/topic: Minutes// 14:13:49 rrsagent, draft minutes 14:13:51 I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2024/06/26-wot-td-minutes.html kaz 14:13:57 ege: we have 2 full days for testing 14:14:23 ... for unknown things and to show people what we have 14:14:24 s|https://www.w3.org/WoT/IG/wiki/Wiki_for_WoT_Week_2024_planning|| 14:14:37 i|we have 2|-> https://www.w3.org/WoT/IG/wiki/Wiki_for_WoT_Week_2024_planning Plugfest during WoT Week in Nov| 14:14:39 rrsagent, draft minutes 14:14:40 I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2024/06/26-wot-td-minutes.html kaz 14:15:02 ... think about what features we should prioritize for development so as to have them ready for the plugfest 14:15:06 q+ 14:15:18 ege: any input? 14:15:34 ack k 14:15:40 kaz: do we want to include asynchronous actions? 14:16:01 q+ 14:16:01 chair: Ege 14:16:07 rrsagent, draft minutes 14:16:08 I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2024/06/26-wot-td-minutes.html kaz 14:16:14 ack cr 14:16:33 cris: +1 on sync actions, initial connection might be a candidate 14:16:36 s/minutes review/Minutes review/ 14:16:38 rrsagent, draft minutes 14:16:40 I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2024/06/26-wot-td-minutes.html kaz 14:17:20 ... can we update the topics if we change our mind before then? 14:17:48 ege: yes, we might make progress on some topics and not need as much testing 14:18:06 q? 14:18:18 cris: also error handling with additional responses 14:18:33 ege: also other use cases for additional responses 14:18:51 cris: how does it map betewwn protocol and application? 14:19:07 s/betewwn/between 14:20:01 ege: any other priorities? 14:20:04 q+ 14:20:16 mjk: data mapping from binding to interaction 14:20:42 luca: we haven't discussed it enough to be ready for testing 14:20:58 q? 14:21:25 ege: there is some new interest in this topic 14:21:47 luca: OK, let's make time to make progress 14:22:04 ... Also would like to look into degraded consumption 14:22:31 q+ 14:22:48 ege: this will define what happens when a consumer doesn't understand some keywords 14:24:04 ege: we can define "normative consumption" for what will be required 14:24:56 q? 14:25:03 luca: it's more than just interoperability, but that is the goal 14:25:24 ack cr 14:25:47 cris: +1 for normative consumption. It's more about interaction than consumption 14:26:01 ege: yes, agree 14:26:16 rrsagent, draft minutes 14:26:17 I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2024/06/26-wot-td-minutes.html kaz 14:26:36 q+ 14:26:41 cris: what about the discussion on meta operations and multiple operations 14:26:59 q+ 14:28:15 ... meta operation for observing changes to the TD 14:28:19 q++ Luca 14:28:35 q- + 14:28:38 q- Luca 14:28:41 qq+ Luca 14:28:52 ack lu 14:28:52 Luca, you wanted to react to cris 14:29:10 luca: that one requires a way to identify a TD vs. the thing it describes 14:30:07 luca_barbato has joined #wot-td 14:30:13 ack Tomo 14:31:25 tomo: testing the server and client connection model for scope of smart home and smart city - how to use WoT in a service model 14:31:49 q? 14:33:27 kaz: we should think about user scenarios for features 14:33:42 q? 14:34:51 ack k 14:35:01 ... we should get developers viewpoint on error handling and additional responses 14:35:36 s/we should think about user scenarios for features/regarding Mizushima-san's comment, we should think about user scenarios for features/ 14:36:09 s/error handling/error handling, default behavior/ 14:36:22 s/we should get/also we should get/ 14:36:30 rrsagent, draft minutes 14:36:31 I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2024/06/26-wot-td-minutes.html kaz 14:37:01 mahda: semantic annotation using rdf:type assigns multiple types to a TD, causing confusion as to how the different types apply 14:37:03 present+ Kunihiko_Toumura 14:37:13 q? 14:38:17 ege: good input, we will need to prioritize for testing 14:38:43 ... and categorize 14:40:25 ... some categories noted in the github issue 14:41:00 ... anything else, do we want to look at specific protocols? 14:41:15 ... OK, no more input, let's move on 14:41:42 topic: tooling 14:41:52 s/tooling/Tooling 14:42:44 topic: JSON Schema adoption 14:43:12 ege: the direction is that we can reference JSON Schema directly as long as we reference a specific version 14:43:14 q? 14:43:24 q+ 14:43:27 ack m 14:43:37 ... is there anything more to consider? 14:44:39 kaz: There will be further discussion and improvement but for now we can use a reference to a specific version 14:44:45 cris has joined #wot-td 14:44:56 ege: Propose to use the latest "stable" version 14:45:16 kaz: we can follow the style of integration used by the VC document 14:45:33 ege: we may need a stronger reference 14:45:38 ack k 14:45:49 ... any more discussion points? 14:46:08 ... topic: Initial connection 14:46:10 i|we may need|-> https://www.w3.org/TR/vc-json-schema/#normative-references VC JSON Schema spec| 14:46:23 rrsagent, draft minutes 14:46:24 I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2024/06/26-wot-td-minutes.html kaz 14:46:32 ... Issue # 2025 14:47:03 ... used the Mermaid integration to create a flow diagram (in the issue) 14:47:39 ... made cases for point to point and for a broker intermediary 14:48:23 q+ 14:48:36 ege: any comments? 14:48:43 cris: this looks fine 14:48:51 q+ 14:49:14 ack cr 14:49:28 rrsgent, draft minutes 14:49:32 ... it would also be useful to show different operations over MQTT 14:50:19 s/... topic: Initial connection/topic: Initial connection/ 14:50:35 luca: the Mermaid diagram doesn't show the persistent connection very well 14:50:44 s/... Issue # 2025/subtopic: Issue # 2025/ 14:51:13 i|used the Mer|-> https://github.com/w3c/wot-thing-description/issues/2025 Issue 2025 - Extending the initial/reusable connection examples| 14:51:14 ... started to define how a proxy would work and Mermaid is missing features for this 14:51:15 rrsgent, draft minutes 14:52:24 ege: please paste some examples 14:53:02 luca: mainly is missing colors to show another dimension of the persistent connection vs. subscriptions 14:54:48 luca: pasted example showing how a proxy can maintain a persistent connection to the device and handles connections from multiple consumers 14:54:49 q? 14:55:31 ege: there are different TDs for the different levels 14:56:13 luca: there are different layers with different scope, onboarding vs ongoing communication 14:56:53 q? 14:57:12 q+ 14:57:44 ack m 14:57:49 +1 14:59:01 ege: we will use this drawio file showing the connection 15:00:00 ack lu 15:00:11 rrsagent, draft minutes 15:00:12 I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2024/06/26-wot-td-minutes.html kaz 15:01:03 s/rrsgent, draft minutes//g 15:01:05 rrsagent, draft minutes 15:01:07 I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2024/06/26-wot-td-minutes.html kaz 15:01:18 ege: we are on time, any other business? 15:01:40 ... call adjourned, thank you all 15:01:44 rrsagent, draft minutes 15:01:46 I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2024/06/26-wot-td-minutes.html kaz