15:06:10 <RRSAgent> RRSAgent has joined #wot-td
15:06:15 <RRSAgent> logging to https://www.w3.org/2023/11/22-wot-td-irc
15:06:18 <kaz> meeting: WoT-WG - TD-TF
15:09:28 <cris__> cris__ has joined #wot-td
15:09:58 <kaz> present+ Kaz_Ashimura, Cristiano_Aguzzi, Daniel_Peintner, Ege_Korkan, Luca_Barbato, Michael_Koster, Jan_Romann
15:14:24 <kaz> chair: Ege, Koster
15:14:38 <kaz> agenda: https://www.w3.org/WoT/IG/wiki/WG_WoT_Thing_Description_WebConf#November_22.2C_2023
15:15:05 <luca_barbato> scribenick: luca_barbato
15:16:08 <kaz> present+ Cristiano_Aguzzi
15:16:26 <kaz> present+ Klaus_Hartke
15:16:28 <luca_barbato> topic: Minutes
15:16:42 <luca_barbato> ege: Already reviewed and sent to the mailinglist
15:16:52 <kaz> i|Alre|-> https://www.w3.org/2023/11/15-wot-td-minutes.html Nov-15|
15:17:29 <kaz> q+
15:18:25 <luca_barbato> kaz: We also need to review the TPAC coordination call
15:18:27 <kaz> https://www.w3.org/2023/11/02-wot-td-minutes.html
15:19:07 <kaz> s/https/-> https/
15:19:17 <kaz> s/html/html Nov-2 TD coordination call/
15:19:21 <kaz> q-
15:19:25 <kaz> rrsagent, make log public
15:19:53 <kaz> present+ Tomoaki_Mizushima
15:20:06 <luca_barbato> ege: We can also approve this one with a small change
15:20:12 <luca_barbato> topic: TD Call slot
15:20:31 <luca_barbato> ege: I sent an email and a doodle and received feedback
15:20:57 <luca_barbato> ege: We'll use the new slots from the next year
15:21:09 <kaz> -> https://doodle.com/meeting/organize/id/dwkzgZrd?authToken=ZWdlLmtvcmthbkBzaWVtZW5zLmNvbTtFZ2UgS29ya2Fu.40rBapNd9VX0cp35ud Doodle
15:21:14 <luca_barbato> ege: I contacted people that shown interest to join the call in the future
15:22:39 <dape> q+
15:22:54 <kaz> rrsagent, draft minutes
15:22:55 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2023/11/22-wot-td-minutes.html kaz
15:23:08 <dape> ack dape
15:24:00 <luca_barbato> ege: The current slot is good for almost everybody
15:24:09 <luca_barbato> lu: If it needs be it is fine for me as well
15:24:37 <luca_barbato> topic: TD 1.1 Publication
15:24:50 <kaz> q+
15:25:02 <luca_barbato> ege: Kaz already did a first pass checking there aren't broken links
15:25:50 <dape> q+
15:26:22 <luca_barbato> kaz: If needed I can make so we can publish next week
15:26:30 <kaz> s/checking/using the Pubrules checker/
15:26:49 <kaz> s/broken links/any errors but still need a change log section/
15:26:52 <kaz> ack k
15:27:06 <Ege> https://w3c.github.io/wot-thing-description/publication/ver11/7-rec/diff
15:27:35 <luca_barbato> ege: <goes over the diff>
15:27:37 <kaz> s/kaz: If needed I can make so we can publish next week/kaz: I can create a Transition Request for REC right after this update is applied./
15:27:57 <kaz> s/https/-> https/
15:28:03 <kaz> s/diff/diff.html diff from Proposed REC/
15:30:42 <dape> q?
15:30:44 <dape> ack dape
15:30:49 <luca_barbato> ege: is there anything more to add or amed?
15:31:33 <kaz> q+
15:32:02 <luca_barbato> kaz: Did you edit index.html and then generate the other?
