IRC log of wcag3-policy on 2023-06-19

Timestamps are in UTC.

15:58:06 [RRSAgent]
RRSAgent has joined #wcag3-policy
15:58:10 [RRSAgent]
logging to https://www.w3.org/2023/06/19-wcag3-policy-irc
15:58:14 [Zakim]
Zakim has joined #wcag3-policy
15:58:33 [shadi]
meeting: Policy Guidance Subgroup
15:58:37 [shadi]
chair: shadi
15:58:41 [shadi]
present+ shadi
15:59:21 [shadi]
meeting: Guidance for Policy Makers Subgroup
16:01:59 [Azlan]
Azlan has joined #wcag3-policy
16:03:08 [Cyborg]
Cyborg has joined #wcag3-policy
16:04:24 [Azlan]
present+
16:04:31 [Cyborg]
Present+
16:04:32 [Jason_k]
Jason_k has joined #wcag3-policy
16:04:40 [Jason_k]
present+
16:04:52 [garcialo2]
garcialo2 has joined #wcag3-policy
16:06:26 [Jason_k]
scribe: Jason_k
16:07:43 [Cyborg_]
Cyborg_ has joined #wcag3-policy
16:07:48 [garcialo2]
present+
16:07:49 [Cyborg_]
Present+
16:08:51 [Jason_k]
Topic: Potential 3 Week Extension
16:09:37 [Jason_k]
Shadi: Sent in email, spoke with chairs given that we had several holidays. Chairs said if the group agrees, they will be happy to extend by 3 weeks
16:10:10 [Azlan]
Happy to continue
16:10:16 [garcialo2]
+1
16:10:33 [Cyborg__]
Cyborg__ has joined #wcag3-policy
16:10:33 [Cyborg__]
Present+
16:10:38 [Cyborg__]
+1
16:10:41 [Jason_k]
+1
16:10:57 [Jason_k]
Shadi: Agreement of subgroup and no objections by email
16:11:13 [Cyborg__]
sorry i was having trouble with windows so had to leave and come back to IRC a few times. here again and yes i'm in favour of extension
16:11:40 [Jason_k]
Topic 2: Slides for AGWCAG
16:11:51 [shadi]
https://docs.google.com/presentation/d/1y_uNtKFOrvVmtVgDmqWTHe_vsLwTfXYBJQ39un6UKNE/edit#slide=id.p
16:12:33 [Jason_k]
... Some email feedback, these are just the slides. Try to minimize text to avoid distraction. Tried to find balance with people who will just read them.
16:12:57 [Cyborg__]
q+
16:13:35 [Cyborg__]
concern about objectives - same as per written in scratch pad
16:14:31 [Jason_k]
... Reviewed slides (as written on 6/19)
16:18:03 [Cyborg__]
we've also referred to them as "organizational practices"
16:18:43 [Jason_k]
Luis: Put SLA, didn't know if that was a generic enough term
16:19:30 [Jason_k]
Shadi: Different orgs have different terms, changed to expected time/ process for reponsiding to users to make it more general
16:24:30 [Jason_k]
... is overall approach okay? 10-15 mins only. Any thoughts?
16:25:13 [Jason_k]
Luis- overall it looks good. Assume there will be questions. 8 slides feels good.
16:26:39 [shadi]
ack Cyborg__
16:27:25 [Jason_k]
Cybele: Slide on objective, and slide on intent; split with prior work. in addition to prior work, there were prior critique. This was strong about concerns about watering down or creating exceptions
16:27:50 [Jason_k]
... have a statement to make it clear to make accessibility more likely to happen, and not reduce it
16:30:58 [Jason_k]
... for example all this content got upload, and now can get an exemption to accessible. Now with this group, its to find means to how to make it accessible. What is the strategy to get there rather than how we avoid doing it
16:33:08 [Jason_k]
Cybele: Wants to respond to that critique that the moment it re-enters, there is a response to that. WCAG 3 is not embedding exemptions. We need a firm statement
16:34:29 [Jason_k]
Agreement with this thought by group. Some rewording of this for the slide.
16:37:12 [Jason_k]
Shadi: There are 2 sets of docs, one is editorial improvement of use cases of WCAG 3. The other is a suggestion, will link from subgroup page, on how policy guidance will look like
16:37:53 [Jason_k]
... we did not manage to get consensus. This is what we are trying to continue.
