14:49:42 <RRSAgent> RRSAgent has joined #maturity
14:49:47 <RRSAgent> logging to https://www.w3.org/2023/11/01-maturity-irc
14:49:47 <Zakim> RRSAgent, make logs Public
14:50:18 <Zakim> please title this meeting ("meeting: ..."), Fazio
14:50:18 <Fazio> meeting: Maturity Model
14:50:18 <Fazio> chair, Fazio
14:53:53 <Fazio> chair: Fazio
14:54:06 <Fazio> agenda+ new business
14:54:27 <Fazio> agenda+ Equity Considerations Estimate
14:54:43 <Fazio> Agenda+ MM Draft usability update
14:54:57 <Fazio> Agenda + GitHub Issue #145 Linking would make it easier to use
14:54:57 <gb> /issues/145 -> #145
14:55:10 <Fazio> Agenda + GitHub Issue #153 The effectiveness of knowledge/skill acquisition should be measured
14:55:10 <gb> /issues/153 -> #153
14:55:24 <Fazio> Agenda+ Github Issue #83 Section 3.7.2 Ratings for Evaluation - Culture: proof points vs. ratings mismatch
14:55:24 <gb> /issues/83 -> #83
14:55:41 <Fazio> Agenda+ Github Issue #85 Inconsistencies in Inactive ratings for various dimensions
14:55:41 <gb> /issues/85 -> #85
14:58:56 <sheribyrne> sheribyrne has joined #maturity
14:59:01 <sheribyrne> present+
14:59:23 <Fazio> present+
15:00:18 <stacey> stacey has joined #maturity
15:00:28 <CharlesL> CharlesL has joined #maturity
15:00:34 <CharlesL> present+
15:01:01 <stacey> present+
15:03:41 <janina> janina has joined #maturity
15:03:42 <stacey> scribe+
15:03:50 <janina> present+
15:04:08 <CharlesL> agenda?
15:04:10 <gb> /issues/145 -> #145
15:04:10 <gb> /issues/153 -> #153
15:04:10 <gb> /issues/83 -> #83
15:04:10 <gb> /issues/85 -> #85
15:04:28 <stacey> zakim, next item
15:04:28 <Zakim> agendum 1 -- new business -- taken up [from Fazio]
15:05:27 <CharlesL> q+
15:06:18 <stacey> ack Charles
15:07:06 <stacey> Charles: updated spreadsheet with summary, pulling data and scores.
15:07:53 <stacey> Sheri: that's awesome
15:08:29 <stacey> zakim, next item
15:08:29 <Zakim> agendum 2 -- Equity Considerations Estimate -- taken up [from Fazio]
15:09:25 <Lionel_Wolberger> Lionel_Wolberger has joined #maturity
15:09:34 <Lionel_Wolberger> zakim, who is here
15:09:34 <Zakim> Lionel_Wolberger, you need to end that query with '?'
15:09:34 <stacey> Sheri: quick run through, trying to nbuild framework for which dimensions need new evidence/proof points for equity and sustainability. Dozen proof points that would be required, might need subproof points. Five require between 1-3 sets of proof points.
15:09:38 <Lionel_Wolberger> zakim, who is here?
15:09:38 <Zakim> Present: sheribyrne, Fazio, CharlesL, stacey, janina
15:09:40 <Zakim> On IRC I see Lionel_Wolberger, janina, CharlesL, stacey, sheribyrne, RRSAgent, Zakim, Fazio, gb, kevin, alastairc
15:09:44 <janina> present+
15:10:11 <stacey> Sheri: would like to continue working on this. Can work with equity/sustainability group to flesh this out.
15:15:14 <stacey> Sheri: the ones most impacted, procurement, personnel, communications, and knowledge and skills
15:15:56 <stacey> Sheri: not a super heavy lift, the decision is do we want to do it, not how do we do it
15:16:08 <stacey> Lionel: can we aim for simplicity?
15:16:32 <stacey> Sheri: that might mean us adding it. Every time we make a change to ours, they'd have to make a change to theirs...
