16:07:26 <RRSAgent> RRSAgent has joined #maturity
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16:07:30 <Zakim> RRSAgent, make logs Public
16:07:31 <Zakim> please title this meeting ("meeting: ..."), CharlesL
16:08:24 <CharlesL> present+
16:08:49 <CharlesL> scribe+
16:09:10 <janina> janina has joined #maturity
16:09:21 <janina> zakim, start meeting
16:09:21 <Zakim> RRSAgent, make logs Public
16:09:23 <Zakim> please title this meeting ("meeting: ..."), janina
16:10:01 <CharlesL>   Agenda+ New Business       Agenda+ CSUN (should we meet)     Agenda+ Working Draft end of year update      Agenda+ Do we cite a particular WCAG profile as a conformance target? It seems reasonable to cite that WCAG profile A would arguably be in (Lionel’s question)      Agenda+ MM Draft usability update (GitHub Issue 43)     Agenda+ GitHub Issue #132 (see previous minutes)     Agenda+ Github Issue #79 Section 3.3.2 Rating for evalu
16:10:02 <CharlesL> ation - Support: Outcomes for optimize stage don't align with proof points coincides with issue 172. (Jeff was going to work on it. See previous minutes.)          Agenda+ Github Issue #83 Section 3.7.2 Ratings for Evaluation - Culture: proof points vs. ratings mismatch         Agenda+ Github Issue #85 Inconsistencies in Inactive ratings for various dimensions       Agenda + Github Issue #89 ICT Development Lifecycle ratings outcomes a
16:10:02 <CharlesL> ren't stated like the outcomes are in Silver
16:10:02 <gb> /issues/79 -> #79
16:10:02 <gb> /issues/132 -> #132
16:10:02 <gb> /issues/85 -> #85
16:10:02 <gb> /issues/83 -> #83
16:10:02 <gb> /issues/89 -> #89
16:10:02 <janina> Meeting: Maturity Model Teleconference
16:10:11 <janina> Date 06 Dec 2023
16:10:21 <CharlesL> agenda?
16:10:39 <janina> Chair: Sheri
16:10:47 <CharlesL> sbyrnehaber: New Business?
16:11:43 <CharlesL> ... we are not meeting Dec  27th and Jan 3rd.  We are meeting on the 20th.
16:11:52 <CharlesL> topic: CSUN
16:12:16 <CharlesL> Lionel, not sure if I will be there or not.
16:12:48 <CharlesL> Janina: some groups may have a F2F at CSUN but still too early to tell.
16:13:25 <CharlesL> sbyrnehaber: I am not planning on going, but could jump on a cheap flight for a side meeting.
16:13:40 <CharlesL> Charles: I will be at CSUN since I am presenting.
16:14:29 <CharlesL> sbyrnehaber: CSUN submissions has pasted due in September.
16:14:48 <CharlesL> janina: lets circle back in January.
16:15:32 <CharlesL> topic: Working Draft EOY update
16:16:35 <CharlesL> janina: APA would like to update our title to drop "W3C" keep Accessibility Maturity Model.  Sooner we can remove it from the draft W3C management will be happier.
16:17:02 <CharlesL> Jeff: Can we include "IT or digital" in the title?
16:17:15 <CharlesL> janina: That will be difficult to add due to charters etc.
16:17:58 <CharlesL> sbyrnehaber: We have a lot of small grammar fixes, Stacey made etc?  or only the title change?
16:18:14 <CharlesL> janina: We can include all the updates including all changes to the editors draft.
16:18:37 <CharlesL> sbyrnehaber: the editors Draft is in a good shape
16:19:19 <CharlesL> RESOLUTION: participants here approve a working draft update publication once the title has been updated.
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16:20:07 <CharlesL> janina: Roy will take care of that. We can update working drafts without APA approval, so this is good publish updates often.
16:20:13 <IrfanAli> present+
16:21:10 <CharlesL> Topic: WCAG target number?
