13:05:41 <RRSAgent> RRSAgent has joined #wot
13:05:45 <RRSAgent> logging to https://www.w3.org/2024/01/24-wot-irc
13:05:48 <kaz> meeting: WoT-WG/IG
13:06:04 <kaz> chair: Koster, McCool, Sebastian
13:06:13 <dape> dape has joined #wot
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13:06:47 <kaz> present+ Kaz_Ashimura, Michael_Koster, Cristiano_Aguzzi, Daniel_Peintner, Ege_Korkan, Michael_McCool, Kunihiko_Toumura, Mahda_Noura, Tetsushi_Matsuda, Tomoaki_Mizushima
13:06:47 <luca_barbato> luca_barbato has joined #wot
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13:09:22 <dezell> present+ David_Ezell
13:10:50 <kaz> q+
13:10:57 <kaz> scribenick: mahda-noura
13:11:00 <mahda-noura> Topic: Main Call Topics
13:11:14 <kaz> subtopic: Guests, New Members, IEs
13:11:20 <Ege> q+
13:11:31 <mahda-noura> mjk: we have an invited expert request
13:12:19 <mahda-noura> kaz: I will contact this person and ask about his interest about the CG, but if contribution for WG is required we need to discuss this in the main call
13:12:21 <kaz> ack k
13:12:30 <mahda-noura> ...we also require a policy for this
13:12:33 <kaz> s/interest about/interest in/
13:12:49 <mjk> q?
13:12:58 <mahda-noura> mjk: we need a policy of their contributions
13:13:12 <kaz> s/...we also require a policy for this/... think we also should clarify this as a policy explicitly./
13:13:14 <mahda-noura> ege: somebody has also approached me for an IE request
13:13:20 <kaz> q+
13:13:22 <kaz> ack e
13:13:35 <kaz> zakim, who is on the call?
13:13:35 <Zakim> Present: Kaz_Ashimura, Michael_Koster, Cristiano_Aguzzi, Daniel_Peintner, Ege_Korkan, Michael_McCool, Kunihiko_Toumura, Mahda_Noura, Tetsushi_Matsuda, Tomoaki_Mizushima,
13:13:38 <Zakim> ... David_Ezell
13:13:44 <mahda-noura> ege: I think there should be a policy document about it
13:14:14 <mjk> q?
13:14:38 <Ege> https://github.com/dtex/j5e seems to be from this guy
13:14:55 <mahda-noura> kaz: there is some basic plicy about IE in general, the WoT working group have been clarifying their additional policy
13:15:36 <mlagally> mlagally has joined #wot
13:15:53 <mlagally> q?
13:15:59 <kaz> ack k
13:16:57 <mahda-noura> kaz: we require the invited expert to make a presentation
13:17:42 <mahda-noura> mm: we need to create an issue for this
13:17:46 <mahda-noura> Ege: will do this
13:17:48 <kaz> present+ Michael_Lagally
13:17:54 <mahda-noura> Topic: Minutes
13:17:57 <kaz> present+ Luca_Barbato
13:18:53 <mahda-noura> mjk: minutes published with no objection
13:18:55 <mlagally> q+
13:18:59 <mahda-noura> Topic: Notices
13:19:05 <kaz> i|minutes|-> https://www.w3.org/2024/01/17-wot-minutes.html Jan-17|
13:19:08 <mahda-noura> mjk: are there any notices?
