13:56:51 <RRSAgent> RRSAgent has joined #wcag2ict
13:56:55 <RRSAgent> logging to https://www.w3.org/2024/06/06-wcag2ict-irc
13:56:55 <Zakim> RRSAgent, make logs Public
13:56:56 <Zakim> Meeting: WCAG2ICT Task Force Teleconference
13:56:58 <maryjom> zakim, clear agenda
13:56:58 <Zakim> agenda cleared
13:57:04 <maryjom> chair: Mary Jo Mueller
13:57:18 <maryjom> Zakim, please time speakers at 2 minutes
13:57:18 <Zakim> ok, maryjom
13:57:25 <maryjom> Agenda+ Announcements
13:57:31 <maryjom> Agenda+ Survey results: Updated proposals developed on 30-31 May
13:58:56 <shadi> shadi has joined #wcag2ict
13:59:44 <bruce_bailey> bruce_bailey has joined #wcag2ict
13:59:59 <bruce_bailey> present+
14:00:05 <loicmn> loicmn has joined #wcag2ict
14:00:25 <PhilDay> PhilDay has joined #wcag2ict
14:00:33 <PhilDay> present+
14:00:41 <maryjom> present+
14:00:47 <loicmn> present+
14:01:00 <Chuck> Chuck has joined #wcag2ict
14:01:11 <PhilDay> scribe+ PhilDay
14:01:11 <Chuck> present+
14:01:53 <PhilDay> zakim, next item
14:01:53 <Zakim> agendum 1 -- Announcements -- taken up [from maryjom]
14:01:57 <Mike_Pluke> Mike_Pluke has joined #wcag2ict
14:02:17 <bruce_bailey> https://github.com/w3c/wcag2ict/wiki/Work-for-the-week#6-june-meeting
14:02:29 <PhilDay> Did talk to AG WG on current status (working on 5 things in survey). Plan still is to update the PR, send to AG WG, then they can review the changes.
14:02:43 <FernandaBonnin> FernandaBonnin has joined #WCAG2ICT
14:02:45 <PhilDay> That agreement could happen on Tuesday
14:03:16 <PhilDay> Then doc can go to call for consensus to publish (CfC). Would be by end of Friday. So document could publish the following week (Tuesday 18th, or Thursday 20th).
14:03:31 <Mike_Pluke> present+
14:03:49 <Devanshu> Devanshu has joined #wcag2ict
14:04:00 <PhilDay> Horizontal review will happen at the same time (as soon as it publishes). Ask for them to complete within 30 days as well (same length of time as public review comment period).
14:04:20 <PhilDay> Then we can publish the final version if we do not get substantive changes from public review or horizontal review.
14:04:35 <PhilDay> After that the meeting cadence can reduce
14:04:59 <PhilDay> zakim, next item
14:04:59 <Zakim> agendum 2 -- Survey results: Updated proposals developed on 30-31 May -- taken up [from maryjom]
14:05:02 <Devanshu> present+
14:05:06 <maryjom> https://www.w3.org/2002/09/wbs/55145/WCAG2ICT-last-updates/results
14:05:23 <PhilDay> We got 10 responses which is good.
14:05:25 <maryjom> TOPIC: Question 1 – Update definition of “closed functionality”
14:05:29 <GreggVan> Present+
14:05:31 <shadi> present+
14:05:32 <maryjom> https://www.w3.org/2002/09/wbs/55145/WCAG2ICT-last-updates/results#xq1
14:05:39 <Sam> Sam has joined #wcag2ict
14:05:40 <PhilDay> All 10 preferred option 1, as is
14:05:41 <Sam> present+
14:06:31 <maryjom> DRAFT RESOLUTION: Do not change the definition of “closed functionality”; leave as it is in the current editor’s draft.
14:06:33 <PhilDay> +1
14:06:35 <Sam> +1
14:06:35 <loicmn> +1
14:06:41 <Mike_Pluke> +1
14:06:41 <LauraMiller> LauraMiller has joined #WCAG2ICT
14:06:41 <shadi> +1
14:06:45 <LauraMiller> present+
14:06:48 <bruce_bailey> +1
14:07:07 <LauraMiller> +1
14:07:07 <Devanshu> +1
14:07:08 <ChrisLoiselle> +1
14:07:15 <maryjom> RESOLUTION: Do not change the definition of “closed functionality”; leave as it is in the current editor’s draft.