16:22:23 <sbyrnehaber> q+
16:22:29 <CharlesL> janina: ADAPT conversations, realized there is guidance in WCAG defines A/AA and AAA and A is the min. to be accessible but highly recommends striving for AA.  Should we ask Maturity Model consider generic guidance look for conformance and strive for functional accessibility support.
16:22:44 <sbyrnehaber> q-
16:23:00 <CharlesL> ... we can say this generically.
16:23:43 <CharlesL> sbyrnehaber: we deliberately left out WCAG versions.  but will need to be carefully word smith.  "including but not limited to..."
16:24:31 <CharlesL> janina: could cut across multiple places the minimum is not enough.  where this should go?  Thats a good question.  suggestions?
16:25:30 <CharlesL> sbyrnehaber: it doesn't belong in the dimensions, somewhere in the introduction.  there is a section "scope" that seems to be one place 1.2.1 currently short 1 sentence.
16:25:48 <CharlesL> ... we mention you can do only 1 dimension.
16:26:16 <CharlesL> ..., since David is not here, I can do it with him. Janina agrees.
16:26:43 <CharlesL> sbyrnehaber: David and I will take this on.
16:26:55 <CharlesL> janina: I will create a ticket and assign it to Sheri.
16:27:26 <CharlesL> janina: Yes this satisfies the APA.
16:27:40 <CharlesL> sbyrnehaber: also satisfies Lionel concern
16:27:47 <CharlesL> Topic Issue #43
16:27:48 <gb> /issues/43 -> #43
16:28:53 <kline> https://github.com/w3c/maturity-model/issues/43
16:28:53 <gb> https://github.com/w3c/maturity-model/issues/43 -> Issue 43 Should "proof points" and "ratings for evaluation" sections be combined for clarity? (by jasonjgw)
16:29:49 <CharlesL> sbyrnehaber: google doc
16:29:55 <sbyrnehaber> https://docs.google.com/document/d/1Wrhomdc2gJWIkDPOveiH3_ig1bddTMonEhIDZIzohrc/edit?usp=sharing
16:30:23 <CharlesL> ... Stacy made this proposal. she is not here today.
16:30:35 <janina> rrsagent, make minutes
16:30:37 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2023/12/06-maturity-minutes.html janina
16:30:44 <CharlesL> ... got rid of the table and replaced with a Narative.
16:30:53 <CharlesL> ... did we want to keep the table + Narrative?
16:31:31 <CharlesL> ... group agrees to also include the table, but the narrative changes look good.
16:31:52 <Lionel_Wolberger> Lionel_Wolberger has joined #maturity
16:31:55 <Lionel_Wolberger> present+
16:32:03 <Lionel_Wolberger> rrsagent, make minutes
16:32:04 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2023/12/06-maturity-minutes.html Lionel_Wolberger
16:32:42 <CharlesL> Jeff: I don't have a problem with this.
16:32:42 <CharlesL> sbyrnehaber: Jason's point is folks with cognitive issues it will help
16:33:10 <CharlesL> Jeff: we do have the generic levels, and have those come after the proof points provides the context for those different levels.
16:33:33 <CharlesL> sbyrnehaber: Stacy's example are specific to this specific dimension.
16:34:31 <CharlesL> ... tell them what you are going to say, is intro, sayit is what Stacy has and then include the table at the end to reinforce it.
16:34:51 <CharlesL> Jeff: I am fine either way.
16:35:34 <CharlesL> sbyrnehaber: need to create an issue for each dimension, I don't think we do this before the next updated working draft.
16:35:56 <CharlesL> janina: we can have PR's but wouldn't approve them until Roy has released.
16:36:19 <CharlesL> sbyrnehaber: do we have anyone assigned to each dimension?
16:36:35 <CharlesL> ... do we want to revisit this?
16:37:40 <CharlesL> ... Suzy owns Support, Stacy Communications, we need K&S, Sheri owns ICT, Jeff Procurement,
16:38:03 <sbyrnehaber> David owns personnel
16:38:18 <sbyrnehaber> and when I say "own" I mean is responsible for making generic changes that are being applied to all dimensions
16:38:26 <CharlesL> Jeff: I will take K&S
16:39:02 <CharlesL> ... I will maintain Procurement and can take on K&S
16:39:34 <CharlesL> sbyrnehaber: Own means generic stuff for now.  anyone else for K&S?