15:16:42 <stacey> Janina: we need it in a single document to succeed
15:17:02 <stacey> continued: anything normative, it's W3C
15:17:22 <stacey> David: is this maturity model for all W3C or just within WAI?
15:17:55 <stacey> Janina: we want our model to be sustainable
15:18:10 <stacey> continued: there's a little fast and loose around scope
15:18:39 <stacey> Sheri: we're using two different forms of the word sustainability. There's environment vs. the model. Not the same thing.
15:19:48 <Lionel_Wolberger> q+
15:19:54 <stacey> Janina: there's a coordination issue, needs to be figured out
15:20:17 <stacey> Sheri: assessment is it's not that much work, the question is does it belong or not?
15:21:58 <sheribyrne> scribe+
15:22:10 <sheribyrne> Janina to take up issue with AGWG chairs
15:22:44 <sheribyrne> Fazio: we should also bring it up on the WAI coordination call
15:23:01 <sheribyrne> janina: do AGWG chairs first
15:25:48 <sheribyrne> Lionel_Wolberger: I think we have a clearer picture, we now understand impact.  Do we want to create a pro / cons list?
15:27:03 <sheribyrne> q+
15:27:08 <sheribyrne> q-
15:27:32 <sheribyrne> Fazio: Model was designed to be extensible.
15:28:01 <sheribyrne> Fazio: Cost doesn't matter
15:28:06 <sheribyrne> Q-
15:28:14 <Lionel_Wolberger> scribe+
15:28:34 <Lionel_Wolberger> sheribyrne: There are two sides to simplicity. (1) simple for the end users (2) simple for W3C to maintain it
15:28:44 <Fazio> +1
15:29:06 <sheribyrne> and W3C simplicity is more important, because we need to be able to maintain it or the users have nothing
15:29:27 <Lionel_Wolberger> ... and W3C simplicity is more important, because we need to be able to maintain it or the users have nothing
15:29:37 <Lionel_Wolberger> rrsagent, make minutes
15:29:38 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2023/11/01-maturity-minutes.html Lionel_Wolberger
15:29:53 <sheribyrne> janina: we need to stay in scope and not jeopardize keeping the model moving forward
15:30:15 <stacey> q+
15:31:03 <sheribyrne> sheribyrne: we could filter based on accessibility, sustainability and equity in the tool.  People could select the ones they want
15:31:04 <sheribyrne> q-
15:31:09 <sheribyrne> q-
15:31:27 <sheribyrne> ack Lionel_Wolberger
15:31:52 <sheribyrne> Lionel_Wolberger: do we need to write out the pros/cons?
15:32:02 <sheribyrne> janina: has what she needs for the AGWG conversation
15:32:34 <sheribyrne> ack stac
15:33:06 <sheribyrne> stacey: do we have definitions for equity and sustainability
15:33:52 <stacey> Stacey: does equity and sustainability have firm definitions and are they focused on business maturity or a11y?
15:34:50 <stacey> Sheri: equity...not a focus on a11y. It's on human aspect. Assuming sustainabiltiy is the same, but need to find out. How do you measure an initiative or software or meeting ie equitable
15:34:54 <Fazio> q+
15:34:58 <stacey> ack da
15:35:03 <sheribyrne> ack Fazio
15:35:34 <sheribyrne> sheribyrne: q+
15:35:48 <sheribyrne> ack sheribyrne
15:35:59 <sheribyrne> We don't have a conflict, we just have a scoping decision to be made
15:36:04 <stacey> Janina: need to ask about scope/what's in and what's out
15:37:23 <Fazio> q+
15:37:27 <sheribyrne> ack Fazio
15:37:40 <sheribyrne> Fazio: is this taking up too much of our time?
