IRC log of rdf-star on 2024-02-08

Timestamps are in UTC.

16:55:46 [RRSAgent]

RRSAgent has joined #rdf-star

16:55:50 [RRSAgent]

logging to https://www.w3.org/2024/02/08-rdf-star-irc

16:56:21 [ktk]

meeting: RDF-Star WG biweekly meeting

16:56:36 [ktk]

Agenda: https://www.w3.org/events/meetings/0a6aa6e3-635c-42c2-baba-938c76b6ef01/20240208T120000/

16:56:37 [agendabot]

clear agenda

16:56:37 [agendabot]

agenda+ Approval of minutes from the last two meetings: [1]

16:56:37 [agendabot]

agenda+ Proposal for next week's discussion [2]

16:56:37 [agendabot]

agenda+ Charter extension / rechartering

16:56:37 [agendabot]

agenda+ Review of open actions, available at [3]

16:56:40 [agendabot]

agenda+ Review of pull requests, available at [4]

16:56:43 [agendabot]

agenda+ Issue Triage, available at [5]

16:56:45 [agendabot]

agenda+ Any Other Business (AOB), time permitting

16:56:51 [gkellogg]

gkellogg has joined #rdf-star

16:57:09 [ktk]

present+

16:57:20 [AndyS]

present+

16:57:47 [eBremer]

eBremer has joined #rdf-star

16:58:24 [pfps]

pfps has joined #rdf-star

16:58:57 [ktk]

RRSAgent, draft minutes

16:58:59 [RRSAgent]

I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2024/02/08-rdf-star-minutes.html ktk

16:59:04 [ktk]

RRSAgent, make log public

16:59:12 [rubensworks]

rubensworks has joined #rdf-star

16:59:15 [gtw]

present+

16:59:33 [eBremer]

present+

16:59:37 [ora]

ora has joined #rdf-star

17:00:17 [gkellogg]

gkellogg has joined #rdf-star

17:00:22 [rubensworks]

present+

17:00:37 [niklasl]

niklasl has joined #rdf-star

17:00:38 [AndyS]

AndyS has changed the topic to: rdf-star "RDF Star - https://www.w3.org/events/meetings/0a6aa6e3-635c-42c2-baba-938c76b6ef01/20240208T120000/"

17:00:49 [AndyS]

AndyS has changed the topic to: rdf-star RDF Star - https://www.w3.org/events/meetings/0a6aa6e3-635c-42c2-baba-938c76b6ef01/20240208T120000/

17:00:57 [gkellogg]

present+

17:00:58 [TallTed]

present+

17:00:58 [fsasaki]

fsasaki has joined #rdf-star

17:00:59 [ktk]

Scribe: rubensworks:

17:01:01 [ktk]

Scribe: rubensworks

17:01:03 [fsasaki]

present+

17:01:11 [niklasl]

present+

17:01:12 [TallTed]

s/Scribe: rubensworks://

17:01:14 [Tpt]

present+

17:01:24 [TallTed]

RRSAgent, draft minutes

17:01:25 [RRSAgent]

I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2024/02/08-rdf-star-minutes.html TallTed

17:01:31 [ktk]

Regrets: souri, olaf, pchampin

17:01:31 [TallTed]

RRSAgent, make logs public

17:01:41 [AZ]

AZ has joined #rdf-star

17:01:49 [AZ]

present+

17:02:13 [TallTed]

RRSAgent, draft minutes

17:02:15 [RRSAgent]

I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2024/02/08-rdf-star-minutes.html TallTed

17:02:29 [ora]

present+

17:02:33 [ora]

chair: ora

17:03:07 [ora]

scribe: rubensworks

17:03:32 [ktk]

https://www.w3.org/2024/01/25-rdf-star-minutes.html

17:03:35 [rubensworks]

ora: We need to approve 2 sets of minutes.