13:20:01 <mahda-noura> legally: I was asked to write a blog article about the publication REC document, if somebody would be interested to review the draft feel free to let me know
13:20:25 <kaz> s/legally/Lagally:/
13:20:37 <cris___> cris___ has joined #wot
13:21:54 <Ege> Invited Expert issue is created: https://github.com/w3c/wot/issues/1171
13:21:54 <mahda-noura> Topic: Meeting Schedule Changes
13:21:54 <kaz> s|Invited Expert issue is created: https://github.com/w3c/wot/issues/1171||
13:21:54 <mahda-noura> mjk: we have a policy updates today after the main call
13:21:54 <mahda-noura> ...next week a meeting to discuss IG charter
13:21:54 <mahda-noura> Topic: Cancellation
13:22:11 <mahda-noura> mjk: we have some in February but nothing new, the calander has been updated
13:22:14 <kaz> q+
13:22:22 <kaz> ack ml
13:22:30 <mahda-noura> Topic: Rescheduling
13:23:00 <mahda-noura> mjk: security and discovery are currently susspended but will take place again soon
13:23:26 <mlagally> q+
13:24:21 <mahda-noura> kaz: we should add publication schedule as in item to the schedule
13:24:27 <kaz> ack k
13:26:42 <mahda-noura> mlagally: on the publication of the documents can we also add the profile document
13:26:45 <kaz> q+
13:27:20 <mahda-noura> ...we should work on a plan to get this work completed, in Nov there was a conversation about finding a TF for this, there is interest to complete this document
13:27:35 <mahda-noura> ...Luca indicated interest to take TF leadership
13:28:19 <mahda-noura> ...I would be able to attend the call and help Luca with the transition
13:28:50 <mahda-noura> kaz: we still need to talk about the working group planning and clarify which specifications to be worked on
13:31:56 <kaz> q?
13:31:59 <kaz> ack ml
13:32:00 <kaz> ack k
13:32:41 <kaz> q+
13:33:07 <mlagally> proposal: Resume  the profile task force work under new TF chair Luca Barbato on Feb 19th.
13:35:11 <mahda-noura> Topic: Publications
13:35:14 <kaz> q?
13:35:16 <kaz> ack k
13:35:18 <mahda-noura> mjk: anything on publications?
13:35:24 <mahda-noura> (none)
13:35:30 <mahda-noura> Topic: Resources
13:35:43 <kaz> q+
13:35:49 <mahda-noura> mjk: For TD there are still some outstanding items for resources
13:36:14 <mahda-noura> kaz: we have joint discussion in the call tomorrow, we can hear from the discussions later next week
13:36:21 <kaz> ack k
13:36:43 <mahda-noura> Topic: Meetups
13:36:58 <mahda-noura> subtopic: WoT CG
13:37:08 <mahda-noura> mjk: no new update
13:37:14 <kaz> q+
13:37:42 <cris___> q+
13:37:43 <kaz> ack k
13:38:46 <mahda-noura> cris: Ege and I will have a talk on Global summit and we will have a talk on node-wot
13:39:12 <kaz> q+
13:39:16 <mahda-noura> Topic: Liasons:
13:39:18 <kaz> ack c
13:39:20 <kaz> ack k
13:39:23 <mahda-noura> (no specific updated)
13:40:01 <mahda-noura> Topic: TF Reports
13:40:15 <mahda-noura> subtopic: Scripting TF
13:40:17 <cris___> q+
13:41:10 <mahda-noura> cris: we are active and we are working on issues and figure out what we will do, we are finding more user stories and assessing bi-weekly meetings
13:41:12 <kaz> ack c
13:41:50 <mahda-noura> daniel: we also look into improving our support for discovery, but ongoing work
13:42:26 <mahda-noura> subtopic: Security
13:42:27 <kaz> q+
13:42:31 <mjk> q?
13:42:34 <kaz> ack k
13:42:45 <mahda-noura> kaz: this TF is currently susspended
13:42:54 <mahda-noura> ...also discovery
13:43:00 <mahda-noura> subtopic: Marketing
13:43:12 <mahda-noura> (none)
13:43:18 <mahda-noura> subtopic: Use Cases
13:44:12 <mahda-noura> tomoaki: this week i updated the document based on last discussions, and we discussed use case definitions, requirement analysis and gap analysos.
13:44:30 <kaz> rrsagent, make log public
13:44:33 <kaz> rrsagent, draft minutes
13:44:34 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2024/01/24-wot-minutes.html kaz
13:44:50 <mahda-noura> mjk: any other discussion on the use cases?
