14:01:08 <RRSAgent> RRSAgent has joined #wot-td
14:01:12 <RRSAgent> logging to https://www.w3.org/2023/08/02-wot-td-irc
14:01:29 <kaz> meeting: WoT-WG - TD-TF
14:01:37 <kaz> present+ Kaz_Ashimura, Luca_Barbato, Ege_Korkan
14:02:08 <kaz> agenda: https://www.w3.org/WoT/IG/wiki/Main_WoT_WebConf#2_August_2023
14:02:19 <kaz> chair: Ege
14:03:17 <kaz> s|https://www.w3.org/WoT/IG/wiki/Main_WoT_WebConf#2_August_2023|https://www.w3.org/WoT/IG/wiki/WG_WoT_Thing_Description_WebConf#August_2.2C_2023|
14:03:24 <kaz> rrsagent, make log public
14:03:28 <kaz> rrsagent, draft minutes
14:03:29 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2023/08/02-wot-td-minutes.html kaz
14:04:01 <cris__> cris__ has joined #wot-td
14:04:08 <kaz> regrets+ Koster
14:04:21 <kaz> present+ Cristiano_Aguzzi
14:06:44 <kaz> q+
14:07:36 <kaz> ack k
14:08:36 <kaz> topic: Logistics
14:08:57 <kaz> kaz: would it make sense to have a call today with 3 participants and a Team Contact?
14:09:08 <kaz> ... should be discussed as part of the policy discussion as well, though
14:10:07 <kaz> ... given we have several urgent issues, we still could discuss them
14:10:21 <kaz> i/would it/scribenick: kaz/
14:10:57 <luca_barbato> scribenick: luca_barbato
14:11:20 <luca_barbato> topic: Minutes
14:12:03 <luca_barbato> ege: I did an overall look and they look good for my point of view beside few typos
14:13:52 <Ege> q?
14:13:57 <kaz> typos fixed
14:14:06 <kaz> present+ Tomoaki_Mizushima
14:14:08 <kaz> ack k
14:14:14 <sebastian> sebastian has joined #wot-td
14:14:14 <luca_barbato> ege: Are the minutes fine now for everybody?
14:14:18 <luca_barbato> <approved>
14:14:33 <luca_barbato> topic: Organization
14:15:04 <kaz> s/Organization/Meeting schedule/
14:15:05 <luca_barbato> ege: Shall we have a call on Aug 23rd
14:15:16 <kaz> i|did an|-> https://www.w3.org/2023/07/26-wot-td-minutes.html July-26|
14:15:29 <kaz> ca: not available
14:15:39 <kaz> lb: should be available
14:15:42 <kaz> mizu: not available
14:16:36 <kaz> kaz: available if needed
14:16:36 <kaz> i/ca:/scribenick: kaz/
14:16:36 <kaz> q+
14:16:54 <kaz> ek: will check with Koster too
14:18:10 <kaz> kaz: given half of us mentioned they would not be available for 23rd, we can simply cancel it
14:18:41 <kaz> ek: what about next week on Aug 9?
14:18:41 <kaz> ... maybe Koster can chair the call. will check with him
14:19:06 <kaz> topic: TPAC agenda
14:19:08 <kaz> ek: being finalized
14:19:18 <kaz> -> https://www.w3.org/WoT/IG/wiki/Main_WoT_WebConf/2023_WoT_TPAC_Agenda TPAC agenda
14:19:30 <kaz> topic: Urgent PRs
14:20:13 <luca_barbato> ege: I add a new label for the changes in index.html
14:20:20 <kaz> s/I add/I've added/
14:20:20 <Ege> https://github.com/w3c/wot-thing-description/pulls?q=is%3Aopen+is%3Apr+label%3A%22by+REC+publication%22+label%3A%22changes+index.html%22
14:20:29 <kaz> s/https/-> https/
14:21:45 <kaz> s/html%22/html%22 TD PRs with "changes index.html" label/
14:21:47 <kaz> kaz: among all those four PRs, two of the (1858 and 1843) are important
14:21:58 <kaz> ... the other two are truly editorial
14:22:05 <kaz> i/among/scribenick: kaz/
14:22:12 <kaz> scribenick: luca_barbato
14:22:49 <Ege> proposal: The TD Task Force agrees that the PRs 1842, 1843, 1845, 1858 should be merged after approval of PLH and incorporated into the Recommendation version of the Thing Description 1.1
14:22:52 <JKRhb> JKRhb has joined #wot-td
14:23:35 <luca_barbato> kaz: Note that editorial bugfixes are allowed anytime, changes in the normative parts needs approval from the chairs
14:24:26 <luca_barbato> ege: shall we land them now or wait for a further approval?
