IRC log of wot-discovery on 2023-09-04

Timestamps are in UTC.

14:03:48 [RRSAgent]
RRSAgent has joined #wot-discovery
14:03:53 [RRSAgent]
logging to https://www.w3.org/2023/09/04-wot-discovery-irc
14:03:53 [kaz]
meeting: WoT Discovery
14:04:13 [kaz]
present+ Kaz_Ashimura, Michael_McCool, Kunihiko_Toumura, Luca_Barbato, Tomoaki_Mizushima
14:05:59 [kaz]
scribenick: kaz
14:06:07 [kaz]
regrets+ Andrea
14:06:32 [kaz]
agenda: https://www.w3.org/WoT/IG/wiki/WG_WoT_Discovery_WebConf#4_September_2023
14:07:07 [kaz]
topic: Minutes
14:08:04 [kaz]
-> https://www.w3.org/2023/08/07-wot-discovery-minutes.html Aug-7
14:08:06 [kaz]
approved
14:08:19 [kaz]
(speakers names to be fixed later)
14:08:31 [kaz]
topic: TPAC Planning
14:09:06 [kaz]
-> https://www.w3.org/WoT/IG/wiki/Main_WoT_WebConf/2023_WoT_TPAC_Agenda#Discovery Discovery topics for TPAC 2023
14:10:51 [acimmino]
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14:11:50 [kaz]
-> https://www.w3.org/TR/2022/NOTE-wot-usecases-20220307/ WoT Use Cases and Requirements
14:12:06 [kaz]
mm: (refers to the WoT Use Cases and Requirements spec)
14:12:16 [kaz]
present+ Andrea_Cimmino
14:12:52 [kaz]
... (adds a link to the Use Cases spec to the agenda wiki)
14:13:21 [kaz]
-> https://www.w3.org/TR/wot-usecases/#sec-requirements-search-and-discovery 4.1.3 Search and Discovery
14:13:52 [kaz]
-> https://www.w3.org/TR/wot-usecases/#discovery 4.2.5 Discovery
14:14:14 [kaz]
-> https://www.w3.org/TR/wot-usecases/#Discovery 3.1 Discovery
14:14:17 [kaz]
q+
14:15:04 [kaz]
mm: It seems we use "#discovery" for section 4.2.5
14:15:18 [kaz]
... while we use "#Discovery" for section 3.1
14:15:31 [kaz]
kaz: We should use different IDs for them
14:15:42 [kaz]
mm: yeah, should fix it
14:17:26 [kaz]
... then we should review high-priority work items
14:19:33 [luca_barbato]
q+
14:20:02 [kaz]
-> https://github.com/w3c/wot-discovery/blob/main/requirements.md wot-discovery/requirements.md
14:20:04 [kaz]
ack k
14:20:26 [kaz]
mm: (shows the requirements.md document under the wot-discovery repo)
14:21:44 [kaz]
lb: would be great if you could clearly split the descriptions into the discovery part and the directory part
14:21:51 [kaz]
mm: what do you mean?
14:22:09 [kaz]
... technically, directory is part of discovery as a whole
14:22:28 [kaz]
q+
14:22:31 [kaz]
ack lu
14:23:18 [kaz]
... directory service is one way to pick a URL
14:24:00 [kaz]
lb: the part of directory is important but we don't need a full directory for all our requirements
14:24:22 [kaz]
mm: the overall purpose of WoT Discovery is finding a Thing Description
14:24:53 [kaz]
lb: one concern is how to get the information
14:25:43 [kaz]
... but another concern is how to aggregate the information
14:25:57 [kaz]
mm: we have to be careful about the terminology
14:27:48 [kaz]
... do you want to apply re-structuring for the requirements.md?
14:28:04 [kaz]
-> https://github.com/w3c/wot-discovery/blob/main/requirements.md requirements.md
14:29:08 [kaz]
lb: The introduction phase produces the Thing Description. Right?
14:29:31 [kaz]
mm: No no, the introduction phase produces a URL of some Thing Description
14:29:58 [kaz]
q?