15:32:06 <luca_barbato> ege: Yes
15:33:00 <luca_barbato> topic: Binding Templates
15:33:16 <Ege> ack  k
15:33:24 <kaz> q+
15:33:26 <luca_barbato> subtopic: BACnet
15:34:18 <kaz> i/Binding/kaz: note that I'll update the pubdate of Arch and Discovery within the TD spec as I mentioned during the main call./
15:34:21 <kaz> q-
15:34:31 <kaz> present+ Dogan_Fennibay
15:35:09 <luca_barbato> dogan: I fixed discrepancies between http and ttl
15:35:24 <kaz> i|I fixed|-> https://github.com/w3c/wot-binding-templates/pull/318 PR 318 - Draft: BACnet protocol binding improvements|
15:35:33 <kaz> rrsagent, make log public
15:35:37 <kaz> rrsagent, draft minutes
15:35:38 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2023/11/22-wot-td-minutes.html kaz
15:36:15 <luca_barbato> dogan: I doublechecked BACnet and removed covPeriod since it cannot be influenced by the TD
15:37:21 <kaz> s/ack k//
15:37:35 <kaz> i/note that/scribenick: kaz/
15:37:57 <kaz> i/I fixed/scribenick: luca_barbato/
15:37:59 <kaz> rrsagent, draft minutes
15:38:00 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2023/11/22-wot-td-minutes.html kaz
15:43:18 <JKRhb> JKRhb has joined #wot-td
15:45:56 <luca_barbato> q+
15:48:45 <luca_barbato> <patch reviewed, comments noted in the PR>
15:48:51 <luca_barbato> ack
15:48:56 <luca_barbato> ack lu
15:51:21 <kaz> -> https://w3c.github.io/wot-binding-templates/bindings/protocols/bacnet/index.html#uri-syntax Web of Things (WoT) BACnet Binding Template - 4.1  URI Syntax
15:53:43 <luca_barbato> dogan: Why using bacv instead of bacnet as prefix?
15:54:30 <luca_barbato> ege: It was suggested by the json-ld liason, to avoid confusion between the schemas and the prefix
15:54:51 <luca_barbato> s/json-ld liason/Manu Sporny/
15:55:55 <luca_barbato> dogan: Can we update the main document to link to this protocol binding?
15:55:56 <dape> https://github.com/w3c/wot-thing-description/issues/443
15:56:15 <luca_barbato> ege: Yes for now, in future we'll have a more structured process
15:56:41 <luca_barbato> chris: The modbus protocol binding needs to be updated to match
15:57:35 <dape> q+
15:58:07 <dape> acl dape
15:58:15 <kaz> ack d
15:58:20 <kaz> s/acl dape//
15:59:45 <kaz> -> https://github.com/w3c/wot-binding-templates/issues/120 Issue 120 - Binding Prefixes - closed
15:59:50 <kaz> rrsagent, draft minutes
15:59:52 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2023/11/22-wot-td-minutes.html kaz
16:01:06 <kaz> -> https://github.com/w3c/wot-binding-templates/issues/119#issuecomment-1823043348 Issue 119 - Modbus Prefix - comment added
16:01:15 <luca_barbato> dogan: I'll prepare the PR to link to the main document and doublecheck the prefix
16:01:48 <luca_barbato> subtopic: Modbus
16:02:08 <kaz> scribenick: kaz
16:02:34 <kaz> s/Modbus/Modbus Type/
16:03:02 <kaz> -> https://github.com/w3c/wot-binding-templates/pull/161 PR 161 - Well-know Media Types content paremeters
16:04:01 <kaz> (kind of long discussion)
16:04:18 <kaz> ek: protocol specific?