16:38:46 [Jason_k]
Cybele: Haven't seen concern manifest, its the history of this issue
16:40:06 [Jason_k]
Shadi: Use case doc is a new start. we need to distinguish from technical standard and policy. Want to explore, can we think beyond WCAG. These are real world issues and what can we do about it
16:41:17 [Jason_k]
Luis: Framing it for myself, policy is there to help create policy culture of the enviornment. What to do/not to do to behave a certain way. We are doing a similar way
16:41:46 [Jason_k]
... These are things are ways of doing things, to allow you to opperate in a more accessible manner
16:42:59 [garcialo2]
Jason_K: Do we have questions to clarify or pain points? Now might be a good time to bring it up.
16:44:25 [Jason_k]
Cybele: Slide 6- possible use of some form of 'protocols', instead of organizations practices
16:44:25 [Cyborg__]
organizational practices
16:45:34 [Jason_k]
Shadi: Can put in speaker notes and definitely mention that.
16:46:36 [Jason_k]
Cybele: Organizational practices (as refered in CSUN) wouldn't relate to some of the bullet points. Its in the conformance proposal. There are measureable conformance, and organizational practices which can be asserted and described. Could be done in practice or a maturity model.
16:47:08 [Jason_k]
... could be done in organizational level, or a level of granularity your referering to in bullet point 1
16:48:01 [Jason_k]
... other question, we are switching to phase 2, does that mean we have finished phase 1?
16:48:38 [Jason_k]
Shadi: No, and maybe that's an outstanding issue; we really didn't have the time.
16:49:43 [Jason_k]
... I think new model, have short groups, knowing that its quick iterations. leaning on agile, come back and say its rough but these are the broad strokes coming out. Then get permission to continue to evolve certain areas
16:50:03 [Jason_k]
... no, we didn't get the time, but thats by design/intention
16:51:49 [Jason_k]
Cybele: I think what has come out of this group so far, is that where there isn't a clear WCAG standard, the stadnard is difficult to be normative, more process based verse technical, can be more challenging due to scenarios, then WCAG could suggest these proctols and tool to support orgs to establish their own procotols to address scenerios.. give them pathways to accessibility
16:52:45 [Jason_k]
Luis: My thought is that this is some potential interesting finding. summary some ideas, of things that have stood out
16:52:59 [Jason_k]
... not establishing policies, or how it will work into WCAG.
16:53:13 [Jason_k]
... just from our converstaions, what are some of the interesting points that have come up
16:53:17 [Azlan]
+1
16:53:40 [Jason_k]
... not a summary of everything, just a sampling
16:53:57 [Cyborg__]
q+
16:54:51 [Jason_k]
Cybele: I like that because it makes it less conclusive.
16:55:17 [Jason_k]
... What's been positive/exciting is discovery of opportunities and pathways. Thinking about key examples
16:56:48 [shadi]
ack Cyborg__
16:57:13 [Jason_k]
Luis: This is something that's being considered, and we are doing this work to see if this is something that should be done based on this content (to put together a formal doc)
16:57:28 [Jason_k]
... here were we are, some interesting things that come up, keep people updated
16:58:07 [Cyborg__]
as an example, i think the indexing of new inaccessible content, so that requests to get access lead to requesting accessibility ...
16:58:23 [Jason_k]
Shadi: Spent time thinking about this, and excited about different pathways aswell. Not sure if we've gotten there yet, just discussions so far
16:59:47 [Cyborg__]
ok
16:59:50 [Jason_k]
... next phase we'll figure out if we can get it into an outline
17:01:19 [Jason_k]
Shadi: encourage if there are high level questions, it can happen in the discussion.First leave others to react, if they are silent, please chime in with questions
17:01:40 [Jason_k]
Luis: Do we need to say this is where we are?
17:02:11 [Jason_k]
Shadi: will think of something to add to slide
17:04:38 [Cyborg__]
thank you Shadi!
17:05:04 [shadi]
zakim, end meeting
17:05:04 [Zakim]
As of this point the attendees have been shadi, Azlan, Cyborg, Jason_k, garcialo, Cyborg_, Cyborg__
17:05:06 [Zakim]
RRSAgent, please draft minutes
17:05:07 [RRSAgent]
I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2023/06/19-wcag3-policy-minutes.html Zakim
17:05:10 [Zakim]
I am happy to have been of service, shadi; please remember to excuse RRSAgent. Goodbye
17:05:14 [Zakim]
Zakim has left #wcag3-policy
17:05:21 [shadi]
rrsagent, make logs world
17:05:31 [shadi]
rrsagent, make minutes
17:05:32 [RRSAgent]
I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2023/06/19-wcag3-policy-minutes.html shadi
17:06:20 [garcialo2]
garcialo2 has left #wcag3-policy
17:16:27 [shadi]
RRSAgent, bye
17:16:27 [RRSAgent]
I see no action items