13:02:09 <RRSAgent> RRSAgent has joined #wot
13:02:13 <RRSAgent> logging to https://www.w3.org/2024/02/07-wot-irc
13:02:14 <kaz> meeting: WoT-WG/IG
13:02:23 <luca_barbato> luca_barbato has joined #wot
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13:03:57 <kaz> present+ Kaz_Ashimura, Sebastian_Kaebisch, Kunihiko_Toumura, Luca_Barbato, Michael_Koster, Tomoaki_Mizshima, Michael_McCool
13:04:09 <kaz> chair: Sebastian, Koster, McCool
13:04:18 <kaz> present+ Ege_Korkan
13:04:32 <sebastian> sebastian has joined #wot
13:04:35 <kaz> agenda: https://www.w3.org/WoT/IG/wiki/Main_WoT_WebConf#7_February_2024
13:04:59 <McCool_> McCool_ has joined #wot
13:05:45 <mjk> mjk has joined #wot
13:07:28 <kaz> present+ David_Ezell
13:08:00 <dezell> dezell has joined #wot
13:08:09 <kaz> q+
13:08:23 <Ege> topic: Agenda
13:08:26 <kaz> ack k
13:08:32 <Ege> sk: (shows the agenda)
13:08:36 <Ege> topic: Minutes Review
13:08:43 <dezell> present+ David_Ezell
13:08:45 <kaz> -> https://www.w3.org/2024/01/31-wot-minutes.html Jan-31
13:08:45 <Ege> sk: We reviewed in chairs call, there were no issues
13:09:22 <Ege> sk: approved
13:10:18 <Ege> topic: Quick Updates
13:10:26 <Ege> mm: I have archived the main page wiki
13:11:00 <Ege> sk: I was invited to W3C in Europe
13:11:02 <kaz> i/I have/subtopic: Wiki updates/
13:11:12 <kaz> i/invited/subtopic: W3C in Europe/
13:11:22 <Ege> ... there is the agenda available. It was yesterday
13:11:27 <Ege> ... I had a presentation about WoT
13:12:13 <kaz> i|I was|-> https://www.w3.org/events/meetings/6e0d77c5-06a4-47c5-a282-b44bdf1d7849/ Agenda|
13:12:19 <kaz> rrsagent, make log public
13:12:21 <Ege> ... it was high level
13:12:24 <kaz> rrsagent, draft miutes
13:12:24 <RRSAgent> I'm logging. I don't understand 'draft miutes', kaz.  Try /msg RRSAgent help
13:12:27 <kaz> s/rrsagent, draft miutes//
13:12:31 <kaz> rrsagent, draft minutes
13:12:33 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2024/02/07-wot-minutes.html kaz
13:12:40 <kaz> q+
13:13:04 <Ege> subtopic: Breakout Sessions
13:13:10 <Ege> sk: Kaz can you give an update
13:13:48 <Ege> kaz: as you know, W3C organizes in TPAC. We identified that breakouts are very popular. It would be useful to have them during or before the upcoming AC review
13:14:32 <Ege> ... they will be online only
13:14:45 <Ege> sk: should we organize, as WoT WG, a breakout sessions
13:14:52 <McCool_> q+
13:15:02 <kaz> s/sessions/session?/
13:15:04 <kaz> q?
13:15:06 <Ege> q+
13:15:09 <kaz> ack k
13:15:11 <kaz> q+
13:15:32 <McCool_> ack m
13:16:41 <Ege> ek: they are open to all right?
13:16:42 <Ege> kaz: yes
13:16:50 <dape> dape has joined #wot
13:17:06 <kaz> s/all/all the Members/
13:17:18 <Ege> ek: in that case, it would be good to host big topics, like digital twins and get input from others outside of w3c. Or find synergies with other groups, e.g. solid
13:17:24 <Ege> sk: how should we organize?
13:17:36 <Ege> ... we can submit until end of february
13:17:49 <Ege> ... we can get inputs from the wg for another week and then organize
13:18:03 <kaz> i/how/kaz: yeah, please think about any topics including WoT use cases, possible applications, group collaborations, etc./
13:18:08 <kaz> q+
13:19:34 <Ege> mm: we can collect them in an issue
13:19:35 <Ege> ack e
13:19:54 <kaz> present+ Michael_Lagally
13:19:57 <kaz> q?