13:44:54 <mahda-noura> (none)
13:44:56 <kaz> q+
13:45:03 <mahda-noura> subtopic: Plugfest/Testing
13:45:43 <MIzushima_> MIzushima_ has joined #wot
13:45:48 <mahda-noura> kaz: maybe in the wiki we can add suspend in the TF that are currently not active
13:45:58 <mahda-noura> ...architecture is also not active
13:46:45 <mahda-noura> subtopic: TD
13:47:30 <mahda-noura> mjk: we talked about the use cases, we split the meeting into two sessions
13:47:40 <kaz> present+ David_Ezell
13:47:42 <kaz> rrsagent, draft minutes
13:47:44 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2024/01/24-wot-minutes.html kaz
13:48:47 <mjk> q?
13:48:48 <kaz> q?
13:48:50 <kaz> ack k
13:48:58 <kaz> q+
13:49:47 <kaz> ack k
13:50:38 <kaz> [10-min break]
13:50:43 <kaz> rrsagent, draft minutes
13:50:44 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2024/01/24-wot-minutes.html kaz
14:02:22 <kaz> present+ Sebastian_Kaebisch
14:02:38 <sebastian> sebastian has joined #wot
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14:04:01 <mjk> scribenick: mjk
14:04:24 <mjk> seb: opening the session on WG planning
14:05:22 <mjk> ... policies, project management, Berlin event, TF sustaining
14:05:43 <mjk> s/policies/Topics are policies/
14:05:51 <mjk> ... any other topics?
14:06:08 <mjk> seb: topic: policies
14:06:54 <mjk> ... review of github issues
14:06:58 <sebastian> https://github.com/w3c/wot/tree/main/policies
14:07:52 <mjk> ... summarizes process for policies
14:08:24 <mjk> ... starting with a proposal for a policy and a github issue to motivate and track
14:08:42 <mjk> subtopic: issue #1171
14:08:56 <kaz> i/opening the/topic: WG Planning/
14:08:57 <kaz> q+
14:10:14 <mjk> kaz: earlier today we discussed the IE policy and this issue captures the points from that discussion
14:10:38 <mjk> kaz: will write up more
14:10:40 <kaz> i|earlier|-> https://github.com/w3c/wot/issues/1171 Issue 1171 - [Policy Proposal] Invite Expert Selection Procedure|
14:10:48 <kaz> s/more/more as a PR/
14:11:10 <mjk> subtopic: Issue #1168 - policy on assertion IDs
14:11:49 <mjk> seb: this makes sense to have a well known encoding of IDs
14:12:05 <kaz> i|this makes|-> https://github.com/w3c/wot/issues/1168 Issue 1168 - WoT-wide general policy on assertion ids|
14:12:14 <kaz> rrsagent, draft minutes
14:12:15 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2024/01/24-wot-minutes.html kaz
14:12:37 <mjk> seb: we could align with an RDF namespace
14:13:02 <mjk> ... are there any comments on this?
14:13:12 <kaz> q+
14:13:31 <kaz> ack k
14:13:37 <mjk> kaz: we can start with the current process
14:13:55 <mjk> ... from Architecture, Discovery, and TD
14:14:04 <kaz> s/process/practices/
14:14:15 <mjk> seb: is there a document?
14:14:49 <mjk> kaz: no, we need to clarify what we have been doing, McCool and Ege could help
14:15:07 <mjk> mm: what we have been doing is random
14:15:51 <mjk> mm: we should get the IDs cleaned up before we start another round
14:15:54 <kaz> q?