16:04:21 <kaz> ca: yeah
16:04:32 <kaz> ... content type approach
16:04:44 <kaz> s/t t/t-t/
16:05:14 <kaz> lb: confirm we should not use the content-type here
16:05:24 <kaz> ca: true
16:05:38 <kaz> ... but still need some discussion
16:05:51 <kaz> ... may be some corner cases
16:06:39 <kaz> ... the information is inside of the content-type
16:06:53 <kaz> [[
16:06:53 <kaz> {
16:06:54 <kaz>    // ... other fields
16:06:54 <kaz>    "content-type": 'text/plain;charset=UTF-16LE'
16:06:54 <kaz>    "endianness"=BE // <--  what does it mean? we should not allow BE here.
16:06:56 <kaz> }
16:06:58 <kaz> ]]
16:07:24 <kaz> lb: if we want to add something customized, would get problems
16:08:33 <kaz> q+
16:09:05 <kaz> ... should look into where to put waht
16:09:08 <kaz> s/waht/what/
16:10:42 <kaz> ca: very low-structured data
16:13:25 <kaz> ek: Modbus uses binary stream, and endian to be specified
16:13:30 <Ege> q?
16:14:54 <kaz> lb: how to interpret the data?
16:16:02 <kaz> ca: three-step approach?
16:16:15 <kaz> q?
16:18:30 <kaz> ack k
16:18:53 <kaz> kaz: think this is a bigger problem for WoT about how to deal with binary stream data
16:19:07 <cris__> q+
16:19:45 <kaz> ... should not directly dive into Modbus sensor data quickly
16:20:06 <kaz> ... it's kind of like regenerating the mechanism like pack function from Perl or Python
16:20:56 <kaz> ca: should have some generic framework
16:21:23 <kaz> ... because the binary data may possibly be some media stream data
16:22:08 <kaz> q-
16:22:10 <kaz> q+
16:22:12 <kaz> ack c
16:22:17 <cris__> ack c
16:22:24 <kaz> ek: would like to close this PR without merging
16:22:27 <kaz> ca: agree
16:22:41 <mjk> mjk has joined #wot-td
16:22:43 <kaz> q-
16:22:49 <mjk> q?
16:23:36 <kaz> (closed)
16:23:51 <kaz> q+
16:24:06 <kaz> subtopic: Issue 293
16:24:23 <kaz> -> https://github.com/w3c/wot-binding-templates/issues/293 Issue 293 - [Modbus-binding] type conversion based on byte and word order
16:24:56 <kaz> -> https://github.com/w3c/wot-binding-templates/issues/293#issuecomment-1671064223 specifically Sebastian's comment including a list of bit order variations
16:25:07 <kaz> ek: this is a list of existing variations
16:25:11 <kaz> q+
16:25:28 <kaz> ... Siemens' SayWoT has three variations
16:25:36 <kaz> [[
16:25:45 <kaz> modbus:type (string): integer/int, uint, boolean, number/float, string
16:25:45 <kaz> modbus:wordOrder (string): "HighWordFirst", HighWordFirst, LowWordFirst
16:25:45 <kaz> modbus:endian (string): "bigendian", "bigendian", "littleendian"
16:25:46 <kaz> ]]
16:26:04 <kaz> ek: if we go for this direction, there is some library
16:26:26 <kaz> ... we need to make decision
16:26:31 <kaz> q?
16:26:34 <cris__> q+
16:30:47 <luca_barbato> q+
16:34:35 <kaz> ack k
16:34:39 <kaz> ack c
16:34:41 <kaz> ack lu
16:35:25 <dape> q+ to the 3 term approach would require to specify what combination is not allowed
16:35:50 <kaz> kaz: @@@
16:36:05 <mjk> q?
16:36:30 <kaz> dp: 3-term approach seems to make sense
16:36:58 <luca_barbato> the binding protocol for modbus has to support the protocol as it is defined, modbus-rtu is a wire protocol and modbus-tcp is a defined serialization of that in TCP
16:37:21 <dape> ack dape
16:37:21 <Zakim> dape, you wanted to the 3 term approach would require to specify what combination is not allowed
16:37:32 <kaz> s/the binding/lb: the binding/
16:38:13 <kaz> i/the binding/scribenick: luca_barbato/
16:38:30 <Ege> q?