13:20:01 <kaz> -> https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Member/chairs/2024JanMar/0023.html announcement on the Chairs list
13:20:05 <mlagally> mlagally has joined #wot
13:20:55 <kaz> s/Chairs list/Chairs list (Member-only)/
13:22:24 <Ege> sk: (adds a link to the issue)
13:23:17 <kaz> -> https://github.com/w3c/wot/issues/1178 Issue 1178 - Collecting ideas for the W3C Breakout Day 2024
13:23:39 <kaz> topic: Meetups
13:23:42 <kaz> subtopic: WoT CG
13:24:04 <kaz> ek: Feb 25 on Microsopes
13:24:16 <kaz> ... three more planned
13:24:18 <kaz> s/25/15/
13:24:25 <Ege> subtopic: WoT JP CG
13:24:33 <Ege> tm: we held a smart city event
13:24:35 <kaz> i/Feb/scribenick: kaz/
13:24:45 <kaz> i/we held/scribenick: Ege/
13:24:50 <kaz> rrsagent, draft minutes
13:24:51 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2024/02/07-wot-minutes.html kaz
13:25:22 <kaz> q+
13:25:45 <kaz> ack k
13:26:00 <kaz> q+
13:26:51 <kaz> ack k
13:26:58 <Ege> kaz: I gave a presentation, similar content to the Nordic CG meeting
13:27:03 <kaz> q?
13:27:05 <kaz> q+
13:27:08 <kaz> ack k
13:27:53 <kaz> present+ Daniel_Peintner
13:28:25 <mjk_> mjk_ has joined #wot
13:28:27 <kaz> present+ Mahda_Noura
13:28:50 <Ege> subtopic: Other Events
13:29:04 <Ege> sk: Ege and Cristiano will talk about node-wot in a developer conference
13:29:13 <Ege> ... Ege will talk in an HiveMQ event
13:29:20 <Ege> ml: is it online or physical?
13:29:24 <Ege> ek: online
13:29:34 <Ege> topic: Cancellations
13:29:53 <Ege> sk: Chinese new year and holidays in germany. I am not available. Some calls are cancelled
13:30:08 <kaz> i|Chinese|-> https://www.w3.org/WoT/IG/wiki/Main_WoT_WebConf#Cancellations_and_Schedule_Updates Cancellations|
13:30:14 <kaz> rrsagent, draft minutes
13:30:15 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2024/02/07-wot-minutes.html kaz
13:30:24 <Ege> sk: anything but td and marketing are cancelled
13:32:03 <mlagally> q+
13:32:33 <Ege> topic: Schedule
13:32:41 <kaz> -> https://github.com/w3c/wot/blob/main/planning/schedule.md schedule.md
13:32:52 <Ege> ml: is this for all deliverables? Profile has different dates afaik
13:33:01 <Ege> sk: we should discuss profile separately
13:33:54 <kaz> q+
13:33:58 <kaz> ack ml
13:35:07 <kaz> ack k
13:35:23 <dezell> dezell has joined #wot
13:35:25 <Ege> q+
13:35:48 <kaz> kaz: @@@
13:36:13 <McCool_> q+
13:36:28 <Ege> https://github.com/w3c/wot-thing-description/pull/1965
13:36:48 <kaz> s/@@@/We need to ask all the TF leads to think about the updated schedule. Regarding the Profile and Architecture, McCool has sent out a call-for-resolution for TF leads message, and we should wrap up that discussion first./
13:36:57 <kaz> q+
13:38:47 <kaz> ack e
13:38:48 <kaz> ack m
13:39:01 <Ege> topic: Versioning
13:39:20 <Ege> ek: I have prepared a PR and we will discuss this in the tomorrow's td call
13:39:48 <kaz> kaz: @@@
13:40:02 <kaz> s/kaz: @@@//
13:40:19 <Ege> mm: discovery will follow TD but we had similar issues as TM Ontology
13:40:20 <kaz> kaz: @@@
13:41:00 <kaz> s/@@@/we need to have some more discussion tomorrow, and then will bring the status back to the main call in two weeks./
13:41:44 <kaz> topic: Actionable Roadmap for TD
13:41:57 <mlagally> q+
13:42:02 <kaz> ack k
13:42:28 <kaz> -> https://github.com/w3c/wot/pull/1176 PR 1176 - First actionable roadmap
13:42:30 <kaz> q+
13:42:40 <Ege> topic: First actionable roadmap for TD
13:43:22 <Ege> ek: it is a PR that puts the non UC items into an order
13:43:23 <Ege> q+
13:43:35 <kaz> s/topic: First actionable roadmap for TD//
13:43:50 <Ege> ml: we have requirements about geolocation. When can we incorporate them into the TD spec?