17:04:02 [pfps]

minutes look fine to me

17:04:03 [TallTed]

previous meeting: https://www.w3.org/2024/02/02-rdf-star-minutes.html

17:04:03 [TallTed]

next meeting: https://www.w3.org/2024/02/15-rdf-star-minutes.html

17:04:08 [TallTed]

Zakim, open item 1

17:04:09 [Zakim]

agendum 1 -- Approval of minutes from the last two meetings: -- taken up [from 1 via agendabot]

17:04:09 [ktk]

PROPOSAL: Approve minutes 2024-01-25

17:04:15 [pfps]

+1

17:04:19 [gkellogg]

0

17:04:20 [rubensworks]

+0

17:04:22 [tl]

+1

17:04:22 [ktk]

+1

17:04:25 [AndyS]

+1

17:04:26 [niklasl]

+1

17:04:26 [ora]

+0

17:04:30 [fsasaki]

+1

17:04:33 [eBremer]

+1

17:04:37 [TallTed]

s|minutes 2024-01-25| minutes 2024-01-25 https://www.w3.org/2024/01/25-rdf-star-minutes.html|

17:04:43 [TallTed]

+1

17:04:44 [AZ]

+0

17:04:54 [ktk]

RESOLUTION: Approve minutes 2024-01-25

17:05:11 [ktk]

https://www.w3.org/2024/02/01-rdf-star-minutes.html

17:05:32 [TallTed]

s|minutes 2024-01-25| minutes 2024-01-25 https://www.w3.org/2024/01/25-rdf-star-minutes.html |

17:06:30 [doerthe]

doerthe has joined #rdf-star

17:06:37 [doerthe]

present+

17:06:44 [pfps]

also look fine to me

17:06:53 [ktk]

PROPOSAL: Approve minutes 2024-02-01

17:06:59 [AZ]

+1

17:06:59 [niklasl]

+1

17:07:00 [ora]

+1

17:07:01 [rubensworks]

+0

17:07:03 [ktk]

+1

17:07:03 [gkellogg]

+1

17:07:04 [TallTed]

+1

17:07:04 [tl]

+1

17:07:04 [eBremer]

+1

17:07:20 [AndyS]

+1

17:07:39 [pfps]

+1

17:07:45 [ktk]

RESOLUTION: Approve minutes 2024-02-01

17:08:26 [ktk]

Zakim, next item

17:08:26 [Zakim]

agendum 2 -- Proposal for next week's discussion -- taken up [from 2]

17:08:57 [TallTed]

s| Approve minutes 2024-02-01| Approve minutes 2024-02-01 https://www.w3.org/2024/02/01-rdf-star-minutes.html

17:09:01 [ora]

q?

17:09:03 [AndyS]

q+

17:09:05 [pfps]

q+

17:09:06 [TallTed]

RRSAgent, draft minutes

17:09:07 [RRSAgent]

I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2024/02/08-rdf-star-minutes.html TallTed

17:09:13 [rubensworks]

ora: Where are we with respect to getting towards a consensus on what we will do in the remainder of this group?

17:09:18 [ora]

ack AndyS

17:09:21 [rubensworks]

... I feel we made a lot of progress in the last few meetings.

17:09:37 [rubensworks]

AndyS: I wrote out implications of approach 2 and 3.

17:09:46 [rubensworks]

... It was in a long e-mail.

17:10:10 [ora]

ack pfps

17:10:13 [niklasl]

https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-star-wg/2024Feb/0005.html

17:10:22 [rubensworks]

pfps: We need to make a choice between option 2 and 3.

17:10:31 [tl]

q+

17:10:42 [rubensworks]

ora: Could we have one final discussion about this next week, and vote on those two?

17:11:05 [rubensworks]

pfps: Minutes of this week should clarify we will make this decision, as it's substantive.

17:11:15 [rubensworks]

gkellogg: We need a resolution on this to make it clear.

