IRC log of haptics on 2023-09-13
Timestamps are in UTC.
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- logging to https://www.w3.org/2023/09/13-haptics-irc
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- RRSAgent, make logs public
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- Meeting: Feel the Vibe: enhancing haptics for accessibility and more fun
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- Chair: qqharryhwang, Selen Xu
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- Agenda: https://github.com/w3c/tpac2023-breakouts/issues/19
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- Slideset: https://www.w3.org/2023/07/breakout_haptics_TPAC/haptics.pdf
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- clear agenda
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- agenda+ Pick a scribe
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- agenda+ Reminders: code of conduct, health policies, recorded session policy
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- agenda+ Goal of this session
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- agenda+ Discussion
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- agenda+ Next steps / where discussion continues
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- 09:18:57 [Roy]
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- RRSAgent, make minutes
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- I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2023/09/13-haptics-minutes.html Roy
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- logging to https://www.w3.org/2023/09/13-haptics-irc
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- RRSAgent, make minutes
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- I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2023/09/13-haptics-minutes.html Roy
- 13:34:56 [Roy]
- agenda?
- 13:37:51 [xiaoqian]
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- scribe: Roy
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- [slide 1]
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- RRSAgent, make minutes
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- I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2023/09/13-haptics-minutes.html Roy
- 13:51:55 [angel_]
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- 13:52:13 [mattreynolds]
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- present+ angel_, Roy, xiaoqian, xfq
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- 13:58:11 [jocelyntran]
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- present+ Selen_Xu
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- 13:59:22 [harry]
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- present+
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- present+ Harry_Wang
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- rrsagent, make minutes
- 13:59:27 [RRSAgent]
- I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2023/09/13-haptics-minutes.html xfq
- 13:59:31 [mattreynolds]
- present+
- 14:01:19 [Selen]
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- 14:01:21 [Roy]
- [round table introduction]
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- 14:05:27 [cabanier]
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- present+
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- harry: welcome to haptics for accessibility session
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- ... emails available for further discussion
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- [slide 2]
- 14:07:23 [xiaoqian]
- slides -> https://www.w3.org/2023/07/breakout_haptics_TPAC/haptics.pdf
- 14:07:35 [Roy]
- harry: go through ToC
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- [slide 3]
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- harry: introduction of Tencent Game team
- 14:08:13 [angel_]
- present+
- 14:08:27 [CharlesL]
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- present+
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- [slide 5]
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- harry: background of haptics
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- ... Haptics amend human machine interaction
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- [slide 6]
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- harry: Haptics Taxonomy
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- [slide 7]
- 14:11:46 [chunming]
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- [slide 8]
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- [slide 9]
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- Harry: here are some reasons worth mentioning to improve usability and accessibility
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- [slide 11]
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- [slide 12]
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- [slide 13]
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- RRSAgent, make minutes
- 14:18:29 [RRSAgent]
- I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2023/09/13-haptics-minutes.html Roy
- 14:19:11 [Roy]
- [show how to start designing a Haptic Effect]
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- [slide 14]
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- Selen: Versatility and flexibility are the core design concepts throughout the entire solution
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- [slide 18]
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- Selen: show how to implement haptics with their SCK
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- s/SCK/SDK
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- [slide 19]
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- Selen: MTGPA Haptics .HE Format shows in picture
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- ... data format is also compiled with IEEE standard
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- [slide 15]
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- [slide 16]
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- Selen: Sync to Audio and Video Design
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- ... designed 2 solutions
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- ... Vibration playback mechanism and Vibration Synchronization Scheme
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- [slide 17]
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- Selen: Haptics has implemented in Games
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- [slide 21]
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- Selen: background of users, and haptics can help visually impaired users to gain more information and understanding.
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- [slide 22]
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- Selen: use cases include: chat, news, videos etc.,
- 14:29:02 [xfq]
- present+ chunming
- 14:29:22 [Roy]
- [slide 24]
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- Selen: Haptics solution for input method
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- [slide 25]
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- Solution for maps
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- [slide 26]
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- Selen: Promote Haptics as a Common Human Language
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- ... Integration with Web contents, support by Web platform, adoption in Accessibility guideline
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- ... harry will introduction standardized about haptics
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- [slide 28]
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- 14:35:05 [Roy]
- harry: the fragmentation will cause a compatibility issues, there are several advantages to standard haptics, since we improve the usability
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- [slide 29]
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- [slide 30]
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- harry: haptics stack show in slide
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- ... some standardization work has start in different org
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- ... including: ISO MPEG-I, IETF Haptics Media, IEEE P2861.3/Haptics Industry Forum etc
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- [slide 31]
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- [slide 32]
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- harry: Haptic Data Model in MPEG
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- ... 3 types format
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- ... depend on situation
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- [slide 33]
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- harry: Haptic File Format
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- ... 3 types format
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- [slide 34]
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- harry: introduction of encode and decode
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- ... 2 types of input and 3 types of output
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- [slide 35]
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- Harry: IEEE P2861.3 Haptic Enhancement for Mobile Game, for mobile haptics platform: interface, data, evaluation
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- angel: suggest to jump into your proposal
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- Harry: sure
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- [slide 39]
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- harry: Some Thoughts on W3C Vibration API
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- ... doesn't support sophisticated haptic wave forms
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- ... doesn't support precision haptics
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- [slide 40]
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- harry: Some Thoughts on W3C Gamepad Extension API
- 14:45:28 [mattreynolds]
- +q
- 14:45:33 [Selen]
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- ... show possible amendment for W3C standard
- 14:46:31 [xueyuan]
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- [slide 42]
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- harry: examples
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- [slide 43]
- 14:47:29 [angel_]
- q?