14:07:19 <GreggVan> +1
14:07:28 <maryjom> TOPIC: Question 2 - (1 of 2) SC Problematic for Closed – 1.4.10 Reflow
14:07:45 <maryjom> https://www.w3.org/2002/09/wbs/55145/WCAG2ICT-last-updates/results#xq2
14:07:53 <PhilDay> 7 incorporate option 4 as is, 3 incorporate with edits
14:08:25 <PhilDay> Option 4: Updated 30 May survey proposal due to survey responses
14:08:25 <PhilDay> 1.4.10 Reflow - Some software on ICT with closed functionality does not support scrolling content, or zooming or changing the viewport (examples include software for self-service transaction machines or kiosks). Therefore, some other non-WCAG requirements would be needed for products with closed functionality to ensure that content is readable
14:08:25 <PhilDay> without scrolling in two directions.
14:08:29 <LauraMiller> LauraMiller has joined #WCAG2ICT
14:08:52 <PhilDay> Google doc for proposals: https://docs.google.com/document/d/1mgC_YiHl5qgoLmcCYacwfEziHnr1zVZnAMzEMPCF9Io/edit#heading=h.a8x1l16o921i
14:09:13 <PhilDay> Chris suggested modifying the use of "some".
14:09:25 <PhilDay> Bruce had some further minor changes
14:09:41 <PhilDay> Fernanda agreed to these edits, concerned with last part of last sentence.
14:10:25 <maryjom> https://docs.google.com/document/d/1mgC_YiHl5qgoLmcCYacwfEziHnr1zVZnAMzEMPCF9Io/edit#heading=h.a8x1l16o921i
14:10:31 <GreggVan> q+
14:10:32 <PhilDay> Mary Jo drafted a proposal that incorporates all these
14:10:50 <bruce_bailey> 1.4.10 Reflow – Some software on ICT with closed functionality does not support scrolling content, or zooming, or changing the viewport (examples include, but are not limited to, software for self-service transaction machines or kiosks).  Therefore, some other non-WCAG requirements would be needed for products with closed functionality to ensure
14:10:50 <bruce_bailey> that content is readable by persons with low vision without scrolling in two dimensions.
14:11:11 <bruce_bailey> ^^ current option 5 in google doc
14:11:17 <PhilDay> Option 5: Edits due to survey comments (Chris, Bruce, and Fernanda)
14:11:17 <PhilDay> 1.4.10 Reflow – Some software on ICT with closed functionality does not support scrolling content, or zooming, or changing the viewport (examples include, but are not limited to, software for self-service transaction machines or kiosks).  Therefore, some other non-WCAG requirements would be needed for products with closed functionality to ensure
14:11:17 <PhilDay> that content is readable by persons with low vision without scrolling in two dimensions.
14:11:21 <mitch11> mitch11 has joined #wcag2ict
14:11:33 <mitch11> present+
14:11:42 <PhilDay> q?
14:11:47 <maryjom> ack GreggVan
14:12:17 <PhilDay> GreggVan: dimensions is less plain English than direction. Also direction is closer to the meaning.
14:12:24 <PhilDay> maryjom: Because SC says dimensions
14:12:33 <PhilDay> GreggVan: Then it should stay with dimensions
14:13:15 <bruce_bailey> For reference, https://www.w3.org/TR/WCAG22/#reflow
14:13:16 <maryjom> q?
14:13:33 <GreggVan> +11
14:13:37 <bruce_bailey> +11
14:13:38 <PhilDay> Any concerns with this proposed option 5?
