16:57:31 <RRSAgent> RRSAgent has joined #aria
16:57:35 <RRSAgent> logging to https://www.w3.org/2023/09/07-aria-irc
16:57:35 <jamesn> meeting: ARIA WG
16:57:35 <Zakim> RRSAgent, make logs Public
16:57:36 <Zakim> please title this meeting ("meeting: ..."), jamesn
16:57:37 <jamesn> agendabot, find agenda
16:57:37 <agendabot> jamesn, OK. This may take a minute...
16:57:38 <agendabot> agenda: https://www.w3.org/events/meetings/ecffaf8b-8aa7-4acc-b238-6088a86cf12f/20230907T130000/
16:57:38 <agendabot> clear agenda
16:57:38 <agendabot> agenda+ -> New Issue Triage http://tinyurl.com/3dnm7jmd
16:57:38 <agendabot> agenda+ -> New PR Triage http://tinyurl.com/mr2skmec
16:57:40 <agendabot> agenda+ -> TPAC Agenda https://github.com/w3c/aria/wiki/TPAC-2023-ARIA-Meetings
16:57:43 <agendabot> agenda+ -> Question regarding aria-haspopup=false https://github.com/w3c/aria/issues/2013
16:57:46 <agendabot> agenda+ -> [Question] wai-aria/role/listbox-roles.html wpt test https://github.com/w3c/aria/issues/2012
16:59:31 <Francis_Storr> Francis_Storr has joined #aria
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17:01:53 <Francis_Storr> present+
17:02:09 <Rahim> present+
17:02:24 <spectranaut_> spectranaut_ has joined #aria
17:03:07 <spectranaut_> agenda?
17:03:12 <spectranaut_> chair: spectranaut_
17:04:32 <jamesn> regrets+ CurtBellew
17:06:12 <Adam_Page> Adam_Page has joined #aria
17:07:45 <spectranaut_> scribe?
17:09:01 <jamesn> scribe: jamesn
17:09:10 <jamesn> zakim, next item
17:09:10 <Zakim> agendum 1 -- -> New Issue Triage http://tinyurl.com/3dnm7jmd -- taken up [from agendabot]
17:09:22 <StefanS> StefanS has joined #aria
17:09:26 <StefanS> present+
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17:10:16 <Adam_Page> present+
17:10:23 <jamesn> https://github.com/w3c/aria/issues/2029
17:10:33 <jamesn> add to deprecation discussion at TPAC
17:11:03 <jamesn> https://github.com/w3c/aria/issues/2025
17:11:45 <scotto> scotto has joined #aria
17:11:53 <jamesn> q+
17:12:21 <melsumner> present+
17:12:28 <scotto> present+
17:12:34 <scotto> q+
17:12:45 <jamesn> someone should look into HTML to see if there are strict authoring requirements
17:13:08 <scotto> q-
17:13:26 <jamesn> jamesn: consistency would seem good
17:13:42 <jamesn> zakim, next item
17:13:42 <Zakim> I see a speaker queue remaining and respectfully decline to close this agendum, jamesn
17:13:49 <jamesn> ack me
17:13:50 <jamesn> zakim, next item
17:13:50 <Zakim> agendum 2 -- -> New PR Triage http://tinyurl.com/mr2skmec -- taken up [from agendabot]
17:14:01 <scotto> agreed with matt, look to see what HTML is doing, but maybe it doesn't need to be as strict
17:15:10 <jamesn> #2027 - added Peter
17:15:12 <spectranaut_> https://github.com/w3c/core-aam/pull/192
17:16:21 <spectranaut_> https://github.com/w3c/aria/pull/2023 - talked about last week
17:16:49 <jamesn> zakim, next item
17:16:49 <Zakim> agendum 3 -- -> TPAC Agenda https://github.com/w3c/aria/wiki/TPAC-2023-ARIA-Meetings -- taken up [from agendabot]
17:17:35 <Marcelo_Paiva> Marcelo_Paiva has joined #aria
17:17:49 <jamesn> spectranaut_: there has been 1 change since last week where the tuesday notification proposal has been moved up 30 mins due to a meta XR presentation happening right after
17:18:43 <StefanS> q+
17:20:36 <Doug_> Doug_ has joined #aria
17:21:44 <jamesn> https://www.w3.org/events/meetings/fcde7756-f9a9-4ad5-b67a-0d7049e5b10b/
17:21:50 <jamesn> AT Driver meeting
17:21:51 <Marcelo_Paiva> https://github.com/w3c/tpac2023-breakouts
17:25:28 <StefanS> q-
17:27:22 <jamesn> mariob: propose interactive lists for the Tuesday morning sessions
17:28:01 <benb> benb has joined #aria
17:28:06 <benb> present+
17:28:18 <jamesn> matt: thinks that Stefan also proposed this
17:28:48 <melsumner> question: is there a tpac-focused IRC channel for this group, or will we use this channel?
