17:04:47 <RRSAgent> RRSAgent has joined #rdf-star
17:04:52 <RRSAgent> logging to https://www.w3.org/2024/02/22-rdf-star-irc
17:04:52 <Zakim> Zakim has joined #rdf-star
17:04:52 <TallTed> all the present, scribe, etc., will need to repeat after the bots arrive
17:04:53 <TallTed> I've invited them
17:04:54 <gtw> present+
17:04:56 <Souri> present+
17:04:58 <gkellogg> present+
17:04:59 <AndyS> present+
17:05:00 <ora> present+
17:05:01 <enrico> present+
17:05:01 <olaf> present+
17:05:04 <ora> chair: ora
17:05:04 <eBremer> present+
17:05:04 <AZ> present+
17:05:05 <niklasl> present+
17:05:10 <tl> present+
17:05:45 <AndyS> scribe olaf
17:05:49 <TallTed> agenda: https://www.w3.org/events/meetings/0a6aa6e3-635c-42c2-baba-938c76b6ef01/20240222T120000/
17:05:50 <agendabot> clear agenda
17:05:50 <agendabot> agenda+ Approval of minutes from the last two meetings: [1]
17:05:50 <agendabot> agenda+ Proposal for next week's discussion [2]
17:05:50 <agendabot> agenda+ Review of open actions, available at [3]
17:05:51 <agendabot> agenda+ Review of pull requests, available at [4]
17:05:53 <agendabot> agenda+ Issue Triage, available at [5]
17:05:56 <agendabot> agenda+ Any Other Business (AOB), time permitting
17:05:59 <TallTed> TallTed has changed the topic to: RDF Star WG - 2024-02-22 agenda: https://www.w3.org/events/meetings/0a6aa6e3-635c-42c2-baba-938c76b6ef01/20240222T120000/
17:06:13 <TallTed> RRSAgent, draft minutes
17:06:15 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2024/02/22-rdf-star-minutes.html TallTed
17:06:19 <TallTed> RRSAgent, make logs public
17:06:47 <TallTed> last meeting: https://www.w3.org/2024/02/16-rdf-star-minutes.html
17:06:48 <olaf> ora: approval of minutes
17:06:49 <TallTed> next meeting: https://www.w3.org/2024/02/23-rdf-star-minutes.html
17:07:10 <olaf> ... first one is the one from Feb.8
17:07:14 <enrico> https://www.w3.org/2024/02/08-rdf-star-minutes.html
17:07:21 <olaf> ... any complaints?
17:07:39 <TallTed> present+
17:07:49 <TallTed> RRSAgent, draft minutes
17:07:51 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2024/02/22-rdf-star-minutes.html TallTed
17:07:59 <olaf> ... No complaints! Approved!
17:08:14 <olaf> ... The second one is the one from Feb.15
17:08:23 <ora> https://www.w3.org/2024/02/15-rdf-star-minutes.html
17:08:24 <AZ> +1 for the minutes of the 8th Feb
17:09:26 <olaf> scribe+
17:09:38 <TallTed> i/approval of minutes/topic: Approval of minutes from the last two meetings: [1]/
17:09:43 <TallTed> Zakim, skip item 1
17:09:43 <Zakim> agendum 1, Approval of minutes from the last two meetings:, skipped
17:10:11 <AZ> +1
17:10:12 <olaf> ora: No comments or worries about Feb.15 minutes, approved as well.
17:10:15 <TallTed> Zakim, open item 2
17:10:15 <Zakim> agendum 2 -- Proposal for next week's discussion -- taken up [from 2 via agendabot]
17:10:25 <TallTed> RRSAgent, draft minutes
17:10:26 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2024/02/22-rdf-star-minutes.html TallTed
17:10:39 <olaf> ora: Ideas for next week's discussion?
