18:23:35 <RRSAgent> RRSAgent has joined #immersive-web
18:23:40 <RRSAgent> logging to https://www.w3.org/2023/10/31-immersive-web-irc
18:23:49 <Zakim> Zakim has joined #immersive-web
18:26:01 <yonet> Chair: yonet
18:26:25 <yonet> Agenda: https://github.com/immersive-web/administrivia/blob/main/meetings/wg/2023-10-31-Immersive_Web_Working_Group_Teleconference-agenda.md
18:47:49 <yonet> Topic: https://github.com/immersive-web/depth-sensing/issues/37
18:59:18 <Leonard> present+
19:01:18 <lgombos> lgombos has joined #immersive-web
19:02:02 <bajones> bajones has joined #Immersive-Web
19:03:01 <cabanier> cabanier has joined #immersive-web
19:03:06 <cabanier> present+
19:05:14 <bialpio> bialpio has joined #immersive-web
19:07:03 <bialpio> present+
19:07:10 <alcooper> present+
19:07:23 <dylan> dylan has joined #immersive-web
19:07:33 <bajones> present+
19:07:46 <yonet> Zakim, choose a victim
19:07:46 <Zakim> Not knowing who is chairing or who scribed recently, I propose cabanier
19:07:53 <lgombos> present+ Laszlo_Gombos
19:08:13 <yonet> scribenick: lgombos
19:08:40 <bialpio> q+
19:08:57 <atsushi> atsushi has joined #immersive-web
19:09:10 <lgombos> cabanier: depth sensing, working on exposing depth sensor.. wondering if this attribute is still needed
19:09:19 <yonet> ack bialpio
19:09:53 <lgombos> bialpio: in our implementation arcore does not care about device orientiation, so mapping is needed between the coordinates, this is the source of this attribute
19:10:39 <lgombos> cabanier: landscape texture, turn the phone, how would that look
19:11:22 <lgombos> bialpio: need to take a look at the spec or the code.. chromium getdepth method has some description
19:12:15 <lgombos> bialpio: xrview coordinates.. multiply with a matric, and get depth buffer (in meters)
19:13:30 <lgombos> cabanier: in our case the depth api returns fov and views.. in our case we try to build it on top of what openxr api returns
19:13:44 <lgombos> bialpio: when you have depth texture, we do not specify the units
19:13:45 <yonet> Topic: https://github.com/immersive-web/depth-sensing/issues/43
19:14:13 <lgombos> cabanier: when you get the information from teh system, you get swapchain and depth near and far
19:14:46 <lgombos> cabanier: .. depending how you do it pixels might not match
19:15:02 <lgombos> bialpio: even fov is different
19:16:01 <lgombos> bialpio: we have rawvaluetometers..
19:16:05 <lgombos> cabanier: for us it is always 1
19:16:47 <lgombos> cabanier: when you create projection matrixes, you use fov and depth near and depth far.. there are default values that experience can replace
19:17:34 <lgombos> bialpio: z values are key..
19:17:51 <lgombos> cabanier: experience shoudl use the same z values as the system
19:18:19 <lgombos> cabanier: I think two approaches - one we return is as new attribute or second completely ignore the session values
19:18:32 <lgombos> bialpio: lets continue discussion on the bug
19:19:07 <lgombos> bialpio: I though resolution of z values could be encoded into rawvaluetometers
19:19:54 <yonet> Topic: https://github.com/immersive-web/real-world-geometry/issues/40
19:20:27 <lgombos> cabanier: several web developers run into this.. there is a method to recapture the planes
19:20:57 <lgombos> cabanier: it takes a few sec to warm up.. what is long enough ? there should be a signal for "for sure no meshes"
19:21:44 <lgombos> cabanier: what can we do here ? maybe a new event ?
19:22:12 <bajones> q+
19:22:22 <yonet> ack bajones
19:22:56 <bialpio> q+
19:23:07 <lgombos> bajones: feels like an event..current you expect to poll ?
19:23:09 <lgombos> cabanier: yes
19:23:50 <lgombos> bajones: wonder what the event should be for ? maybe it should be some kind of "update finished event"
19:24:49 <lgombos> bajones: in some system these surfaces are precumputed at the time webxr session created
19:25:21 <lgombos> bajones: in some other system, surfaces are continuously discovered .. need to consider different platforms
19:26:01 <lgombos> cabanier: I also want to make sure we support several systems, including android
19:26:20 <yonet> ack bialpio
19:26:21 <lgombos> cabanier: if there is an event, than we do not need to look at every frame
19:27:28 <lgombos> bialpio: are we changing the api to be event based (this was considered in the past) ?