14:13:59 <maryjom> DRAFT RESOLUTION: Incorporate proposal 5 for 1.4.10 Reflow into the SC Problematic for Closed Functionality section, as-is
14:14:00 <loicmn> +1
14:14:01 <PhilDay> +1
14:14:02 <Devanshu> +1
14:14:03 <mitch11> +1
14:14:04 <GreggVan> +1
14:14:06 <bruce_bailey> +1
14:14:07 <shadi> +1
14:14:09 <ChrisLoiselle> +1
14:14:17 <Chuck> (Gregg's + Bruces)/22
14:14:26 <maryjom> RESOLUTION: Incorporate proposal 5 for 1.4.10 Reflow into the SC Problematic for Closed Functionality section, as-is
14:14:32 <FernandaBonnin> FernandaBonnin has joined #WCAG2ICT
14:14:34 <Sam> +1
14:14:37 <FernandaBonnin> +1
14:14:40 <Chuck> Chuck has joined #wcag2ict
14:14:59 <maryjom> TOPIC: Question 3 - (2 of 2) SC Problematic for Closed – 2.1.1 Keyboard
14:15:00 <FernandaBonnin> present+
14:15:08 <maryjom> https://www.w3.org/2002/09/wbs/55145/WCAG2ICT-last-updates/results#xq3
14:15:09 <LauraMiller> +1
14:15:10 <Mike_Pluke> Mike_Pluke has joined #wcag2ict
14:15:12 <PhilDay> Google doc link: https://docs.google.com/document/d/1mgC_YiHl5qgoLmcCYacwfEziHnr1zVZnAMzEMPCF9Io/edit#heading=h.78cegr3ndndm
14:15:28 <Sam> Sam has joined #wcag2ict
14:16:06 <PhilDay> Responses. 1 said option 9c as is, 1 said 9c with edits, 4 said option 10 as is, 4 said option 10 with edits
14:16:25 <PhilDay> Shadi suggested slight edit to option 10
14:16:57 <PhilDay> Shadi's edit: Slight edit from Option #10, to replace "provides, or allows installation or connection of," with "supports" -- the reason is that basically any ICT with a USB or Bluetooth port allows connection with a keyboard but that does not necessarily mean that it was designed to work with a keyboard.
14:17:34 <Mike_Pluke> Mike_Pluke has joined #wcag2ict
14:17:34 <PhilDay> Bruce preferred option 9c. If we go with option 10, suggest we lose the last sentence.
14:17:51 <bruce_bailey> q+
14:18:22 <PhilDay> Gregg suggested 9c, with the last sentence from option 10
14:18:32 <LauraMiller> LauraMiller has joined #WCAG2ICT
14:18:42 <LauraMiller> Q+
14:18:59 <maryjom> ack bruce_bailey
14:19:26 <PhilDay> bruce_bailey: 10 is trying to be in the affirmative, but thought that it made it more difficult to read.
14:19:38 <GreggVan> q+
14:19:56 <PhilDay> bruce_bailey: Another concern: yes, we should mention keypads, but didn't think that 10 didn't phrase it well.
14:20:02 <maryjom> ack LauraMiller
14:20:50 <PhilDay> LauraMiller: I missed last week, shouldn't just mention a single brand like EZ Access. Maybe we should just mention alternative input devices. Also concerned that we shouldn't be too prescriptive about hardware
14:21:00 <bruce_bailey> I did included the (R) mark on EZ Access, it is just an example.
14:21:20 <PhilDay> ... Canadian standard for example is very specific on types of hardware used for input. I think we may not wish to that far.
14:21:29 <maryjom> q?
14:21:41 <maryjom> ack GreggVan
14:22:03 <Mike_Pluke> Q+
14:23:12 <bruce_bailey> s/ but didn't think that 10 didn't phrase it well/ but didn't think that 10 phrased it well/
14:24:06 <PhilDay> GreggVan: proposed Option 9d - like 9c, but with last sentence from option 10
14:24:09 <maryjom> ack Mike_Pluke
14:24:58 <shadi> q+
14:24:58 <PhilDay> Mike_Pluke: Had a call with people within ETSI - so giving some input on whether a keypad is a keyboard would be useful, if this is the consensus.
14:25:03 <mitch11> q+
14:25:03 <PhilDay> q?
14:25:07 <shadi> Q-
14:25:14 <maryjom> ack mitch
14:25:23 <PhilDay> Mike_Pluke: Would like to retain the last sentence of option 10.
14:25:48 <bruce_bailey> Gregg's Option 9d  (Same as 9c - including dropping old last sentence - but add last sentence of opt 10)
14:25:48 <bruce_bailey> 2.1.1 Keyboard - Assumes operation via a keyboard interface which also allows for alternative input devices. It may not be possible to satisfy this success criterion when a) the ICT does not have a built-in keyboard, and b) it does not provide, or allow installation or connection of, an alternative input method (hardware or software) that provides
14:25:48 <bruce_bailey> keyboard-like functionality. A keypad that provides full access to functionality could be considered a keyboard.