14:30:25 [kaz]
lb: Before getting actual Thing Description, you can do something
14:30:40 [kaz]
... We don't need a full directory service
14:31:44 [kaz]
kaz: I basically agree with McCool, but can understand Luca's point too
14:32:08 [kaz]
... this requirements.md is an initial version of the possible requirements for WoT 2.0, and still need improvement
14:32:21 [kaz]
s/, and still need improvement//
14:32:39 [kaz]
... We still need to improve this description based on new use cases for WoT 2.0
14:34:13 [kaz]
... At that time, various settings of environments should be considered including both (1) discovery via a specific directory service and (2) discovery simply using some internally stored information without any directory
14:34:17 [kaz]
mm: right
14:35:32 [kaz]
lb: wondering about security bootstrap
14:36:19 [kaz]
-> https://w3c.github.io/wot-discovery/#architecture WoT Discovery - 4. Architecture
14:36:54 [kaz]
mm: if we don't have "base", we can get a full URL via "form"
14:37:21 [kaz]
... would say using URL is relative would not be a good practice
14:39:33 [kaz]
lb: would create an issue
14:39:42 [kaz]
q+
14:40:21 [kaz]
mm: for TPAC discussion, it would be right level of discussion to review the existing requirements with cross-references
14:40:59 [kaz]
kaz: yeah
14:41:58 [kaz]
... and for WoT 2.0 discussion, it would be nicer to clarify several possible/typical settings for each use case so that we can discuss what would be needed in which cases
14:42:01 [kaz]
mm: yeah
14:44:39 [kaz]
... somebody requires but somebody not
14:45:21 [kaz]
... should document both satisfied and unsatisfied requirements
14:46:06 [kaz]
... will send an email to ask the entire group for review
14:46:26 [kaz]
... any other topics for TPAC?
14:48:11 [kaz]
-> https://github.com/w3c/wot/blob/main/planning/Discovery/work-items.md wot/planning/Discovery/work-items.md
14:48:31 [kaz]
mm: (shows the list of work items for Discovery)
14:49:32 [kaz]
[[
14:49:33 [kaz]
Higher Priority
14:49:34 [kaz]
Discovery Query Filters
14:49:34 [kaz]
Discovery JSON Path Query Language
14:49:34 [kaz]
Placeholder - Sort-by Filtering
14:49:34 [kaz]
Related to query filters, since can be used to prioritize results
14:49:36 [kaz]
Need to define what to do with TDs that don't have field used for sorting
14:49:38 [kaz]
Placeholder - Improve Security
14:49:40 [kaz]
Subset of Discovery Improvements
14:49:42 [kaz]
Placeholder - Validation
14:49:44 [kaz]
Subset of Discovery Improvements
14:49:46 [kaz]
Placeholder - TD Versions
14:49:48 [kaz]
Subset of Discovery Improvements
14:49:50 [kaz]
Placeholder - Version Selection
14:49:52 [kaz]
Subset of Discovery Improvements
14:49:54 [kaz]
Placeholder - Additional Introductions
14:49:56 [kaz]
To be researched, but to support additional ecosystems
14:49:58 [kaz]
Examples: MQTT Discovery, OPC UA Discovery
14:50:00 [kaz]
]]
14:50:06 [kaz]
mm: note we don't have discovery for CoAP yet
14:50:47 [kaz]
... that is one missing piece
14:51:04 [kaz]
... need to think about which protocols to be supported
14:52:33 [kaz]
... we do support CoAP for TD but not support it for Directory
14:53:43 [kaz]
topic: PRs
14:53:49 [kaz]
subtopic: PR 513
14:54:00 [kaz]
-> https://github.com/w3c/wot-discovery/pull/513 PR 513 - Add wot-discovery to the list of the implementations
14:55:04 [kaz]
toumura: would be better to use the resource under wot-testing instead of implementations/hitachiintro.md
14:55:19 [kaz]
q+
14:55:52 [kaz]
(merged)
14:56:30 [kaz]
kaz: just to make sure, as Toumura-san suggested, the link for Hitachi's implementation is already changed to wot-testing?
14:56:33 [kaz]
mm: yes
14:57:54 [kaz]
subtopic: PR 514
14:58:52 [kaz]
-> https://github.com/w3c/wot-discovery/pull/514 PR 514 - Initial survey of other discovery mechanisms
14:59:34 [kaz]
toumura: no discovery mechanism for CoAP so far
14:59:51 [kaz]
mm: (adds several topics for "New requirements")
15:00:09 [kaz]
... CoAP directories (more protocols for exploration)
15:00:39 [kaz]
... MATT and OPC UA discovery
15:00:46 [kaz]
ack k
15:00:47 [kaz]
q+
15:00:54 [kaz]
ack k
15:01:42 [kaz]
-> https://www.w3.org/WoT/IG/wiki/Main_WoT_WebConf/2023_WoT_TPAC_Agenda#Discovery TPAC WoT agenda wiki - Discovery section
15:02:16 [kaz]
s/more protocols for exploration/e.g., "more protocols for exploration"/
15:02:44 [kaz]
s/MATT and OPC UA discovery/MQTT and OPC UA discovery (e.g., "more protocols for introductions")/
15:02:47 [kaz]
[adjourned]
15:02:51 [kaz]
rrsagent, make log public
15:03:00 [kaz]
rrsagent, draft minutes
15:03:01 [RRSAgent]
I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2023/09/04-wot-discovery-minutes.html kaz
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