19:28:29 <lgombos> bialpio: at least this particular problem, maybe there should be an opt-in to subscribe to this event
19:28:51 <lgombos> bajones: on android scanning never really completes
19:29:27 <lgombos> bajones: conserned about portability of webxr content if we introduce this optional event based api
19:29:53 <bialpio> q+
19:30:09 <lgombos> cabanier: if it is an event, than content would wait for it to complete
19:30:09 <dylan> Have to drop here, but FYI XR Access is doing a community discussion on Captioning on Nov 15th. Should have some interesting problem solving around 3D positional metadata for 360 degree captions. https://xraccess.org/community-discussion-captions/
19:30:27 <dylan> Thanks all, feel free to reach out anytime on accessibility-related issues - dylan@xraccess.org
19:30:58 <lgombos> bajones: is it reasonable if e.g. on Meta platform the content automatically opt-in for this event ?
19:31:02 <lgombos> cabanier: not really
19:31:51 <lgombos> cabanier: proposal: "needs room setup" event
19:32:13 <lgombos> cabanier: not sure how muti-room would work in webxr
19:32:50 <lgombos> bajones: if it is really just "needs room setup" than we could consider an attribute instead of an event
19:33:24 <lgombos> bajones: event is still also fine
19:33:46 <yonet> ack bialpio
19:34:00 <lgombos> bialpio: bikeshed "inital room capture" or "room capture needed"
19:34:34 <lgombos> bialpio: is this intent to fire only when openxr finished scanning ..
19:34:48 <lgombos> cabanier: no..
19:35:06 <lgombos> bialpio: can you arbitrary start a new capture any time
19:35:07 <lgombos> cabanier: yes
19:35:38 <lgombos> bialpio: in the spec "initiate room capture" can be only run once per webxr session
19:36:02 <lgombos> bajones: maybe the event is stated as "room capture is newly avaiable"..
19:36:24 <bialpio> q?
19:36:39 <lgombos> cabanier: if we want to add multi-room support, we anyways need to update current spec
19:37:16 <lgombos> bajones: if the method is "initialize room capture".. maybe the event is "room capture uninitialized"
19:38:05 <lgombos> cabanier: we shoudl try to avoid a website continuously call this..
19:38:42 <yonet> Topic: https://github.com/immersive-web/layers/issues/304
19:39:30 <lgombos> cabanier: when you ask for multiple textures we only support left and right.. so only work devices with 2 screens
19:40:00 <lgombos> bajones: algorithm itself is just for 2 views
19:40:35 <lgombos> bajones: we want to expand spec for multiple views per eye (not just 1)
19:41:21 <lgombos> cabanier: the layers spec does not mention left/right eye for secondary views
19:42:06 <lgombos> cabanier: I do not think anybody implemented secondary views
19:42:18 <lgombos> bajones: we put it in the spec as we knew HW is coming
19:42:56 <lgombos> cabanier: for sure we need to improve the spec and need a proposal to review
19:43:39 <lgombos> cabanier: pico headset implemented webxr layers.. Meta is not the only implementation
19:43:58 <yonet> https://xraccess.org/community-discussion-captions/
19:44:48 <lgombos> yonet: if there are WG issues, we schedule a meetign in 2 weeks..
19:45:11 <yonet> Thank you lgombos
19:45:24 <atsushi> rrsagent, publish minutes
19:45:25 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2023/10/31-immersive-web-minutes.html atsushi
19:45:44 <atsushi> rrsagent, make log public
19:45:52 <yonet> Thank you Atsushi
19:46:01 <atsushi> meeting: Immersive Web WG/CG call
19:46:19 <atsushi> agenda: https://github.com/immersive-web/administrivia/blob/main/meetings/wg/2023-10-31-Immersive_Web_Working_Group_Teleconference-agenda.md
19:46:36 <atsushi> present+ yonet
19:46:40 <atsushi> rrsagent, publish minutes
19:46:42 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2023/10/31-immersive-web-minutes.html atsushi
19:47:43 <atsushi> previous meeting: https://www.w3.org/2023/10/17-immersive-web-minutes.html
19:48:32 <atsushi> rrsagent, publish minutes
19:48:34 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2023/10/31-immersive-web-minutes.html atsushi