12:02:06 <RRSAgent> RRSAgent has joined #wot
12:02:11 <RRSAgent> logging to https://www.w3.org/2023/05/17-wot-irc
12:02:28 <kaz> meeting: WoT-WG/IG
12:02:47 <MIzushima> MIzushima has joined #wot
12:02:58 <kaz> present+ Kaz_Ashimura, Michael_McCool, Kunihiko_Toumura, Luca_Barbato, Michael_Kostr, Sebastian_Kaebisch, Tomoaki_Mizushima
12:03:57 <kaz> agenda: https://www.w3.org/WoT/IG/wiki/Main_WoT_WebConf#17_May_2023
12:04:55 <kaz> scribenick: sebastian
12:05:32 <sebastian> MM: there was a IE request
12:05:55 <sebastian> ... in the chairs call decided not to accept
12:06:35 <sebastian> MM: we have not guest today
12:06:48 <sebastian> s/not/no
12:06:53 <sebastian> topic: minutes
12:07:15 <sebastian> -> https://www.w3.org/2023/04/26-wot-minutes.html
12:07:41 <sebastian> s/minutes/review minutes from Apr-26
12:08:38 <kaz> s/html/html Apr-26/
12:08:41 <sebastian> MM: any updates or objections?
12:08:49 <sebastian> no, minutes approved
12:09:01 <sebastian> topic: Quick updates
12:09:03 <kaz> i/there was/topic: Guests and IEs/
12:09:11 <sebastian> subtopic: Cancellations
12:09:15 <kaz> present+ Ege_Korkan
12:09:39 <sebastian> MM: next week is ambiguous
12:10:09 <ryuichi> ryuichi has joined #wot
12:10:12 <sebastian> Kaz: he best possibility we might want to mention two weeks advance
12:10:24 <sebastian> s/he/the
12:10:39 <sebastian> MM: we need to make decission about Profile
12:11:04 <kaz> present+ Daniel_Peintner, Ryuichi_Matsukura
12:11:12 <sebastian> ... Ben would be main contributor
12:11:52 <sebastian> MM:  proposal suspend Profile work until the end of the Charter and then restart the new Charter.
12:11:59 <kaz> s/the best possibility we might want to mention two weeks advance/We should put concrete date for each meeting. Note that sometimes we want to cancel meetings within two weeks./
12:12:20 <sebastian> MM: any objections?
12:12:24 <sebastian> no
12:12:57 <kaz> s/We need to make/We should put a specific deadline here, also/
12:13:13 <dape> dape has joined #wot
12:13:13 <sebastian> subtopic: AC meeting debrief
12:14:35 <sebastian> Kaz: there was some discussion about internal W3C topics
12:14:37 <sebastian> ... if you are member there are minutes available
12:14:54 <kaz> s/W3C topics/W3C topics, e.g., Legal Entity updates./
12:15:07 <kaz> s/member/a Member/
12:15:13 <sebastian> topic: WG Charter review status
12:15:27 <cris_> cris_ has joined #wot
12:15:51 <kaz> -> https://github.com/w3c/strategy/issues/375 Strategy pipeline issue 375
12:16:02 <sebastian> MM: there was a comment about the rechartering
12:16:09 <kaz> s/issue 375/issue 375 for WoT WG Rechartering/
12:16:18 <kaz> q+
12:16:48 <sebastian> ... the comment is from APA
12:17:31 <sebastian> <MM enters a respont in the issue>
12:17:35 <kaz> ack k
12:18:15 <sebastian> MM: I think, it is not a blocker on the Charter
12:18:35 <sebastian> ... expect a decission next week
12:18:51 <kaz> present+ Cristiano_Aguzzi
12:18:59 <kaz> q+
12:19:31 <kaz> ack k
12:19:42 <kaz> s/decission/decision/
12:19:55 <sebastian> Kaz: I created  a wiki page for the Chair's role definition
12:20:10 <sebastian> ... only accessable for the chair candidates
12:20:21 <kaz> s/wiki page/GitHub repo/
12:20:35 <sebastian> topic: TPAC 2023 planning
12:20:54 <kaz> -> https://www.w3.org/2002/09/wbs/1/GroupsTPAC2023/ TPAC 2023 questionnaire (Member-only)
12:21:09 <sebastian> MM: there was a questionnaire to provide the number of attendees and the planed joint meetings
12:21:43 <sebastian> <MM shows the latest submitted questionnaire version>
12:23:04 <sebastian> ... currently we plan in persons 10 people
12:24:21 <sebastian> ... we need joint meetings between two groups
12:24:55 <sebastian> Kaz: there should be also extra chairs
12:26:18 <sebastian> s/two groups/two goups which requires corresponding room space
12:27:29 <kaz> s/extra chairs/extra chairs for observers/
12:28:17 <sebastian> MM: the WoT meetings are planned for Thursday and Friday, right?
12:28:19 <sebastian> Kaz: yes
12:29:12 <sebastian> MM: I thought there are 2x2h meetings each day
12:30:02 <sebastian> Kaz: depends on the agenda
12:31:23 <kaz> s/agenda/agenda. For example, if we rather prefer holding our own vF2F meeting separately before or after the TPAC week, just having discussion in afternoon is ok./
12:32:47 <kaz> resolution: WoT WG/IG will have the joint F2F meeting during TPAC on Thursday/Friday only in the afternoon.
12:32:48 <McCool_> proposal: For TPAC 2023 qs response, change to two sessions each day, afternoon slots on Thursday and Friday.
12:32:54 <kaz> s/resolution: WoT WG/IG will have the joint F2F meeting during TPAC on Thursday/Friday only in the afternoon.//
12:33:36 <sebastian> +1
12:33:40 <McCool_> resolution: For TPAC 2023 qs response, change to two sessions each day, afternoon slots on Thursday and Friday.