17:10:42 <enrico> q+
17:10:47 <doerthe> doerthe has joined #rdf-star
17:10:52 <doerthe> present+
17:10:58 <ora> ack enrico
17:11:00 <TallTed> i/approval of minutes/scribe: olaf/
17:11:07 <TallTed> RRSAgent, draft minutes
17:11:08 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2024/02/22-rdf-star-minutes.html TallTed
17:11:14 <olaf> enrico: I have new version of the semantics
17:11:18 <olaf> ... minimalistic version for option 3
17:11:22 <enrico> Semantics for option 3: https://github.com/w3c/rdf-star-wg/wiki/RDF%E2%80%90star-semantics:-option-3
17:11:32 <olaf> ... we can discuss them tomorrow in the Sem TF meeting
17:11:39 <olaf> q+
17:11:46 <ora> ack olaf
17:11:53 <AndyS> scribe+
17:12:30 <enrico> q+
17:12:30 <AndyS> olaf: RDF concepts PR - (1) what is the name of the predicate (2) triple term in object or object+subject
17:12:45 <ora> ack enrico
17:13:24 <olaf> enrico: I have a basic version for the free version in my semantics doc
17:13:24 <AndyS> enrico - free RDF and best practice / well-formedness condition
17:13:40 <AndyS> scribe-
17:13:53 <TallTed> s/enrico - free/enrico: free/
17:13:53 <TallTed> RRSAgent, draft minutes
17:13:54 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2024/02/22-rdf-star-minutes.html TallTed
17:14:06 <olaf> ora: we may also discuss naming in general (e.g., names for "triple term" and for "occurrence")
17:14:14 <eBremer> for this nameOf predicate, will we have a short hand like "a" for "rdf:type"?
17:14:31 <olaf> AndyS: yes, we should sort out the naming sooner than later
17:14:55 <olaf> ... It frees up frequent changes to the documents
17:15:13 <olaf> ora: Additionally, we can/should do a little status check regarding editors
17:15:20 <AndyS> q+
17:15:23 <olaf> ... so that editors can actually do their work
17:15:25 <ora> ack AndyS
17:15:35 <olaf> AndyS: I am good with that.
17:15:40 <niklasl> The shorthand is in the syntax (<< s p o >> => [] <<(s p o)>> and corresponding annotation form).
17:16:11 <niklasl> I meant => [] :nameOf <<(s p o)>>
17:16:12 <olaf> ... for the SPARQL subgroup, we need to look into the issue of EXISTS
17:16:36 <ora> https://github.com/orgs/w3c/projects/20/views/3
17:16:59 <olaf> ora: We only pchampin's stuff as open actions
17:17:06 <TallTed> s/last meeting:/previous meeting:/
17:17:10 <ora> https://github.com/orgs/w3c/projects/20/views/4
17:17:12 <olaf> ... since he is not here, skip to PRs
17:17:16 <TallTed> RRSAgent, draft minutes
17:17:17 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2024/02/22-rdf-star-minutes.html TallTed
17:17:34 <olaf> q+
17:17:40 <TallTed> Zakim, next item
17:17:40 <Zakim> I see a speaker queue remaining and respectfully decline to close this agendum, TallTed
17:17:58 <AndyS> scribe+
17:18:05 <TallTed> Zakim, close item 3
17:18:05 <Zakim> agendum 3, Review of open actions, available at, closed
17:18:06 <Zakim> I see 5 items remaining on the agenda; the next one is
17:18:06 <Zakim> 2. Proposal for next week's discussion [from 2 via agendabot]
17:18:06 <AndyS> olaf: 2 PR on SPARQL spec
17:18:14 <TallTed> Zakim, close item 2
17:18:14 <Zakim> I see a speaker queue remaining and respectfully decline to close this agendum, TallTed
17:18:34 <AndyS> ... last week, after consensus, did a PR for RDf concepts for option 3.
17:18:36 <TallTed> q?