14:15:56 <kaz> q+
14:16:31 <mjk> seb: discovered an issue with the links and name conflicts
14:16:46 <dape> q+
14:16:50 <mjk> mm: also issue with terms not matching descriptions in ontologies
14:17:39 <mjk> kaz: so we should start with the current scheme and improve from there
14:18:07 <mjk> dape: There is a respec issue we could fix by patching the HTML to resolve the link issue
14:18:08 <dape> ack dape
14:18:27 <Ege> q+
14:18:30 <kaz> ack k
14:19:09 <mjk> ege: IDs aren't random per se, they are assigned by the spec editors
14:19:42 <mjk> ... alignment with RDF namespaces can be done but there are other issues
14:20:15 <mjk> seb: we didn't mean random IDs but rather not well managed
14:20:32 <mjk> seb: can we get a proposal?
14:20:37 <kaz> q+
14:20:44 <mjk> ege: I can make some suggestions
14:21:10 <mjk> kaz: starting with the current TD approach and refined from there
14:22:10 <mjk> subtopic: Issue # 1166 - Versioning Resources
14:22:34 <mjk> mm: we need to figure out a version scheme for recources
14:22:55 <dape> q+
14:22:56 <mjk> ... we plan to discuss it in the TD meeting tomorrow (Thursday)
14:23:35 <kaz> i|we need|-> https://github.com/w3c/wot/issues/1166 Issue 1166 - [Policy Proposal] Versioning Resources|
14:24:25 <dape> ack dape
14:24:28 <mjk> dape: We have an issue that it's not easy to point to a specific version of all resources and artifacts
14:24:30 <kaz> ack e
14:24:31 <kaz> ack k
14:24:40 <kaz> q+ McCool
14:24:47 <kaz> q+ mahda-noura
14:24:47 <mjk> ... and use semantic versioning
14:25:10 <kaz> q?
14:25:12 <kaz> ack m
14:25:13 <kaz> acm m
14:25:42 <kaz> rrsagent, draft minutes
14:25:43 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2024/01/24-wot-minutes.html kaz
14:26:10 <mjk> mahda: all resources and documents need to be versioned
14:26:39 <mjk> subtopic: Issue #1117 - Roles and Responsibilities
14:26:57 <kaz> -> https://github.com/w3c/wot/issues/1117 Issue 1117 - [Policy Proposal] Roles and responsibilities within the WG/IG #1117
14:27:01 <kaz> s/ #1117//
14:27:04 <kaz> rrsagent, draft minutes
14:27:05 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2024/01/24-wot-minutes.html kaz
14:27:11 <mjk> seb: we should put roles and responsibilities in one place
14:27:23 <mjk> ... started to create a document collecting these
14:27:59 <kaz> q+
14:28:03 <mjk> ... any comments or questions?
14:28:04 <mjk> q?
14:28:16 <McCool_> ack m
14:28:53 <kaz> ack k
14:30:03 <TallTed> TallTed has joined #wot
14:30:04 <mjk> kaz: will we consolidate the policies into a single document?
14:30:23 <mjk> seb: some of these roles are already defines by W3C
14:30:47 <mjk> kaz: it will be good to have this all consolidated
14:31:00 <mjk> seb: any other policy items?
14:31:10 <mjk> topic: Project Management
14:31:24 <Ege> q+
14:31:32 <mjk> seb: there is a proposal from Ege
14:32:17 <mjk> ... categories are proposed to sort issues
14:32:25 <kaz> q+
14:33:19 <mjk> ... the proposal is to assign issues and track progress
14:33:19 <mjk> ... it's a standard process for software development
14:33:41 <mjk> ... personally like this approach, and we are already doing some of this process
14:33:50 <mjk> ... this would make it more formal
14:35:20 <mjk> ege: proposal is to align with the use case pipeline
14:36:45 <mjk> kaz: there should be 2 layers of process management, there is a higher level of use case management to lower level of concrete tasks
14:37:28 <kaz> -> https://github.com/w3c/wot-usecases/blob/main/Process.md Mizushima's high-level process
14:37:41 <kaz> s/process/process proposal/
14:38:00 <mjk> ... the higher level is from the use case discussion and documented in the process.md document
14:38:27 <mjk> seb: the high level includes gap analysis, etc.
14:38:43 <mjk> ... this goes hand in hand with the development process
14:39:10 <sebastian> q?