14:25:58 <FernandaBonnin> FernandaBonnin has joined #WCAG2ICT
14:26:01 <Sam> q
14:26:11 <PhilDay> mitch11: If we retain the last sentence about keypads, I don't think it should include a simple directional keypad as it is a mouse alternative, not a keyboard alternative
14:26:32 <Mike_Pluke> Q+
14:26:41 <GreggVan> q+
14:26:47 <bruce_bailey> +1 for keypad could be consider a keypad if it provides full functionality
14:26:53 <PhilDay> Sam: A keypad that provides X could be considered a keyboard interface ...
14:26:54 <LauraMiller> +1
14:27:01 <maryjom> ack Mike_Pluke
14:27:30 <maryjom> ack GreggVan
14:27:35 <PhilDay> Mike_Pluke: Agree with Mitch. Keypad can be used as directional, but in combination with onscreen options/keyboard, it does give you keyboard functionality.
14:27:38 <GreggVan> A keypad that provides full access to functionality without requiring directional navigation could be considered a keyboard.
14:27:39 <LauraMiller> q+
14:27:59 <PhilDay> GreggVan: proposal above
14:29:01 <maryjom> ack LauraMiller
14:29:22 <loicmn> loicmn has joined #wcag2ict
14:29:27 <loicmn> present+
14:29:41 <GreggVan> q+
14:30:05 <PhilDay> LauraMiller: Discussion on directional keyboards, similar to tab / shift / space. If you have this, then you address the user need.
14:30:16 <mitch11> q+
14:30:24 <maryjom> ack GreggVan
14:30:47 <maryjom> q+
14:31:02 <PhilDay> GreggVan: Agree with Laura. Except that gestures are never an equivalent to a keyboard input - they can be an alternative, as not all can swipe/make gestures
14:31:26 <Sam> q
14:31:50 <shadi> q+ sam
14:31:54 <maryjom> ack mitch
14:32:18 <olivia> olivia has joined #wcag2ict
14:32:24 <olivia> present+
14:32:40 <PhilDay> mitch11: Agree with others - not always directional on kiosks. Maybe are on TVs and gaming systems. Last sentence has a problem in that it is too positive
14:33:25 <GreggVan> q+
14:33:30 <maryjom> ack maryjom
14:33:53 <PhilDay> maryjom: Chair hat on. Keep this succinct so we can make progress
14:34:15 <mitch11> mitch11 has joined #wcag2ict
14:34:37 <maryjom> q?
14:34:38 <Chuck> +1 with MJ
14:34:41 <PhilDay> maryjom: Adding more discussion about what is/isn't a keyboard interface can cause issues.
14:34:42 <maryjom> ack Sam
14:35:06 <PhilDay> Sam: Can we provide something that says "it could be" rather than being too specific. Keypad can provide some access...
14:35:11 <Laura_Miller> Laura_Miller has joined #WCAG2ICT
14:35:12 <shadi> +1
14:35:13 <maryjom> ack GreggVan
14:35:51 <PhilDay> GreggVan: Closed, means you cannot connect something. Maybe we should change to "might be considered a keyboard"
14:35:58 <PhilDay> q?
14:36:22 <PhilDay> Option 9c: Changed 2nd sentence (a or b)
14:36:22 <PhilDay> 2.1.1 Keyboard - Assumes operation via a keyboard interface which also allows for alternative input devices. It may not be possible to satisfy this success criterion when a) the ICT does not have a built-in keyboard, and b) it does not provide, or allow installation or connection of, an alternative input method (hardware or software) that provides
14:36:22 <PhilDay> keyboard-like functionality.
14:36:22 <PhilDay> Option 10: Edits to address all concerns from the group (hopefully)
14:36:24 <PhilDay> 2.1.1 Keyboard - Assumes operation via a keyboard interface which also allows for alternative input devices. It is possible to satisfy this success criterion if a) the ICT has a built-in keyboard, or b) provides, or allows installation or connection of, an alternative input method (hardware or software) that provides keyboard-like functionality. A
14:36:24 <PhilDay> keypad that provides full access to functionality could be considered a keyboard.