17:11:19 [TallTed]

s|https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-star-wg/2024Feb/0005.html|Andy">https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-star-wg/2024Feb/0005.html|Andy's long email https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-star-wg/2024Feb/0005.html

17:11:31 [rubensworks]

ora: We need a good link for people to read the options.

17:11:53 [rubensworks]

AndyS: PA's summary could be linked.

17:12:11 [rubensworks]

tl: Option 1 is still on the table.

17:12:26 [AndyS]

PA's summary doc: https://htmlpreview.github.io/?https://github.com/w3c/rdf-star-wg/blob/main/docs/seeking-consensus-2024-01.html

17:12:40 [rubensworks]

ora: Maybe Thomas can argue next week why it's still on the table.

17:12:55 [rubensworks]

ora: Most other people have converged to option 2 or 3.

17:13:07 [rubensworks]

... We should be able to decide by the end of next meeting.

17:13:31 [ktk]

q+

17:13:31 [rubensworks]

tl: I will prepare this.

17:13:36 [ktk]

ack TallTed

17:13:39 [ktk]

ack tl

17:13:47 [ora]

ack ktk

17:14:14 [rubensworks]

ktk: I can set the agenda tomorrow for next week, so people are aware.

17:14:29 [rubensworks]

ora: AZ also voted for option 1.

17:14:34 [rubensworks]

... Let's put it to rest next week.

17:14:38 [ora]

PROPOSAL: Next week we decide between options #1, #2 and #3

17:14:39 [gb]

https://github.com/w3c/rdf-star-wg/issues/1 -> CLOSED Issue 1 No activity (nor even README) since WG approval in August (by TallTed)

17:14:39 [gb]

https://github.com/w3c/rdf-star-wg/issues/2 -> Issue 2 RDF* in CBOR? (by ChristopherA)

17:14:39 [gb]

https://github.com/w3c/rdf-star-wg/issues/3 -> CLOSED Issue 3 Convert SPARQL specs to ReSpec (by afs) [complete]

17:14:58 [ora]

+1

17:15:01 [gkellogg]

+1

17:15:02 [rubensworks]

+1

17:15:02 [niklasl]

+1

17:15:02 [pfps]

+1

17:15:05 [eBremer]

+1

17:15:07 [AndyS]

+1

17:15:07 [gtw]

+1

17:15:10 [AZ]

+0

17:15:11 [ktk]

+1

17:15:11 [doerthe]

+1

17:15:17 [tl]

+0

17:15:18 [TallTed]

+1

17:15:25 [fsasaki]

+1

17:15:35 [ora]

RESOLUTION: Next week we decide between options 1, 2, and 3

17:15:51 [ktk]

Zakim, next item

17:15:51 [Zakim]

agendum 3 -- Charter extension / rechartering -- taken up [from agendabot]

17:16:07 [rubensworks]

ktk: This topic came up 2 weeks ago.

17:16:35 [rubensworks]

... I remember hearing if you're not nearly done by January, it is not realistic to end by the charter deadline August.

17:16:45 [rubensworks]

ora: It's safe to start the rechartering.

17:17:17 [rubensworks]

... It doesn't need to be a big deal.

17:17:34 [rubensworks]

... We will need to vote on it.

17:18:23 [rubensworks]

ora: ktk and I will pick up the topic of rechartering in the next chairs meeting.

17:18:31 [ktk]

Zakim, next item

17:18:31 [Zakim]

agendum 4 -- Review of open actions, available at -- taken up [from 3]

17:19:13 [TallTed]

RRSAgent, draft minutes

17:19:14 [RRSAgent]

I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2024/02/08-rdf-star-minutes.html TallTed

17:19:51 [rubensworks]

AndyS: Do we need to add living standard option to the rechartering at this point?

17:20:14 [rubensworks]

gkellogg: We want to include the SPARQL SEPs for example.

17:20:34 [rubensworks]

... Some things feel left unfinished (e.g. lists).