14:39:14 <kaz> ack e
14:39:15 <kaz> ack k
14:39:34 <kaz> q+
14:39:37 <mjk> seb: what is the next step? Is there a new policy?
14:40:18 <kaz> ack k
14:40:25 <mjk> kaz: The use case TF and TD TF should continue to work on both levels until February and work toward convergence
14:40:42 <mjk> ... not necessarily a new policy
14:41:04 <MIzushima_> +1
14:41:51 <mjk> seb: The project management proposals are already merged
14:42:28 <kaz> q+
14:42:30 <mjk> subtopic: Issue # 1170
14:43:28 <mjk> kaz: this is a reminder that we need to continue to work on how to describe liaisons and collaboration
14:43:55 <mjk> ... Kaz can generate a basic template if it's OK with the chairs
14:44:01 <mjk> seb: yes, please
14:44:18 <kaz> action: kaz to generate an initial template for liaison/collab
14:44:26 <mjk> kaz: assign to me (Kaz)
14:44:58 <mjk> subtopic: Issue # 1167
14:45:38 <kaz> q+
14:45:47 <mjk> ege: there is overlap between the Use Case document and the Architecture document
14:46:01 <mjk> ... Similar high level content
14:46:17 <kaz> i|this is a|-> https://github.com/w3c/wot/issues/1170 Issue 1170 - Liaison and Collaboration for WoT 2.0 Charter|
14:46:22 <mjk> ... we need to align this in some way
14:46:55 <mjk> ... we need to make it clear to outside readers
14:48:08 <mjk> seb: there are some other questions about the Architecture document we also need to clarify
14:49:01 <kaz> q?
14:49:12 <mjk> ... Also agree we need to consolidate the content
14:49:47 <mjk> kaz: agree, and what is more important is the Use Case TF reviews all of the use cases
14:51:29 <mjk> s/cases/cases, including the ones in the Architecture document, so we don't miss any important use cases
14:51:36 <Ege> q+
14:51:37 <kaz> ack k
14:52:16 <MIzushima_> q+
14:52:24 <mjk> ege: we need to agree on the purpose of the Architecture and Use Case documents and eliminate the overlap
14:52:31 <kaz> ack e
14:53:12 <kaz> q+
14:54:28 <mjk> miz: the use cases in the Architecture document are different and we need to include both
14:55:09 <Ege> q+
14:55:24 <mjk> seb: The architecture document is a snapshot of use cases
14:56:42 <mjk> kaz: we should discuss this in the Architecture meeting and see if there is anything needed to contribute to use cases
14:56:59 <Ege> ack m
14:56:59 <Ege> ack k
14:57:06 <mjk> ... we need a collaborative discussion including both TFs
14:57:12 <kaz> ack k
14:57:51 <mjk> ege: Architecture content can be included in the UCR document as a generic introduction
14:58:23 <McCool_> time check - 2m left
14:58:32 <kaz> q+
14:58:41 <mjk> ... The architecture document can focus on architecture
14:59:40 <mjk> mm: we should decide priorities of task forces and spin up the high priority ones
15:00:17 <mjk> seb: suggest that we continue this discussion in the main call next week
15:00:33 <kaz> q?
15:00:34 <kaz> ack e
15:00:35 <kaz> ack k
15:00:40 <kaz> q+
15:01:05 <kaz> ack k
15:01:12 <mjk> kaz: next week is IG charter and can resume this discussion in 2 weeks
15:01:27 <mjk> seb: adjourn the main call
15:01:33 <kaz> [adjourned]
15:01:38 <kaz> rrsagent, draft minutes
15:01:39 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2024/01/24-wot-minutes.html kaz
15:01:45 <mjk> ege: start TD at 5 past
15:01:45 <kaz> rrsagent, draft minutes
15:01:46 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2024/01/24-wot-minutes.html kaz
15:44:08 <mahda-noura> mahda-noura has joined #wot
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