16:39:44 <CharlesL> ... what about Culture?
16:40:11 <CharlesL> sbyrnehaber: I will take Culture for now.
16:40:57 <CharlesL> ... someone should update ticket #43.  Stacy does currently I will ask her to update this based on minutes
16:40:58 <gb> /issues/43 -> #43
16:41:15 <CharlesL> topic: issue #132
16:41:16 <gb> /issues/132 -> #132
16:41:40 <sbyrnehaber> https://github.com/w3c/maturity-model/issues/132
16:41:40 <gb> https://github.com/w3c/maturity-model/issues/132 -> Issue 132 User Research is not User Experience (by jake-abma)
16:42:31 <CharlesL> sbyrnehaber: asking for clarification of the language.  which I agree with
16:42:50 <CharlesL> Jeff: its just a title change ?
16:43:13 <CharlesL> sbyrnehaber: and a little bit of the content.  we want to make the title match the content and include experience not just resear.
16:43:42 <CharlesL> ... section 3.4.1.3
16:44:07 <CharlesL> ... so this is mine. Assign this ticket to me and I will take care of.
16:44:34 <CharlesL> Jeff: this was originally from KH not sure who this is. someone emailed in a comment.
16:45:22 <CharlesL> sbyrnehaber: might be Karen Hockins.  with Level Access if she is still there.
16:46:10 <CharlesL> sbyrnehaber: I will reach out to her with a draft to see if this addresses her concerns.
16:46:40 <CharlesL> topic: Issue 79
16:47:03 <sbyrnehaber> https://github.com/w3c/maturity-model/issues/79
16:47:03 <gb> https://github.com/w3c/maturity-model/issues/79 -> CLOSED Issue 79 Section 3.3.2 Rating for evaluation - Support: Outcomes for optimize stage don't align with proof points (by maryjom)
16:47:38 <sbyrnehaber> replaced by 198: https://github.com/w3c/maturity-model/issues/198
16:47:38 <gb> https://github.com/w3c/maturity-model/issues/198 -> Issue 198 Support Optimize Outcomes Statement Needs Revision to Align with Dimension Goals. Replaces Issue #79 (by jeffkline)
16:47:43 <CharlesL> Jeff: we closed that and moved to 198 needs to reflect the general purpose of the dimension.
16:48:05 <CharlesL> sbyrnehaber: added to the issue or link to a google doc to discuss it further.
16:48:16 <CharlesL> Jeff: I can add it in there.
16:48:28 <kline> Proposed language:  IT Accessibility support for all internal and external IT is complete. Accessible self-help features are fully integrated for all IT.  Training programs are in place for IT support staff are trained and deployed. Continuous improvement plans ongoing.
16:48:41 <CharlesL> ... This is the optimized.
16:49:28 <CharlesL> ... this is in the support Dimension.
16:49:53 <CharlesL> sbyrnehaber: ok. That implies to be optimized self help is mandatory.
16:50:22 <CharlesL> Jeff: maybe need to tweak it a little more, some things self help others not depending.  need to capture something regarding self help.
16:50:41 <CharlesL> sbyrnehaber: support is available to all personal not what kind of help.
16:51:00 <CharlesL> ... second sentence needs tweaking.
16:51:29 <sbyrnehaber> Instead of "Accessible self-help features are fully integrated for all IT" how about "Help available to all personnel for all ICT"
16:51:37 <sbyrnehaber> and change IT to ICT in the other sentences
16:52:00 <CharlesL> ... two suggested changes as listed above
16:52:04 <CharlesL> Jeff: OK.
16:53:08 <CharlesL> ... I will edit and push that before Roy freezes
16:53:40 <CharlesL> sbyrnehaber: there may be a changes freeze date in W3C for holidays.  Sheri will check
16:55:00 <CharlesL>   rrsagent, draft minutes
16:55:02 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2023/12/06-maturity-minutes.html CharlesL