17:20:45 [pfps]

q+

17:20:53 [ora]

ack pfps

17:20:53 [rubensworks]

ora: I don't know, but we need to check.

17:21:03 [rubensworks]

pfps: Also check if the maintenance group can fix errors in specs.

17:21:14 [rubensworks]

... Maybe we can not fix all of them in this group.

17:21:16 [gkellogg]

q+

17:21:23 [ora]

ack gkellogg

17:22:04 [rubensworks]

gkellogg: JSON-LD has been in maintenance mode for some time and has been doing substantive work on the specs, but hasn't released updates on that. There is a complicated process. But I believe it could. But don't think it will until RDF 1.2 is done due to dependencies.

17:22:07 [TallTed]

s|https://github.com/w3c/rdf-star-wg/issues/3 -> CLOSED Issue 3 Convert SPARQL specs to ReSpec (by afs) [complete]||

17:22:07 [TallTed]

s|https://github.com/w3c/rdf-star-wg/issues/2 -> Issue 2 RDF* in CBOR? (by ChristopherA)||

17:22:07 [TallTed]

s|https://github.com/w3c/rdf-star-wg/issues/1 -> CLOSED Issue 1 No activity (nor even README) since WG approval in August (by TallTed)||

17:22:08 [TallTed]

s|PROPOSAL: Next week we decide between options #1, #2 and #3|PROPOSAL: Next week we decide between options 1, 2 and 3

17:22:21 [TallTed]

RRSAgent, draft minutes

17:22:23 [RRSAgent]

I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2024/02/08-rdf-star-minutes.html TallTed

17:22:50 [rubensworks]

gkellogg: I believe the JSON-LD maintenance group is chartered to do that. Philip might now.

17:23:21 [ktk]

Open actions: https://github.com/orgs/w3c/projects/20/views/3

17:23:33 [gkellogg]

s/Philip/Phillipe/

17:23:51 [rubensworks]

ktk: Since PA is not here, we can go to the next one.

17:23:51 [ktk]

zakim, next item

17:23:51 [Zakim]

agendum 5 -- Review of pull requests, available at -- taken up [from 4]

17:23:55 [TallTed]

s/agendum 4 -- Review of open actions, available at -- taken up [from 3]//

17:24:12 [ktk]

Open pull requests https://github.com/orgs/w3c/projects/20/views/4

17:25:04 [rubensworks]

AndyS: 134 is from Olaf, can go in, everyone has agreed.

17:25:34 [rubensworks]

ora: Don't think we'll discuss mobile phones one now.

17:25:48 [rubensworks]

gkellogg: The 2 for Turtle are just corrections to examples.

17:25:55 [ora]

q?

17:26:08 [TallTed]

+1 merge turtle/53 and turtle/54

17:26:11 [rubensworks]

... They have been open long enough.

17:26:24 [rubensworks]

ora: What about 35?

17:26:54 [rubensworks]

AndyS: That's just a correction by what's already there.

17:27:18 [rubensworks]

... I'll merge that one.

17:28:05 [rubensworks]

Tpt: Some PRs for new spec tests for things in previous SPARQL spec versions that were not properly tested.

17:28:34 [rubensworks]

AndyS: These follow the CG merging approach, as it's not related to this WG.

17:29:04 [rubensworks]

AndyS: The whitespace PR is based on PA's consensus document.

17:29:39 [rubensworks]

ora: I see no reason to not merge those.

17:30:06 [rubensworks]

ora: Anything else?

17:30:15 [ktk]

zakim, next item

17:30:15 [Zakim]

agendum 6 -- Issue Triage, available at -- taken up [from 5]

17:30:18 [gkellogg]

q+

17:30:20 [ktk]

Issue Triage: https://github.com/orgs/w3c/projects/20/views/5

17:30:25 [ora]

ack gkellogg

17:30:35 [rubensworks]

gkellogg: There are 9 issues that have proposed-closing tag for some time.