14:24:35 <Ege> proposal: The TD Task Force agrees that the PRs 1842, 1843, 1845, 1858 should be merged group resolution next wednesday and incorporated into the Recommendation version of the Thing Description 1.1
14:24:53 <kaz> s/needs app/need app/
14:25:35 <Ege> proposal: The TD Task Force agrees that the PRs 1842, 1843, 1845, 1858 should be merged after a group resolution next wednesday and incorporated into the Recommendation version of the Thing Description 1.1
14:25:54 <luca_barbato> cris: Ok for me
14:27:03 <Ege> proposal: The TD Task Force agrees that the PRs 1843, 1858 should be merged after a group resolution next wednesday and incorporated into the Recommendation version of the Thing Description 1.1
14:27:58 <Ege> proposal: The TD Task Force agrees that the PRs 1843, 1858 should be merged after approval of PLH, incorporated into the Recommendation version of the Thing Description 1.1 and reported to the whole WG.
14:28:32 <Ege> resolution: The TD Task Force agrees that the PRs 1843, 1858 should be merged after approval of PLH, incorporated into the Recommendation version of the Thing Description 1.1 and reported to the whole WG.
14:30:15 <luca_barbato> topic: TPAC Agenda
14:30:36 <kaz> i/TPAC/(@@@ Kaz will remove the first 3 proposals from the minutes later)/
14:30:51 <kaz> rrsagent, draft minutes
14:30:53 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2023/08/02-wot-td-minutes.html kaz
14:31:12 <kaz> s/TPAC Agenda/TPAC Agenda - revisited/
14:33:27 <cris__> q+
14:33:33 <kaz> ack k
14:33:38 <kaz> q+
14:33:50 <luca_barbato> ege: I'll change the priority to the current list
14:33:50 <kaz> -> https://www.w3.org/WoT/IG/wiki/Main_WoT_WebConf/2023_WoT_TPAC_Agenda#Thing_Description Thing Description topics
14:34:25 <luca_barbato> cris: I second the proposed the prioritization
14:34:43 <luca_barbato> cris: The low priority topic can be discussed during other times?
14:35:05 <luca_barbato> ege: We have to be conservating on the amount of topics to touch since we just have 1 hour
14:35:27 <luca_barbato> kaz: We should concentrate on 1-2 topics
14:37:09 <luca_barbato> ege: We can move TD in RDF may be discussed in the joint session with JSON-LD
14:37:50 <kaz> s/1-2 topics/1-2 topics given we have only 1h+15m for this slot. Also we need to consider the possible joint discussion with the JSON-LD guys./
14:38:05 <kaz> q?
14:38:11 <kaz> ack c
14:38:12 <kaz> ack k
14:38:25 <luca_barbato> ege: Manageable Actions might be discussed if we have participation from other people of the hypermedia community
14:38:26 <kaz> q+
14:41:26 <luca_barbato> kaz: Might be useful to discuss use-cases as well
14:41:49 <Mizushima> +1 for kaz
14:48:11 <Ege> q?
14:48:19 <kaz> ack k
14:48:24 <luca_barbato> q+
14:48:51 <luca_barbato> kaz: We should not focus on future features, but discuss more on use-cases and makes sure to extract requirements that justify the features more
14:50:51 <luca_barbato> ege: We should be already well set for some of our pending features (e.g. timeseries)
14:53:23 <kaz> kaz: We've been holding discussion on topics for the next Charter period, so we should continue our discussion based on that result.
14:53:32 <kaz> i/We've/scribenick: kaz/
14:54:06 <kaz> ack k
14:54:29 <kaz> ack lu
14:54:31 <kaz> q+
14:54:54 <kaz> s/We've been/Right. We've been/
14:57:29 <luca_barbato> lu: use-cases and the process of extracting features should probably be part of a wider group discussion and given the allotted time at TPAC I would not spend time on it specifically
14:57:37 <kaz> present+ Jan_Romann
14:57:43 <Ege> q?
14:58:55 <luca_barbato> lu: we have already enough requirements (e.g. my set of current pain points in 1.1) so we somebody cares more about others should had already asked about them, we can discuss regarding how to improve the use-case process and do better outreach (e.g what we are doing with the mqtt community now) but
14:59:08 <luca_barbato> it is again something for the larger group to discuss in my opinion.
14:59:19 <kaz> s/it is/... it is/
15:00:21 <luca_barbato> kaz: We could discuss the pain points during the TPAC TD slot
15:01:01 <kaz> ack k
15:01:27 <luca_barbato> ege: Can move on to the next topic
15:02:18 <luca_barbato> topic: PR 1862 (resource versioning/serving)
15:03:18 <JKRhb> q+
15:03:31 <cris__> q+
15:04:13 <kaz> i|-> https://github.com/w3c/wot-thing-description/pull/1862 PR 1862 - Add rec10 resources
15:04:23 <kaz> rrsagent, draft minutes
15:04:24 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2023/08/02-wot-td-minutes.html kaz
15:05:34 <cris__> ack c
15:05:41 <kaz> i/use-cases and the/scribenick: luca_barbato/
15:05:47 <kaz> rrsagent, draft minutes
15:05:48 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2023/08/02-wot-td-minutes.html kaz
15:05:55 <kaz> q+
15:05:55 <Ege> q?
15:05:56 <kaz> ack j
15:06:27 <luca_barbato> jkr: td-context-1.1 for rec10 ?