16:38:31 <kaz> q+
16:39:34 <kaz> ack k
16:39:49 <kaz> kaz: I still have difficulty with this discussion
16:40:44 <kaz> ... if Siemens' sayWoT uses three parameters, modbus:tpe, modbus: wordOrder, modbus:endian to handle Modbus data, we should clarify possible data variations for Modbus systems in general
16:41:04 <kaz> ... that's why I suggested we clarify some more Use Cases for that
16:41:14 <kaz> ack k
16:42:03 <kaz> lc: we can't fit all the possible variations. just can fit integer/float
16:42:28 <kaz> ... so this would confuse people who have not used Modbus data
16:42:53 <kaz> ... we need to clarify the mechanism step by step
16:43:16 <kaz> ... also what to be handled by what
16:43:53 <kaz> ... we're solving interoperability issues
16:44:14 <Ege> q?
16:44:17 <kaz> ... Modbus world is very different from ordinary HTTP world
16:44:44 <luca_barbato> https://docs.rs/tokio-modbus
16:44:59 <luca_barbato> https://docs.rs/modbus/latest/modbus/
16:45:25 <kaz> rrsagent, draft minutes
16:45:26 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2023/11/22-wot-td-minutes.html kaz
16:45:50 <kaz> topic: TD Next
16:46:08 <kaz> subtopic: Reorganization
16:46:32 <kaz> -> https://github.com/w3c/wot/blob/main/planning/ThingDescription/work-items.md work-items.md
16:47:30 <kaz> ek: (shows the MD)
16:47:37 <kaz> ... there is a pullrequest
16:48:08 <kaz> -> https://github.com/w3c/wot/pull/1158 wot PR 1158 - Reorganization of TD Work Items as Separate Documents
16:48:35 <kaz> ek: splitting the content into several sub documents based on the bigger categories of the work items
16:49:40 <kaz> ... would make the document nicer
16:49:45 <kaz> (merged)
16:50:05 <Ege> q?
16:50:41 <kaz> subtopic: Registry
16:50:57 <kaz> -> https://github.com/w3c/wot/blob/main/registry-analysis/Readme.md registry-analysis/Readme.md
16:51:25 <kaz> -> https://github.com/w3c/wot/pull/1150 wot PR 1150 - Expand analysis of "Custom Registry Mechanism Registries"
16:52:06 <kaz> -> https://github.com/w3c/wot/blob/35e45c8a0854851ffafa8172aa2baadfac144332/registry-analysis/Readme.md rendered version
16:52:26 <kaz> jr: (goes through the MD)
16:52:43 <kaz> ek: much nicer now
16:54:49 <kaz> ... for example, good point about media source registry
16:55:21 <kaz> ... also "first come, first serve" policy
16:56:59 <kaz> q+
16:57:11 <kaz> ack k
16:57:41 <kaz> ... would like to know about when the registries are created as well
16:58:00 <kaz> ... e.g., TTML registry
16:58:25 <kaz> kaz: to see if the registry is active?
16:58:28 <kaz> ek: right
16:58:44 <kaz> ... any objections to merge this PR?
16:58:51 <kaz> (none)
16:58:52 <kaz> (merged)
16:58:57 <kaz> rrsagent, draft minutes
16:58:58 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2023/11/22-wot-td-minutes.html kaz
16:59:32 <kaz> topic: AOB
16:59:41 <kaz> ek: would like to talk about project management next time
16:59:54 <kaz> [adjourned]
16:59:56 <kaz> rrsagent, draft minutes
16:59:58 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2023/11/22-wot-td-minutes.html kaz
17:06:24 <kaz> i/I still have diffi/scribenick: kaz/
17:08:27 <kaz> s/@@@/not sure if this discussion is really included in the scope of the WoT binding templates, because we're diving into the discussion about how to convert binary stream data (e.g., via Modbus protocol) to HTTP response./
17:08:29 <kaz> rrsagent, draft minutes
17:08:31 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2023/11/22-wot-td-minutes.html kaz