14:36:25 <GreggVan>  2.1.1 Keyboard - Assumes operation via a keyboard interface which also allows for alternative input devices. It may not be possible to satisfy this success criterion when a) the ICT does not have a built-in keyboard, and b) it does not provide, or allow installation or connection of, an alternative input method (hardware or software) that provides keyboard-like functionality. A keypad that provides full access to functionality without
14:36:25 <GreggVan>  requiring directional navigation might be considered a keyboard.
14:36:27 <bruce_bailey> Option 11: Edit of option 10 - Shadi’s proposed change to the 2nd sentence
14:36:27 <bruce_bailey> 2.1.1 Keyboard - Assumes operation via a keyboard interface which also allows for alternative input devices. It is possible to satisfy this success criterion if a) the ICT has a built-in keyboard, or b) provides, or allows installation or connection of, supports an alternative input method (hardware or software) that provides keyboard-like
14:36:27 <bruce_bailey> functionality. A keypad that provides full access to functionality could be considered a keyboard.
14:36:36 <shadi> q+
14:36:47 <maryjom> POLL: Which proposal are you leaning toward? 1) Option 9c, or 2)10?
14:36:58 <GreggVan> 1
14:37:03 <bruce_bailey> 10 w/ shadi's edit
14:37:27 <PhilDay> shadi: Didn't meant to imply another option.
14:37:40 <shadi> ack me
14:38:01 <shadi> 1 or 2
14:38:02 <loicmn> 2
14:38:04 <PhilDay> 2 or 1
14:38:07 <mitch11> 1 or 2
14:38:15 <Mike_Pluke> 2 or 1
14:38:19 <FernandaBonnin> 2 or 1
14:38:24 <Sam> 1 | 2
14:38:29 <Devanshu> 1 or 2
14:38:31 <ChrisLoiselle> 2 | 1
14:38:35 <GreggVan> 1
14:38:42 <Chuck> q+
14:38:48 <maryjom> ack Chuck
14:39:06 <PhilDay> Chuck: Looks like it is evenly split.
14:39:11 <mitch11> q+
14:39:17 <maryjom> ack mitch
14:39:42 <PhilDay> mitch11: Hard to answer as we haven't quite finished edits
14:39:42 <GreggVan> I  can go with 2  with edits
14:39:47 <GreggVan> q+
14:39:55 <Chuck> ack Gregg
14:40:57 <bruce_bailey> q+
14:41:03 <PhilDay> q?
14:41:06 <maryjom> ack bruce_bailey
14:41:28 <PhilDay> bruce_bailey: Thing that Shadi fixed was to use "supports" instead of allows connection. Liked this
14:42:23 <Sam> q+
14:43:22 <maryjom> q?
14:43:37 <PhilDay> q+ to say we are trying to encourage closed functionality manufacturers to consider accessibility, rather than saying they all fail
14:43:51 <maryjom> ack Sam
14:44:03 <GreggVan> q+
14:44:09 <PhilDay> Sam: We are talking about a keyboard interface, rather than talking about supporting all AT
14:44:11 <bruce_bailey> q?
14:44:24 <maryjom> ack PhilDay
14:44:24 <Zakim> PhilDay, you wanted to say we are trying to encourage closed functionality manufacturers to consider accessibility, rather than saying they all fail
14:44:56 <ChrisLoiselle> Phil : Similar to Sam. We are giving some kind of hints to people designing closed functionality. Rather than can't meet and don't bother.
14:45:13 <ChrisLoiselle> Phil: Keyboard might be helpful. Hints to help.
14:45:19 <Chuck> Phil:  We aren't saying you must satisfy x and y, we are giving hints.
14:45:28 <dmontalvo> present+ Daniel
14:45:31 <maryjom> q?
14:45:34 <maryjom> ack GreggVan
14:46:18 <PhilDay> GreggVan: What should we be looking at? Option 9. WCAG support keyboard device - should handle all sorts of AT, not just a physical keyboard or onscreen keyboard
14:46:20 <bruce_bailey> q+
14:46:21 <maryjom> Option 9d:  2.1.1 Keyboard - Assumes operation via a keyboard interface which also allows for alternative input devices. It may not be possible to satisfy this success criterion when a) the ICT does not have a built-in keyboard, and b) it does not provide, or allow installation or connection of, an alternative input method (hardware or software)
14:46:21 <maryjom> that provides keyboard-like functionality. A keypad that provides full access to functionality without requiring directional navigation might be considered a keyboard.