17:29:21 <jamesn> scotto: Sarah had done a bunch of pre-work on that
17:32:06 <jamesn> spectranaut_: there is the aria wiki
17:32:16 <jamesn> matt: can also use a gist
17:32:25 <jamesn> matt: or discussions too
17:34:32 <scotto> sarah said "oh that's fine" re: 12:30 am meeting time
17:35:38 <spectranaut_> https://github.com/w3c/aria/wiki/TPAC-2023-ARIA-Meetings
17:35:41 <jamesn> https://github.com/w3c/aria/wiki/TPAC-2023-ARIA-Meetings
17:37:39 <jamesn> zakim, next item
17:37:39 <Zakim> agendum 4 -- -> Question regarding aria-haspopup=false https://github.com/w3c/aria/issues/2013 -- taken up [from agendabot]
17:37:49 <jamesn> spectranaut_: small issue
17:38:59 <jamesn> aaronlev: wouldn't we want it to be a MUST NOT so we can write WPTs
17:40:22 <jamesn> jamesn: thought that IA2 just passed all the attributes
17:40:28 <jamesn> aaronlev: not that cut and dry
17:41:01 <jamesn> aaronlev: do we correct for incorrect markup is probably different in each browser
17:41:12 <jamesn> aaronlev: can be a lot of extra code
17:41:39 <jamesn> jamesn: would this just be busy work to fix this?
17:42:11 <jamesn> aaronlev: could be a huge amount of effort to restrict/repair things with little benefit
17:42:23 <jamesn> spectranaut_: maybe this doesn't need to be a MUST as there is no known problem
17:42:42 <jamesn> spectranaut_: think this was purely a spec correction
17:43:36 <jamesn> jamesn: should it be AT or UA?
17:44:24 <jamesn> giacomo: if browsers would make a change and consider role combobox with aria-haspopup=false should they provide the default listbox
17:44:37 <jamesn> matt: a combobox should never have haspopup=false
17:44:51 <jamesn> giacomo: what would happen if someone does
17:45:02 <jamesn> matt: if you don't specify then UA would expose a list
17:45:26 <jamesn> matt: At does nothing with haspopup on combo right now
17:45:44 <jamesn> StefanS: what would happen if someone put aria-haspopup=grid on a combobox
17:45:52 <jamesn> matt: currently allows that
17:46:18 <jamesn> matt: honestly don't think we need haspopup on combo boxes
17:46:42 <jamesn> matt: it is problematic in general if AT exposes haspopup=false
17:46:56 <jamesn> StefanS: have seen use cases for grid
17:47:03 <jamesn> matt: that is allowed
17:47:22 <jamesn> spectranaut_: sounds like this is intentional and we should move on
17:48:05 <jamesn> matt: seems like ideally it would be a mUST not but would seem like a should not would mean we don't need to fix it in browsers right now
17:48:16 <jamesn> spectranaut_: 2 questions
17:48:31 <jamesn> spectranaut_: first it says AT - not UA
17:48:47 <jamesn> spectranaut_: think we don't need to change
17:48:54 <Rahim> q+
17:49:04 <jamesn> matt: could have both
17:49:08 <jamesn> AT&UA should not
17:49:25 <jamesn> ack Rahim
17:49:51 <jamesn> Rahim: seems related to menubutton pattern where we don't set aria-expanded.
17:50:08 <jamesn> matt: got feedback that the APG pattern is confusing
17:50:57 <jamesn> maybe a PR to add 3 words
17:51:02 <jamesn> zakim, next item
17:51:02 <Zakim> agendum 5 -- -> [Question] wai-aria/role/listbox-roles.html wpt test https://github.com/w3c/aria/issues/2012 -- taken up [from agendabot]
17:51:35 <jamesn> q+
17:52:09 <jamesn> ack me
17:52:15 <scotto> q+
17:52:20 <jamesn> matt: this applies to everything with required parents
17:53:48 <jamesn> q+
17:54:13 <spectranaut_> ack scotto
17:54:15 <jamesn> scotto: spec is not clear on this right now
17:54:30 <jamesn> scotto: trying to write this rule in html-aam but there is nothing in aria
17:54:41 <jamesn> scotto: don't have any fallback
17:54:44 <jamesn> jamesn:
17:54:50 <spectranaut_> ack jamesn
17:55:01 <jamesn> jamesn: we have authoring requirements
17:56:52 <jamesn> jamesn: propose adding something to the handling author errors section
17:57:01 <jamesn> jamesn: assign to scott
17:57:38 <jamesn> zakim, end meeting
17:57:39 <Zakim> As of this point the attendees have been Francis_Storr, Rahim, StefanS, Adam_Page, melsumner, scotto, benb
17:57:40 <Zakim> RRSAgent, please draft minutes
17:57:41 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2023/09/07-aria-minutes.html Zakim
17:57:48 <Zakim> I am happy to have been of service, jamesn; please remember to excuse RRSAgent.  Goodbye
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20:20:46 <Rahim> spectranaut_:
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