17:31:08 [rubensworks]

pfps: I went through most of the issues 2 weeks ago, and some of them are from that.

17:31:33 [rubensworks]

ora: Anyone disagree with closing them?

17:31:55 [rubensworks]

ora: Let's close then.

17:32:14 [pfps]

q+

17:32:34 [ora]

ack pfps

17:32:52 [rubensworks]

pfps: At the bottom of the list are issues that I was not sure about how to categorize. Could someone look at them?

17:34:10 [rubensworks]

ora: What about the use case issues?

17:34:27 [rubensworks]

pfps: Every use case is an issue. Not sure what to do about them. We can consider them inert for now.

17:34:45 [rubensworks]

... There is also no real harm in closing them. I'll look at them.

17:36:22 [rubensworks]

AndyS: It may be useful to exclude the rdf-test ones, as they are unrelated.

17:37:58 [ktk]

q?

17:38:13 [ktk]

zakim, next item

17:38:13 [Zakim]

agendum 7 -- Any Other Business (AOB), time permitting -- taken up [from agendabot]

17:38:21 [rubensworks]

ora: AOB?

17:38:32 [pfps]

q+

17:38:38 [ora]

ack pfps

17:39:04 [rubensworks]

pfps: SPARQL errors: we should look at the list to see if we can knock some of those off.

17:39:32 [rubensworks]

AndyS: I think we will find more time if the reification issue is resolved.

17:39:55 [rubensworks]

AndyS: The main one is EXISTS and should be taken care off.

17:40:20 [rubensworks]

pfps: Is there an issue specific to that one?

17:40:28 [rubensworks]

AndyS: Yes, but I don't know which one.

17:41:41 [rubensworks]

... It's 75.

17:42:15 [TallTed]

RRSAgent, draft minutes

17:42:17 [RRSAgent]

I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2024/02/08-rdf-star-minutes.html TallTed

17:42:56 [AndyS]

https://github.com/w3c/sparql-query/issues/130

17:42:57 [gb]

https://github.com/w3c/sparql-query/issues/130 -> Issue 130 Criteria for evaluating errata changes for EXISTS (by afs) [spec:bug]

17:44:09 [rubensworks]

ora: AOOB?

17:44:19 [rubensworks]

AndyS: Semantics TF tomorrow?

17:45:11 [rubensworks]

ora: Olaf and Suri are at the Daghstuhl.

17:45:25 [rubensworks]

ora: I hope to see you tomorrow at the semantics meeting.

17:45:32 [rubensworks]

... We can adjourn.

17:46:14 [pfps]

pfps has left #rdf-star

17:46:27 [TallTed]

RRSAgent, draft minutes

17:46:28 [RRSAgent]

I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2024/02/08-rdf-star-minutes.html TallTed

17:47:04 [ora]

TallTed, thanks for handling all the minutes minutiae [sp?]

17:48:31 [TallTed]

every little bit helps :-)

19:54:16 [TallTed]

RRSAgent, draft minutes

19:54:17 [RRSAgent]

I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2024/02/08-rdf-star-minutes.html TallTed

19:54:54 [TallTed]

Zakim, end meeting

19:54:54 [Zakim]

As of this point the attendees have been ktk, AndyS, gtw, eBremer, rubensworks, gkellogg, TallTed, fsasaki, niklasl, Tpt, AZ, ora, doerthe

19:54:54 [Zakim]

RRSAgent, please draft minutes

19:54:55 [RRSAgent]

I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2024/02/08-rdf-star-minutes.html Zakim

19:55:00 [Zakim]

I am happy to have been of service, TallTed; please remember to excuse RRSAgent. Goodbye

19:55:00 [Zakim]

Zakim has left #rdf-star

19:55:19 [TallTed]

RRSAgent, bye

19:55:19 [RRSAgent]

I see no action items