14:47:17 <PhilDay> GreggVan: option 10 and all variations are not correct, in my opinion.
14:47:25 <maryjom> Option 10:  2.1.1 Keyboard - Assumes operation via a keyboard interface which also allows for alternative input devices. Other methods may help meet some user needs, such as supporting a built-in keyboard, an alternative input method (hardware or software) that provides keyboard-like functionality, or keypad that provides full access to
14:47:26 <maryjom> functionality without requiring directional navigation.
14:47:39 <PhilDay> [Mitch is working on new option 10a in the Google doc]
14:47:39 <maryjom> s/Option 10/Option 10a/
14:47:59 <shadi> q+
14:48:05 <Chuck> ack br
14:48:06 <maryjom> ack bruce_bailey
14:48:06 <bruce_bailey> I note that option 10 2nd sentence starts off "It is possible..." so I think it is okay.
14:48:21 <PhilDay> bruce_bailey: I voted for 9c, but 10 could be OK, as it starts with "it is possible".
14:48:56 <maryjom> ack shadi
14:48:57 <Chuck> ack shadi
14:50:04 <PhilDay> Loic: was concerned over the complexity of not a) and not b). Complex language, but could accept it if needed
14:50:16 <PhilDay> ... In option 9c
14:50:17 <Sam> Re-poll?
14:50:28 <PhilDay> Clean version of option 10a:
14:50:28 <PhilDay> 2.1.1 Keyboard - Assumes operation via a keyboard interface which also allows for alternative input devices. Other methods may help meet some user needs, such as supporting a built-in keyboard, an alternative input method (hardware or software) that provides keyboard-like functionality, or keypad that provides full access to functionality without
14:50:28 <PhilDay> requiring directional navigation.
14:51:56 <shadi> q+
14:52:06 <maryjom> POLL: Which do you prefer? 1) Option 9d or 2) 10a?
14:52:10 <shadi> 9d
14:52:12 <mitch11> 2
14:52:16 <GreggVan> 2
14:52:21 <bruce_bailey> Clean version of 10a needs work.
14:52:26 <PhilDay> PhilDay has joined #wcag2ict
14:52:28 <shadi> q-
14:52:29 <ChrisLoiselle> Scribe: ChrisLoiselle
14:52:33 <PhilDay> present+
14:52:39 <mitch11> scribe+ ChrisLoiselle
14:52:46 <ChrisLoiselle> MaryJo: 10a needs work?
14:53:05 <ChrisLoiselle> Bruce: Items come before.
14:53:17 <Chuck> q+ to talk about tomorrow, after the votes
14:53:22 <PhilDay> q+ to ask Which items are being polled?
14:53:26 <ChrisLoiselle> Gregg: It is not a keyboard.
14:53:28 <ChrisLoiselle> q?
14:53:32 <maryjom> ack Chuck
14:53:33 <Zakim> Chuck, you wanted to talk about tomorrow, after the votes
14:53:36 <ChrisLoiselle> MaryJo: I turned it to a bulleted list
14:53:54 <ChrisLoiselle> Chuck: I've added to list for tomorrow.
14:53:54 <Chuck> ack Ch
14:54:01 <ChrisLoiselle> Mary Jo: I'm not working tomorrow
14:54:07 <Mike_Pluke> 2
14:54:08 <loicmn> 2 (with bullets)
14:54:09 <ChrisLoiselle> Bruce: I'm ok with bulleted list version
14:54:11 <bruce_bailey> i am okay with bulleted list version
14:54:25 <olivia> 2
14:54:26 <maryjom> POLL: Which do you prefer? 1) Option 9d or 2) 10a?
14:54:32 <GreggVan> 2
14:54:33 <loicmn> 2
14:54:33 <olivia> 2
14:54:34 <mitch11> 2
14:54:35 <Mike_Pluke> 2
14:54:38 <shadi> 1
14:54:39 <Devanshu> 2
14:54:40 <ChrisLoiselle> 2
14:54:43 <bruce_bailey> 2
14:54:47 <PhilDay> 2, happy with 1 as well
14:54:47 <Sam> 1 | 2
14:54:56 <FernandaBonnin> 2
14:54:57 <ChrisLoiselle> MaryJo: Shadi, do you oppose ?