15:37:49 <sheribyrne> janina: yes, but we can't resolve it here
15:37:59 <sheribyrne> janina: and we can't tell them what to do
15:38:10 <sheribyrne> q+ sheribyrne
15:38:22 <sheribyrne> ack sheribyrne
15:41:38 <janina> https://www.w3.org/2021/Process-20211102/
15:42:04 <sheribyrne> The equity group is currently working on proof points/evidence that could be used either in our maturity model or an extension
15:45:18 <sheribyrne> zakim, next item
15:45:18 <Zakim> agendum 3 -- MM Draft usability update -- taken up [from Fazio]
15:46:13 <sheribyrne> stacey: will get going on that next week, with Susi (possibly async)
15:47:31 <sheribyrne> zakim, next item
15:47:31 <Zakim> agendum 4 -- GitHub Issue #145 Linking would make it easier to use -- taken up [from Fazio]
15:47:32 <gb> /issues/145 -> #145
15:47:54 <Fazio> https://github.com/w3c/maturity-model/issues/145
15:47:55 <gb> https://github.com/w3c/maturity-model/issues/145 -> Issue 145 Linking would make it easier to use (by clapierre)
15:48:14 <sheribyrne> Fazio: will start assigning issues to people
15:48:49 <sheribyrne> sheribyrne: this issue is obsolete, it comes from when we were still working in the google doc
15:48:57 <sheribyrne> Fazio: lets close it then
15:49:25 <sheribyrne> Fazio: action item - close everything that we've logged that is obsolete
15:49:49 <sheribyrne> sheribyrne: someone needs to close Jake's issues
15:50:24 <sheribyrne> Fazio: I got 8 or 10 of them reviewed and closed
15:50:34 <sheribyrne> sheribyrne: that means there are about 20 remaining
15:51:22 <sheribyrne> sheribyrne: no one volunteered, so we will close them on this call
15:51:26 <sheribyrne> Zakim: next item
15:51:32 <sheribyrne> zakim, next item
15:51:32 <Zakim> agendum 5 -- GitHub Issue #153 The effectiveness of knowledge/skill acquisition should be measured -- taken up [from Fazio]
15:51:32 <gb> /issues/153 -> #153
15:51:35 <Fazio> https://github.com/w3c/maturity-model/issues/153
15:51:36 <gb> https://github.com/w3c/maturity-model/issues/153 -> Issue 153 The effectiveness of knowledge/skill acquisition should be measured. (by jasonjgw)
15:52:19 <sheribyrne> sheribyrne: skip this one, we don't have enough time left on this call
15:52:30 <sheribyrne> zakim, next item
15:52:30 <Zakim> agendum 5 was just opened, sheribyrne
15:53:23 <sheribyrne> zakim, close this item
15:53:23 <Zakim> agendum 5 closed
15:53:24 <Zakim> I see 2 items remaining on the agenda; the next one is
15:53:24 <Zakim> 6. Github Issue #83 Section 3.7.2 Ratings for Evaluation - Culture: proof points vs. ratings mismatch [from Fazio]
15:53:24 <gb> /issues/83 -> #83
15:53:34 <CharlesL> zakim, next item
15:53:34 <Zakim> agendum 6 -- Github Issue #83 Section 3.7.2 Ratings for Evaluation - Culture: proof points vs. ratings mismatch -- taken up [from Fazio]
15:54:12 <sheribyrne> Fazio: homework is to go through issues they've logged that are obsolete and close them
15:54:26 <sheribyrne> Fazio: I will try to go through Jake's editorial issues and address or close them
15:56:44 <Lionel_Wolberger> present+
15:58:30 <janina> janina has left #maturity
16:02:52 <Fazio> zakim, end meeting
16:02:52 <Zakim> As of this point the attendees have been sheribyrne, Fazio, CharlesL, stacey, janina, Lionel_Wolberger
16:02:55 <Zakim> RRSAgent, please draft minutes
16:02:56 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2023/11/01-maturity-minutes.html Zakim
16:03:02 <Zakim> I am happy to have been of service, Fazio; please remember to excuse RRSAgent.  Goodbye
16:03:02 <Zakim> Zakim has left #maturity
17:09:25 <CharlesL> CharlesL has left #maturity