17:18:39 <TallTed> ack olaf
17:18:40 <TallTed> Zakim, close item 2
17:18:42 <Zakim> agendum 2, Proposal for next week's discussion, closed
17:18:42 <Zakim> I see 4 items remaining on the agenda; the next one is
17:18:42 <Zakim> 4. Review of pull requests, available at [from 4 via agendabot]
17:18:43 <ora> ack olaf
17:18:52 <AndyS> ... discussion happening
17:18:58 <TallTed> Zakim, open item 4
17:18:58 <Zakim> agendum 4 -- Review of pull requests, available at -- taken up [from 4 via agendabot]
17:19:16 <TallTed> RRSAgent, draft minutes
17:19:17 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2024/02/22-rdf-star-minutes.html TallTed
17:19:26 <AndyS> ... descriptive section on in this PR not done. Waiting for formal section to go in.
17:19:44 <AndyS> ... please look at https://github.com/w3c/rdf-concepts/pull/78
17:19:45 <gb> https://github.com/w3c/rdf-concepts/pull/78 -> Pull Request 78 Proposal to adapt the abstract syntax to option 3 (by hartig) [spec:substantive]
17:19:57 <AndyS> scribe-
17:20:12 <olaf> ora: What about the other PRs?
17:21:15 <TallTed> i|since he is not here|topic: Review of pull requests, available at https://github.com/orgs/w3c/projects/20/views/4|
17:21:24 <TallTed> RRSAgent, draft minutes
17:21:25 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2024/02/22-rdf-star-minutes.html TallTed
17:21:42 <olaf> AndyS: These SPARQL PRs are on the test repo
17:22:01 <olaf> gkellogg: these have approval and can be merged
17:22:03 <TallTed> s/agendum 4 -- Review of pull requests, available at -- taken up [from 4 via agendabot]//
17:22:17 <TallTed> RRSAgent, draft minutes
17:22:18 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2024/02/22-rdf-star-minutes.html TallTed
17:22:29 <olaf> ora: okay, seems we can merge them
17:22:40 <olaf> gkellogg: yes, owners should merge them
17:23:12 <olaf> ora: What about the JSON valuespace?
17:23:35 <olaf> gkellogg: We decided to defer until we have sufficient intellectual bandwidth
17:23:45 <TallTed> Zakim, next item
17:23:45 <Zakim> agendum 5 -- Issue Triage, available at -- taken up [from 5]
17:23:49 <ora> https://github.com/orgs/w3c/projects/20/views/5
17:23:49 <olaf> ... they are not critical
17:24:31 <olaf> AndyS: one of them reported from mailing lists
17:24:38 <olaf> q+
17:25:03 <olaf> q-
17:25:14 <olaf> olaf: I have made a PR for that one
17:25:59 <olaf> AndyS: regarding "where are triple terms allowed" - for next week's discussion
17:26:27 <niklasl> ... formerly conflated with triple terms ? ;)
17:26:27 <niklasl> q+ if https://github.com/w3c/rdf-concepts/issues/79 should be in that table
17:26:28 <gb> https://github.com/w3c/rdf-concepts/issues/79 -> Issue 79 Reconsider bidi tags? (by termontwouter) [wr:open]
17:26:44 <niklasl> q+
17:27:24 <niklasl> q-
17:27:30 <niklasl> Found it!
17:27:41 <olaf> ora: everyone, pick up issues from this list!
17:28:08 <olaf> gkellogg: issue 63 is still waiting for some response from the i18n group
17:28:22 <olaf> ora: I will ping Ellison (?) about that
17:28:44 <olaf> AndyS: What is the status of ??code these days?
17:28:54 <olaf> ora: I don't even know what that is.
17:29:09 <tl> s/??code/puny code
17:29:13 <olaf> AndyS: It is a way to encode ... names.