14:55:14 <PhilDay> Clean version of option 10a:
14:55:14 <PhilDay> 2.1.1 Keyboard - Assumes operation via a keyboard interface which also allows for alternative input devices. Other methods may help meet some user needs, such as supporting:
14:55:14 <PhilDay> a built-in keyboard
14:55:14 <PhilDay> an alternative input method (hardware or software) that provides keyboard-like functionality, or
14:55:16 <PhilDay> a keypad that provides full access to functionality without requiring directional navigation.
14:55:23 <ChrisLoiselle> Shadi: It may not be possible in certain circumstances . I'm not sure what the issue is?
14:55:34 <ChrisLoiselle> Gregg: 9c implies keyboard solves propblem
14:55:57 <ChrisLoiselle> ...may not possible if not supplying a keyboard. If a keyboard would solve it, which isn't true.
14:55:58 <ChrisLoiselle> q?
14:56:33 <ChrisLoiselle> Shadi: I don't think this is clear enough.
14:56:35 <GreggVan> q+
14:56:46 <maryjom> ack PhilDay
14:56:46 <Zakim> PhilDay, you wanted to ask Which items are being polled?
14:56:46 <mitch11> q+
14:56:51 <maryjom> ack GreggVan
14:56:59 <ChrisLoiselle> Phil: defer to the queue
14:57:00 <Chuck> q+
14:57:11 <Sam> q+
14:57:15 <mitch11> q-
14:57:26 <maryjom> ack mitch
14:57:26 <ChrisLoiselle> Gregg: This isn't a provision. This would wouldn't be enough, we are providing comments for group who would solve this.
14:57:28 <ChrisLoiselle> q?
14:57:30 <maryjom> ack Chuck
14:57:34 <PhilDay> Shadi: option 10 doesn't say that it may not be possible to solve this SC if you do not have X or Y.
14:57:35 <ChrisLoiselle> Mitch: Gregg stated what I was going to say.
14:57:36 <ChrisLoiselle> q?
14:57:58 <ChrisLoiselle> Chuck: Rules of consensus don't require unanimous consent FYI.
14:57:59 <ChrisLoiselle> q?
14:58:03 <maryjom> ack Sam
14:58:17 <ChrisLoiselle> Sam: I think we are getting in to the hopes vs. what can be supported.
14:58:36 <ChrisLoiselle> ...closed products are closed products for a reason. We need to deal in reality.
14:58:46 <GreggVan> q+
14:58:52 <ChrisLoiselle> Sam: I think we are getting sidetracked on hopes vs. reality.
14:59:19 <ChrisLoiselle> ...closed means there are restrictions.
14:59:29 <ChrisLoiselle> I can't scribe anymore, need to drop for a call. Sorry!
14:59:30 <PhilDay> q?
14:59:36 <PhilDay> scribe+ PhilDay
14:59:51 <bruce_bailey> i am okay with 9d as it appears in doc
14:59:54 <PhilDay> GreggVan: We are not writing the reg, we are just giving some input to other standards bodies for closed
15:00:11 <Sam> q-
15:00:16 <maryjom> ack greg
15:00:36 <PhilDay> maryjom: We will put this to survey again.
15:01:35 <Sam> Thank you Mary Jo!!
15:02:06 <PhilDay> Mary Jo will put out a new survey, and will add some of the discussion into the Google Doc as well
15:02:18 <PhilDay> rrsagent, draft minutes
15:02:20 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2024/06/06-wcag2ict-minutes.html PhilDay
15:02:30 <loicmn> loicmn has left #wcag2ict
15:02:37 <Sam> No meeting tomorrow?
15:02:53 <GreggVan> correct  no meeting
15:02:53 <PhilDay> There is no meeting tomorrow, that is correct Sam
15:03:08 <PhilDay> zakim, bye
15:03:08 <Zakim> leaving.  As of this point the attendees have been bruce_bailey, PhilDay, maryjom, loicmn, Chuck, Mike_Pluke, Devanshu, GreggVan, shadi, Sam, LauraMiller, mitch, FernandaBonnin,
15:03:08 <Zakim> Zakim has left #wcag2ict
15:03:11 <Zakim> ... olivia, Daniel
15:03:21 <Sam> OK.  Thank you again for running the meetings MJ!!!
15:03:39 <maryjom> zakim, end meeting
15:03:59 <maryjom> rrsagent, bye
15:03:59 <RRSAgent> I see no action items