13:43:59 <kaz> s/topic: Actionable Roadmap for TD/topic: First actionable roadmap for TD/
13:44:26 <Ege> mm: we also have a use case about dynamic TDs or not
13:44:33 <Ege> ml: But where is it in the roadmap
13:44:56 <sebastian> qß
13:44:58 <sebastian> q?
13:45:27 <kaz> s/qß//
13:45:39 <kaz> ack ml
13:45:41 <kaz> ack e
13:45:57 <McCool_> q+
13:47:25 <kaz> ack k
13:47:45 <Ege> kaz: this is a task force report, we should discuss this later
13:48:08 <Ege> mm: this affects discovery as well, it can be used as a test for the use case process
13:48:23 <Ege> +1 on mm
13:49:12 <McCool_> ack m
13:49:16 <kaz> s/we should discuss this later/We should have discussed this as part of the TD TF report. For today, it's just that we can discuss proposals on use case handling, etc., when we get input from TD TF based on this work./
13:50:00 <Ege> q+ to talk about marketing
13:50:03 <kaz> rrsagent, draft minutes
13:50:04 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2024/02/07-wot-minutes.html kaz
13:50:10 <Ege> topic: TF Reports
13:50:17 <kaz> subtopic: Scripting API
13:50:53 <Ege> dp: we will not have a scripting call next week. One topic was relationship to TD TF.
13:51:32 <Ege> ... other was about data schema. JR found that some affordances do not have the type term so it breaks the algorithm
13:52:43 <mjk> q?
13:52:55 <Ege> sk: there is also a semantic api discussion but I will provide a use case
13:53:11 <kaz> subtopic: Security/Discovery
13:53:28 <kaz> (suspended)
13:53:34 <kaz> subtopic: Marketing
13:54:08 <Ege> https://github.com/w3c/wot-marketing/pull/476
13:55:17 <Ege> ek: mastodon is working very well
13:55:25 <Ege> ... also we have a repository template proposal
13:55:33 <Ege> subtopic: Use Cases
13:55:40 <Ege> tm: we talked about the template but there are issues
13:55:46 <Ege> ... we need to discuss those issues
13:56:03 <McCool_> q+
13:56:17 <Ege> ack e
13:56:18 <Zakim> Ege, you wanted to talk about marketing
13:56:25 <McCool_> ack m
13:56:28 <Ege> tm: we will talk about them in two weeks
13:57:13 <Ege> https://github.com/w3c/wot/blob/main/registry-analysis/Readme.md
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13:59:12 <McCool_> q+
13:59:32 <Ege> ek: in td, we discussed the overall process of use cases etc.
13:59:43 <Ege> ... also finished the registry analysis, learned a lot as TF
13:59:47 <dape> q+
14:00:00 <Ege> ... and labeled 200 out of 250 issues whether there is a use case potential
14:00:07 <dape> ack dape
14:00:24 <Ege> mm: bf has expressed but cannot dedicate enough time
14:01:02 <kaz> i/bf has/subtopic: Profile/
14:01:17 <McCool_> proposal: Restart the Profiles TF with Luca Barbato as TF Lead.
14:01:23 <kaz> i|bf has|-> https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Member/member-wot-wg/2024Jan/0002.html Call for Task Leads|
14:01:32 <McCool_> proposal: Restart the Profiles TF immediately with Luca Barbato as TF Lead.
14:01:42 <sebastian> +1
14:02:01 <kaz> s/enough time/enough time while we have another volunteer, Luca./
14:02:14 <mlagally> +1
14:03:09 <McCool_> proposal: Restart the Profiles TF immediately with Luca Barbato as TF Lead.
14:03:30 <McCool_> resolution: Restart the Profiles TF immediately with Luca Barbato as TF Lead.
14:04:05 <mlagally> q+
14:04:13 <McCool_> ack mc
14:04:14 <kaz> q+
14:05:09 <mlagally> q-
14:05:09 <kaz> action: kaz to work with Luca to create a doodle poll
14:05:17 <kaz> ack k
14:11:16 <McCool_> topic: IG Charter Discussion
14:11:44 <McCool_> mk: small number of things to clean up
14:12:15 <McCool_> ... Ege is not here, may want to discuss relationships.md and how it relates
14:12:24 <McCool_> subtopic: PR #145
14:13:01 <McCool_> https://github.com/w3c/wot-charter-drafts/pull/145
14:13:22 <kaz> q?
14:13:39 <kaz> s|https://github.com/w3c/wot-charter-drafts/pull/145|-> https://github.com/w3c/wot-charter-drafts/pull/145 wot-charter-drafts PR 145 - Fixes to charter draft|
14:14:07 <McCool_> mm: is the Marketing TF part of the IG or the WG?