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- harry: some takeaway
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- ... raise some questions
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- RRSAgent, make minutes
- 14:48:37 [RRSAgent]
- I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2023/09/13-haptics-minutes.html Roy
- 14:50:16 [Roy]
- ack mattreynolds
- 14:50:16 [angel_]
- ack matt
- 14:50:25 [Roy]
- mattreynolds: I edit that API, and implement into Chromium
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- ... I can give you more context here
- 14:50:47 [cabanier]
- q+
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- ... basically decided that is going to be delegated to legacy device support
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- ... planning on adding new effects to interface
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- ... still a lot of work to do
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- harry: are you consider a new API for that?
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- mattreynolds: yes, MS is working on an update to explainer
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- ... can't tell you exactly last I heard
- 14:53:31 [angel_]
- q?
- 14:53:32 [xfq]
- https://github.com/MicrosoftEdge/MSEdgeExplainers/blob/main/HapticsDevice/explainer.md
- 14:53:54 [Roy]
- ... also we want this work for service too, and with more devices
- 14:55:06 [angel_]
- ack cab
- 14:55:06 [Roy]
- ... I don't think we are going to tie specific to USB
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- cabanier: good to see this going
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- ... we have an applications to create waveforms
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- Harry: I assume also support openXR APIs?
- 14:57:03 [Roy]
- cabanier: yes
- 14:57:37 [Roy]
- harry: there are also some XR work in W3C, how you promote those in two groups
- 14:57:38 [chunming]
- q+
- 14:57:47 [angel_]
- ack chunm
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- cabanier: @@
- 14:58:21 [mattreynolds]
- q+
- 14:58:34 [Roy]
- chunming: does haptics consider feedback from user?
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- harry: no guidelines to say that, we also confused.
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- ... now way to determine
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- ... if we define haptics as human language, I think we should work on guidelines and rules
- 15:00:35 [xiaoqian]
- RRSAgent, make minutes
- 15:00:36 [RRSAgent]
- I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2023/09/13-haptics-minutes.html xiaoqian
- 15:01:33 [Roy]
- Matio: maybe could be possible to make some simplified font of device, to create feedback
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- ... not only to accept some but by some movements to create
- 15:02:29 [cabanier]
- q+
- 15:02:43 [Roy]
- PHANTOM
- 15:03:07 [chunming]
- q?
- 15:03:08 [angel_]
- ack mattr
- 15:03:08 [xfq]
- Phantom from 3D Systems
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- mattreynolds: last slide open questions
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- ... 1 is the easy one to implement, we can cross the system API
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- ... 2 yes, to across the device
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- ... I think we have decided that it would be good to have active waveforms associated with haptic effects so that we could do the down sampling to support on plus or take full devices as well as the more modern devices.
- 15:06:31 [Roy]
- ... 3 Probably didn't able to have things to extensive use case, especially for accessibility. I don't really have a good sense of that.
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- 15:07:13 [Roy]
- ... I think the rest of the room should provide feedback on that. And should there be a guideline for I think a guideline would be good, but probably should not be part of the specification.
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- ... @@1
- 15:07:29 [wendyreid]
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- 15:07:42 [angel_]
- q?
- 15:07:48 [angel_]
- ack cab
- 15:08:06 [Roy]
- cabanier: earlier question, controller can provide feedback
- 15:08:33 [Roy]
- ... like 3 or 4 pressure sensitive sensors on there
- 15:09:03 [Roy]
- ... use that develop can decide how to interactive
- 15:09:28 [Roy]
- Harry: in conclusion what is proper way to move this forward
- 15:10:22 [Roy]
- mattreynolds: little frustrating for us, by now we have a venue to discuss, we need to encourage MS to ring that proposal to a CG
- 15:10:39 [Roy]
- ... no CG yet
- 15:11:01 [Roy]
- angel_: what about incubate in WICG?
- 15:11:29 [Roy]
- mattreynolds: not sure, sounds like a path
- 15:11:36 [Roy]
- RRSAgent, make minutes
- 15:11:37 [RRSAgent]
- I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2023/09/13-haptics-minutes.html Roy
- 15:16:21 [xueyuan]
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- 15:30:32 [xiaoqian]
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- 16:21:16 [tidoust]
- zakim, bye
- 16:21:16 [Zakim]
- leaving. As of this point the attendees have been angel_, Roy, xiaoqian, xfq, Selen_Xu, wendyreid, Harry_Wang, mattreynolds, cabanier, CharlesL, chunming
- 16:21:16 [Zakim]
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- 16:21:21 [tidoust]
- RRSAgent, bye
- 16:21:30 [tidoust]
- RRSAgent, make logs public
- 16:21:42 [tidoust]
- RRSAgent, bye
- 16:21:42 [RRSAgent]
- I see no action items