15:06:50 <luca_barbato> ege: It is correct, potentially it is because json-ld 1.1
15:07:34 <luca_barbato> ege: in 2.0 we should overahul everything so it is less confusing
15:08:07 <luca_barbato> ege: for rec10 and rec11 I'd not make radical changes
15:08:26 <luca_barbato> kaz: is it to be done now?
15:08:45 <luca_barbato> ege: I'd land them before the rec is published
15:09:31 <luca_barbato> kaz: Does it have impact to the implementations?
15:14:17 <luca_barbato> q+
15:14:19 <kaz> ack k
15:14:32 <cris__> q+
15:14:57 <kaz> s/implementations?/implementations? All the mechanism around this update (and other proposed updates) should be described a bit more./
15:15:06 <kaz> rrsagent, draft minutes
15:15:07 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2023/08/02-wot-td-minutes.html kaz
15:15:18 <kaz> topic: PR 1863
15:15:34 <kaz> -> https://github.com/w3c/wot-thing-description/pull/1863 PR 1863 - Add rec11 resources
15:17:19 <kaz> q+
15:17:22 <luca_barbato> lu: Embedding date to the version we could do better and make it fitting semver
15:17:24 <kaz> ack lu
15:18:07 <luca_barbato> cris: we needed to embedd the date to make so the npm packages fit
15:18:34 <luca_barbato> cris: We can change the schema on release to 1.1
15:19:31 <luca_barbato> ege: We might change the schema to include bugfixes
15:19:37 <luca_barbato> ... in the future
15:20:45 <kaz> ack cris
15:20:46 <kaz> ack k
15:20:54 <cris__> cris: for reference this is the package that we are generating using the schema -> https://www.npmjs.com/package/wot-thing-description-types/v/1.1.0-20-July-2022?activeTab=versions
15:22:49 <luca_barbato> q+
15:22:53 <kaz> kaz: again, as I mentioned for PR 1862, we should summarize what is needed for what, and which implementation would get impacts from this proposed change too. Then should clarify what kind of notation would fit with the need./
15:23:06 <kaz> s|need./|need.|
15:23:56 <luca_barbato> _pre20231212
15:26:25 <Ege> q?
15:26:27 <Ege> ack l
15:26:29 <luca_barbato> topic: PR 1861
15:27:31 <kaz> -> https://github.com/w3c/wot-thing-description/pull/1861 PR 1861 - Desired namespaces for 1.0 and 1.1 resources
15:27:32 <luca_barbato> ege: This PR updates the desidered namespaces for the resources
15:29:19 <kaz> q+
15:31:17 <luca_barbato> kaz: Do we really need so long urls?
15:31:48 <luca_barbato> q+
15:31:57 <kaz> ack k
15:32:16 <kaz> s/long urls/long URLs under the publication subdirectory?/
15:32:21 <kaz> q+
15:33:24 <luca_barbato> lu: Cannot we just rely on tags?
15:36:25 <luca_barbato> lu: we can customize the github action to publish to pages
15:38:36 <luca_barbato> kaz: it is not ideal to put ratified resources on github.io
15:38:55 <luca_barbato> kaz: we could use a separate repository for the ratified resources
15:39:24 <cris__> q+
15:40:17 <Ege> ack l
15:40:18 <Ege> ack k
15:41:13 <kaz> s/it is not ideal to put ratified resources on github.io/The "publication" area is a temporary area for publication, e.g., Pubrules checker and Validator, so I don't think it would be ideal to put those resources under that area./
15:41:59 <luca_barbato> lu: We should produce specific artifacts in github release
15:43:39 <kaz> s/we could use a separate repository for the ratified resources/We should have some more discussion about where to pub. For example, we could even use a separate dedicated repository to manage this kind of resources if needed./
15:43:46 <kaz> ack k
15:43:50 <kaz> ack c
15:45:04 <kaz> kaz: Given this kind of resources are rather stable, we don't need to think about GitHub actions to maintain the resource but should still think about which location would be better for implementers later./
15:45:10 <kaz> s|later./|later.|
15:45:18 <luca_barbato> cris: it is better to make sure we put the resources in a permanent storage and not keep them as copies in git main branches
15:47:23 <kaz> q+
15:55:57 <kaz> ack k
15:56:22 <kaz> kaz: would suggest we ask JSON-LD/VC guys for advice about this
15:56:27 <kaz> ek: good idea
15:58:06 <kaz> topic: TPAC participation
15:58:22 <kaz> (Ege ask people about their participation in TPAC 2023)
15:58:28 <kaz> q+
15:59:05 <kaz> kaz: please update the TPAC WoT wiki's participation section based on your latest situation
16:00:03 <kaz> -> https://www.w3.org/WoT/IG/wiki/Main_WoT_WebConf/2023_WoT_TPAC_Agenda#Presence Presence section
16:00:10 <kaz> s/participation section/presence section/
16:00:18 <kaz> [adjourned]
16:00:23 <kaz> rrsagent, draft minutes
16:00:24 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2023/08/02-wot-td-minutes.html kaz