14:15:40 <McCool_> ... wording change makes it a little unclear
14:15:49 <McCool_> mk: similar issue for Use Case TF
14:16:58 <kaz> q+
14:17:15 <mjk> q?
14:17:23 <McCool_> mm: suggest we define this somewhere, maybe at the start of the scope section?
14:18:05 <McCool_> kaz: suggest "through the Marketing Task Force" is too much detail for the summary box anyway
14:18:16 <McCool_> mm: agree, that is simpler
14:18:25 <McCool_> mk: ok, will implement that change
14:18:54 <McCool_> ... (updates PR as suggested)
14:20:22 <kaz> -> https://htmlpreview.github.io/?https://github.com/w3c/wot-charter-drafts/blob/8fad403a9c9be00668d6abaaae1c6b2cfdb25b0d/wot-ig-2023-draft.html HTML Preview
14:20:31 <kaz> q+
14:23:12 <kaz> ack k
14:23:47 <McCool_> mk: looks like "Marketing Task Force" is mentioned later, "as mentioned in scope"
14:24:00 <McCool_> mk: so we do need a sentence to define them
14:24:07 <McCool_> mk: (merges PR)
14:24:21 <McCool_> mk: let's add that sentence now...
14:25:40 <McCool_> mm: I propose the sentence "The work on the use cases and marketing is done in the Use Cases Task Force and Marketing Task Force, respectively."
14:26:22 <McCool_> mm: I propose the sentence "The work on the use cases and management of public appearance will be performed in the Use Cases Task Force and Marketing Task Force, respectively."
14:31:10 <McCool_> mk: make PR - will merge immediately, highlight for discussion
14:31:34 <McCool_> ... https://github.com/w3c/wot-charter-drafts/pull/146
14:32:20 <McCool_> subtopic: PR #144
14:32:23 <kaz> s|... https://github.com/w3c/wot-charter-drafts/pull/146|-> ... https://github.com/w3c/wot-charter-drafts/pull/146 wot-charter-drafts PR 146 - Define task forces|
14:32:26 <McCool_> mk: this PR just fixes typos
14:32:33 <kaz> s/#144/(merged)/
14:32:42 <McCool_> https://github.com/w3c/wot-charter-drafts/pull/144
14:32:51 <kaz> s|https://github.com/w3c/wot-charter-drafts/pull/144||
14:33:15 <kaz> i|this PR|-> https://github.com/w3c/wot-charter-drafts/pull/144 wot-charter-drafts PR 144 - fix: minor typos|
14:33:23 <kaz> rrsagent, draft minutes
14:33:24 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2024/02/07-wot-minutes.html kaz
14:34:19 <McCool_> mk: seems to be a conflict - older version is the correct one (lower case in middle of sentence)
14:34:23 <McCool_> mk: resolved
14:35:09 <McCool_> mk: other change is obvious typo, suggest merging
14:35:13 <McCool_> ... (merged)
14:35:18 <mjk> https://github.com/w3c/wot-charter-drafts/pull/144/
14:36:16 <kaz> q+
14:36:29 <kaz> ack k
14:36:30 <McCool_> subtopic: Other PRs
14:36:46 <kaz> s|https://github.com/w3c/wot-charter-drafts/pull/144/||
14:36:51 <McCool_> mk: agenda had PRs 91 and 92 but they don't seem to be related to the IG charter
14:37:02 <mjk> q?
14:37:12 <McCool_> subtopic: Other IG Charter Issue
14:37:32 <McCool_> mk: three issues left labeled with "IG 2023 Charter"
14:37:43 <kaz> i|three|-> https://github.com/w3c/wot-charter-drafts/issues?q=is%3Aissue+is%3Aopen+label%3A%22IG+2023+Charter%22 Charter Issues|
14:38:04 <McCool_> mk: Issue #128, update charter history, still needs to be done
14:38:29 <McCool_> ... but #122 and #121 relate to scope and background; these are now complete
14:38:35 <kaz> i|Issue #128|subtopic: Issue 128|
14:38:56 <kaz> i|Issue #128|-> https://github.com/w3c/wot-charter-drafts/issues/128 wot-charter-drafts Issue 128 - IG Charter 2023: Update Charter History|
14:39:03 <McCool_> ... will close, if someone wants further changes they can reopen the issue
14:39:19 <kaz> i|but|subtopic: Issue 122 and 121|
14:39:19 <McCool_> ... (closes issues #121 and #122)
14:39:25 <kaz> q+
14:39:31 <McCool_> mk: kaz, were you going to update the charter history?
