– DRAFT –
(MEETING TITLE)

< Lionel_Wolberger> present+ Jason

< Lionel_Wolberger> zakim, who is here?

< Zakim> Present: Lionel_Wolberger, Jason

< Zakim> On IRC I see Lionel_Wolberger, janina, jamesn, dmontalvo, Zakim

< Lionel_Wolberger> present+ Janina

< Lionel_Wolberger> agenda? * Zakim sees 4 items remaining on the agenda: * Zakim 1. Welcome & Introductions (As needed) [from janina] * Zakim 4. Calendaring calls through July [from janina] * Zakim 2. CG Expectations & Goals [from janina] * Zakim 3. Actions and Next Steps [from janina]

< Lionel_Wolberger> zakim, next item

< Zakim> agendum 1 -- Welcome & Introductions (As needed) -- taken up [from janina]

< janina> present+

< janina> scribe+

< janina> zakim, next item

< Zakim> agendum 1 was just opened, janina

< janina> zakim, close this item

< Zakim> agendum 1 closed

< Zakim> I see 3 items remaining on the agenda; the next one is

< Zakim> 4. Calendaring calls through July [from janina]

< janina> zakim, take up item 3

< Zakim> agendum 3 -- Actions and Next Steps -- taken up [from janina]

< janina> Lionel_Wolberger: Notes his @W3C history starting in security; something we'd now call personalization

< janina> Lionel_Wolberger: a11y has demanded equal access fairly successfully for awhile now

< janina> Lionel_Wolberger: a visible a11y widget would help people decide to do something

< janina> Lionel_Wolberger: recalls a roundtable about what overlays actually do

< janina> Lionel_Wolberger: our conversations got confused; looked for a way to clarify and define objectively

< janina> Lionel_Wolberger: founded this cg

< janina> Lionel_Wolberger: notes the DOJ Title II reference of our emerging doc

< janina> Lionel_Wolberger: notes DOJ found us on their own, we did not push it

< janina> Lionel_Wolberger: my message has been let W3C define what it is and good for; that's what W3C does well

< janina> Lionel_Wolberger: I expect a final version of this doc will dispositivgely define "not at source" a11y support; perhaps W3C may even move it forward

< Lionel_Wolberger> scribe+

< Lionel_Wolberger> janina: I have in the past grabbed a "third rail" and taken on challenging subjects

< Lionel_Wolberger> ... I think it is a good excercise to look at accessibility options that perhaps are not made clear by WCAG

< Lionel_Wolberger> ... The work we are doing here may very well progress to a non-tracked note status

< Lionel_Wolberger> ... W3C's annual TPAC meeting is coming up, and we find Groups are using Google Docs

< Lionel_Wolberger> ... looking at many ways to improve that collaborative process, and accessibility at the edge and AI may be able to assist

< Lionel_Wolberger> ... and APA is interested in these issues

< Lionel_Wolberger> jason: I find overlays are not a 'thing'

< Lionel_Wolberger> ... it is a JavaScript pattern that has been used for years

< Lionel_Wolberger> ... there are many techniques that are post-source and are good for accessibility

< Lionel_Wolberger> ... lots of post-source technologies that have benefits out there

< Lionel_Wolberger> ... I would like to help spell out when these technologies are beneficial, less so, what are the trade-offs

< Lionel_Wolberger> present+ chris

< Lionel_Wolberger> Chris: I find the members of this group very knowledgeable and thoughtful in its process.

< Lionel_Wolberger> rrsagent, make minutes

< Lionel_Wolberger> present+ Mike_Paciello

< Lionel_Wolberger> Mike_Paciello: Happy to attend my first meeting. I will read the report draft and next time I attend, give feedback.

Calendaring calls through July

<Lionel_Wolberger> janina: We are meeting next week.

CG Expectations & Goals

<Lionel_Wolberger> janina: We discussed this at the top of the meeting

Recruitment

<Lionel_Wolberger> jason: broaden Types of people we want to invite

<Lionel_Wolberger> ... accessibility people at the major browsers

<Lionel_Wolberger> ... CMS systems people who work on accessibility

<Lionel_Wolberger> ... expand the post-source activity to the outer edges of the internet

<Lionel_Wolberger> Lionel_Wolberger: Lawyers in the field may in be interested

<Lionel_Wolberger> jason: engage people in the bigger picture, some of these things can be done by different players

CG Expectations & Goals

<Lionel_Wolberger> jason: we did not take any decision regarding the name of the group, or the name of the document

<Lionel_Wolberger> jason: Document name could be, "Capabilities of Overlays and other Post-Source Techniques"

<Lionel_Wolberger> janina: "Capabilities of Overlays or Related Post-Source Techniques"

<Lionel_Wolberger> janina: Changing the group name is very difficult

<Lionel_Wolberger> jason: I am OK to keep the group name, as the word "edge" does serve as a reasonable collective term

<Lionel_Wolberger> Lionel_Wolberger: I believe it is possible to change the group's description, more easily than the group's name

https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-a11yedge/2024Jun/0001.html

H2 Review

<Lionel_Wolberger> Lionel_Wolberger: We are up to 4.2.8 Color

<Lionel_Wolberger> Lionel_Wolberger: All agree, promote 4.2.8 Color to an H2

<Lionel_Wolberger> Lionel_Wolberger: 4.2.9 Accessible Pricing (Strikethroughs)

Lionel_Wolberger: Numbers? should they be their own h2?

Lionel_Wolberger: discalculia ...

<Lionel_Wolberger> janina: Number management

<Lionel_Wolberger> chris: +1 very interesting as a seperate category

<Lionel_Wolberger> janina: Phone numbers are often read as a number in the millions

<Lionel_Wolberger> ... you would think the screen readers would get them right after 40 years, but they don't

<Lionel_Wolberger> ... same for St. being read as Street and not Saint

<Lionel_Wolberger> ... Dr. being Drive or Doctor and so on

<Lionel_Wolberger> Lionel_Wolberger: This could go under 3.6 as a form of semiotics

<Lionel_Wolberger> ... An H3 could read "Numbers and Digits"

<Lionel_Wolberger> ... and a further H3 could read "Acronyms and Text To Speech"

<Lionel_Wolberger> Lionel_Wolberger: ... The St., Dr. and CD examples can all be reliably unpacked with some context inspection

<Lionel_Wolberger> janina: Resume next time at 4.2.10, Reset All Personalizations

<Lionel_Wolberger> Chris: In the built environment, there's often confusion imposed by poor naming decision. For example 123 Tree St., 123 Tree Ct., 123 Tree Ave., all being within half a mile from one another

<Lionel_Wolberger> ... this can lead to delays in the arrival of emergency services

<Lionel_Wolberger> ... a related challenge is when the address is on a side street, but the entrance is on another street

<Lionel_Wolberger> janina: These challenges are very real, while they may not have a place in this Community Group, I will have a think about where we can take these topics up elsewhere

<Lionel_Wolberger> Chris: The Edge could add warnings, or messages warning about potential confusion

<Lionel_Wolberger> janina: This reminds me of the ability to pipe and reconnect computational processes, that we have in Unix/Linux and do not have in the world wide web

<Lionel_Wolberger> ... we have APIs that could achieve this.

<Lionel_Wolberger> Chris: It's like when navigational tools say, 'construction' etc