17:29:22 <TallTed> wikipedia says "Punycode is a representation of Unicode with the limited ASCII character subset used for Internet hostnames. Using Punycode, host names containing Unicode characters are transcoded to a subset of ASCII consisting of letters, digits, and hyphens, which is called the letter–digit–hyphen (LDH) subset."
17:29:23 <olaf> ... put seems to be used only in specs.
17:29:39 <olaf> ... Seems time has moved on.
17:30:04 <olaf> gkellogg: regarding issue 69, there was an external comment coming in.
17:30:15 <AndyS> q+
17:30:16 <olaf> ... but we already spent so much time on this
17:30:29 <olaf> ... the comment rejects our proposal
17:30:52 <TallTed> s|issue 69|https://github.com/w3c/rdf-concepts/issues/79 |
17:30:57 <olaf> ... Given that it is an external comment, it requires to be dealt with in some way.
17:31:17 <olaf> ... Put the proposal is a matter of taste.
17:31:37 <niklasl> q+
17:31:54 <olaf> ... Maybe pchampin can take a look into this because he had some documents about it (with Ivan Herman)
17:32:10 <olaf> ora: I will take a look into that one as well.
17:32:21 <ora> ack AndyS
17:32:49 <ora> ack niklasl
17:32:49 <olaf> AndyS: His argument is fine but it starts from a different point. We start from a point where lang.tags already exist.
17:32:56 <olaf> niklasl: I thought the same
17:33:17 <olaf> ... interoperability for people comeing from different directions
17:33:36 <TallTed> RRSAgent, draft minutes
17:33:37 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2024/02/22-rdf-star-minutes.html TallTed
17:34:13 <olaf> ... we also had very comlex language codes in some earlier project
17:34:13 <olaf> ... I have something that might help here
17:34:24 <olaf> ... I would prefer explicit use cases and example that show why this is needed
17:34:35 <olaf> ora: please dig a little deeper in this as well
17:34:40 <olaf> niklasl: will do
17:34:50 <olaf> s/in/into
17:34:59 <TallTed> s/comeing/coming/
17:35:42 <olaf> ora: my suggestion is that everyone takes a look at the issue list prior to meetings
17:36:02 <olaf> ... to see whether there is something that you can pick up
17:36:10 <Souri> s/comlex/complex/
17:36:10 <TallTed> Zakim, next item
17:36:10 <Zakim> agendum 6 -- Any Other Business (AOB), time permitting -- taken up [from agendabot]
17:36:14 <olaf> ... now to 'other business'
17:36:35 <olaf> ora: I have something, namely about the rechartering
17:36:43 <olaf> ... getting an extension to our charter
17:37:06 <olaf> ... pchampin had something about it but he wasn't in the recent chairs' meeting
17:37:08 <TallTed> s/puny code/punycode/
17:37:21 <olaf> ... nothing else anyone?
17:37:22 <TallTed> RRSAgent, draft minutes
17:37:23 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2024/02/22-rdf-star-minutes.html TallTed
17:38:02 <olaf> ... hope to see many of you tomorrow for the Semantics TF meeting
17:38:54 <TallTed> RRSAgent, draft minutes
17:38:55 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2024/02/22-rdf-star-minutes.html TallTed
17:39:31 <TallTed> Zakim, end meeting
17:39:31 <Zakim> As of this point the attendees have been gtw, Souri, gkellogg, AndyS, ora, enrico, olaf, eBremer, AZ, niklasl, tl, TallTed, doerthe
17:39:31 <Zakim> RRSAgent, please draft minutes
17:39:32 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2024/02/22-rdf-star-minutes.html Zakim
17:39:37 <Zakim> I am happy to have been of service, TallTed; please remember to excuse RRSAgent.  Goodbye
17:39:37 <Zakim> Zakim has left #rdf-star
17:39:37 <TallTed> RRSAgent, bye
17:39:37 <RRSAgent> I see no action items
<pchampin> regrets+ ktk
<pchampin> regrets+ pchampin
<pchampin> regrets+ pfps