14:39:46 <McCool_> kaz: yes, once the draft is ready I can update that section
14:39:50 <kaz> ack k
14:40:08 <kaz> s/122 and 121/121 and 122/
14:40:23 <McCool_> subtopic: Other Issues
14:40:30 <McCool_> mk: figure still needs to be updated
14:40:39 <kaz> i|but #122 and #121|on the other hand, #121 and #122|
14:41:10 <kaz> i|relate to|-> https://github.com/w3c/wot-charter-drafts/issues/121 wot-charter-drafts 121 - IG Charter 2023: Update background|
14:41:18 <McCool_> ... and not just a broken link, the figures needs to be updated
14:41:48 <kaz> i|relate to|-> https://github.com/w3c/wot-charter-drafts/issues/122 wot-charter-drafts Issue 122 - IG Charter 2023: Update scope|
14:41:57 <kaz> rrsagent, draft miutes
14:41:57 <RRSAgent> I'm logging. I don't understand 'draft miutes', kaz.  Try /msg RRSAgent help
14:42:01 <kaz> s/rrsagent, draft miutes//
14:42:05 <kaz> rrsagent, draft minutes
14:42:06 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2024/02/07-wot-minutes.html kaz
14:43:23 <McCool_> mm: I think we agreed to make the bottom box say "Other W3C Groups and WoT CGs"
14:43:33 <McCool_> ... the plural in CGs is important
14:45:01 <McCool_> mm: suggest we create an issue for this and agree to execute that change for the draft
14:45:25 <McCool_> ... also suggest we distribute an email calling for a resolution to submit to AC in two weeks.
14:45:39 <McCool_> ... since we have no main call next week
14:45:58 <McCool_> mk: ok, I will do an email, work on that issue
14:46:08 <McCool_> mm: and I assume kaz will do the charter history
14:46:13 <kaz> q+
14:46:26 <kaz> ack k
14:46:45 <McCool_> kaz: we *could* do a resolution by email...
14:47:19 <McCool_> mm: to be fair, do need a final draft and need to give people at least a week to look at it
14:47:35 <McCool_> mk: ok, if we can finish the draft today, that will be Feb 14.
14:48:39 <McCool_> topic: Policy Discussion
14:48:57 <McCool_> mk: let's look at issues and policy
14:52:02 <McCool_> mm: regarding the change to Pr #1128, think we should ask via email if there are any objections to merging, give people a week to comment, same as the IG charter
14:53:15 <kaz> i|regarding|subtopic: PR 1128|
14:53:30 <kaz> i|regarding|-> https://github.com/w3c/wot/pull/1128 PR 1128 - [Policy] Move chair-decision-process.md from "proposals" to "policies"|
14:54:04 <McCool_> mk: let's look at some of the other issues - #1171
14:54:25 <kaz> i|let's|subtopic: Issue 1171|
14:54:40 <kaz> i|let's|-> https://github.com/w3c/wot/issues/1171 Issue 1171 - [Policy Proposal] Invite Expert Selection Procedure|
14:54:45 <kaz> q+
14:55:30 <McCool_> mm: so a few issues here; need to actually be an expert, but also needs to be clear what they are contributing
14:55:42 <kaz> -> https://www.w3.org/invited-experts/ W3C Invited Expert Policy
14:56:15 <McCool_> mm: start with the W3C basic policy, refine
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14:56:43 <McCool_> ... need to also consider we get unsolicited (self-)nominations
14:57:50 <McCool_> kaz: personally think the W3C policy itself is clear enough
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14:59:43 <McCool_> mm: I think the "invitation" policy is clear, but we probably need a "nomination" policy
15:00:03 <kaz> s/enough/enough, but some people misunderstand it and send an application from their side without invitation. So we can think about additional procedure about the review for the IE applications./
15:00:04 <McCool_> mk: also many public entry points that they can contribute, e.g. in the CG
15:00:14 <McCool_> ... use cases, tutorials, etc.
15:00:41 <McCool_> ... in other cases, maybe they are already contributing e.g. by building implementations
15:01:18 <McCool_> mm: unfortunately building an implementation is not enough to motivate contribution to the specs
15:01:40 <McCool_> mk: need in-kind evidence of contribution
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15:02:54 <kaz> [adjourned]
15:03:00 <kaz> rrsagent, draft minutes
15:03:02 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2024/02/07-wot-minutes.html kaz
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15:56:00 <kaz> ack k
15:56:01 <kaz> ack d
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