12:33:44 <kaz> rrsagent, make log public
12:33:49 <kaz> rrsagent, draft minutes
12:33:50 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2023/05/17-wot-minutes.html kaz
12:34:06 <sebastian> topic: Planning
12:34:11 <kaz> chair: McCool/Sebastian
12:34:28 <sebastian> MM:  we have to look at our schedule.
12:34:48 <Ege> q+
12:34:52 <kaz> s|IG will have the joint F2F meeting during TPAC on Thursday/Friday only in the afternoon.//IG will have the joint F2F meeting during TPAC on Thursday/Friday only in the afternoon.||
12:34:55 <kaz> rrsagent, draft minutes
12:34:56 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2023/05/17-wot-minutes.html kaz
12:35:06 <dezell> dezell has joined #wot
12:35:08 <sebastian> <MM shows a PR that updates the timetable>
12:35:11 <sebastian> -> https://github.com/w3c/wot/pull/1089/files
12:35:15 <dezell> present+ David_Ezell
12:35:56 <sebastian> MM: to be realistic, new charter will start in July
12:36:17 <sebastian> MM: is it ok to merge this PR?
12:36:18 <kaz> i|we have to look|-> https://github.com/w3c/wot/blob/main/charters/wg-2021-extension-plan.md Schedule|
12:36:21 <kaz> q?
12:36:23 <kaz> ack e
12:36:29 <kaz> rrsagent, draft minutes
12:36:30 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2023/05/17-wot-minutes.html kaz
12:36:47 <sebastian> no objections
12:37:17 <sebastian> Ege: the binding template publications date is outdated
12:37:33 <sebastian> s/no objections/
12:38:14 <kaz> q+
12:38:28 <sebastian> Ege: there was already a call for resolution in March 13th
12:40:18 <sebastian> MM: lets ask for resolution agian here
12:40:39 <Ege> proposal: After the merge of the two editorial PRs, the Binding Templates core document can be published: https://github.com/w3c/wot-binding-templates/pull/288 and https://github.com/w3c/wot-binding-templates/pull/286
12:41:04 <kaz> -> https://www.w3.org/2023/03/29-wot-td-minutes.html March-29 TD minutes
12:41:25 <sebastian> s/resolution again here/call for resolution
12:42:26 <sebastian> Ege: there was also an email sent out
12:42:33 <sebastian> MM: any objections?
12:42:35 <sebastian> no
12:42:54 <kaz> -> https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Member/member-wot-wg/2023Apr/0005.html Call for Review for Binding
12:43:29 <Ege> resolution: After the merge of the two editorial PRs, the Binding Templates core document can be published: https://github.com/w3c/wot-binding-templates/pull/288 and https://github.com/w3c/wot-binding-templates/pull/286
12:43:42 <sebastian> +1
12:44:56 <sebastian> Ege: individual bindings are not part of the publications
12:44:56 <kaz> -> https://github.com/w3c/wot-binding-templates/pull/288 PR 288 - Make XML Binding "planned"
12:45:20 <kaz> -> https://github.com/w3c/wot-binding-templates/pull/286 PR 286 - Fix Editorial issues and examples
12:46:10 <kaz> s/no/kaz: I'm OK with this resolution itself given those belated PRs are completely editorial, but we should confirm they're completely editorial./
12:46:15 <kaz> rrsagent, draft minutes
12:46:16 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2023/05/17-wot-minutes.html kaz
12:46:37 <kaz> s|resolution: After the merge of the two editorial PRs, the Binding Templates core document can be published: https://github.com/w3c/wot-binding-templates/pull/288 and https://github.com/w3c/wot-binding-templates/pull/286||
12:46:41 <kaz> s/+1//
12:46:53 <sebastian> <MM shows the PRs>
12:47:25 <sebastian> Kaz: please place a resolution again
12:47:53 <sebastian> MM: any objections about the PRs?
12:47:56 <Ege> resolution: After the merge of the two editorial PRs, the Binding Templates core document can be published: https://github.com/w3c/wot-binding-templates/pull/288 and https://github.com/w3c/wot-binding-templates/pull/286
12:47:57 <sebastian> no
12:48:13 <kaz> s/no/
12:48:18 <McCool_> https://github.com/w3c/wot/pull/1089 changes dates, including start of next charter
12:48:24 <kaz> i/After/(no objections)/
12:48:29 <kaz> rrsagent, draft minutes
12:48:30 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2023/05/17-wot-minutes.html kaz
12:48:36 <McCool_> proposal: Change the proposed start date of the next charter to July 1, 2023
12:48:46 <sebastian> +1
12:49:02 <McCool_> resolution: Change the proposed start date of the next charter to July 1, 2023
12:49:56 <sebastian> Kaz: the start / end date does not be edit in the charter. W3M will provide the dates
12:50:17 <sebastian> topic: Testfest
12:50:40 <sebastian> MM: Today we completed testing
12:50:58 <sebastian> <MM shows the latest results>
12:51:36 <sebastian> -> https://github.com/w3c/wot-testing/tree/main/events/2023.03.Online
12:51:54 <sebastian> MM: Arch and TD in a very good shape
12:52:07 <kaz> s|the start / end date does not be edit in the charter. W3M will provide the dates|We don't need to update the start/end dates every time, because the draft Charter says [[date of the "Call for Participation", when the charter is approved]].|
12:52:11 <kaz> rrsagent, draft minutes
12:52:13 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2023/05/17-wot-minutes.html kaz
12:52:19 <sebastian> ... Discovery is a bit worse shape
12:53:03 <sebastian> ... however, we manage to the cought up the most things
12:54:52 <sebastian> <MM shows Discovery's high, medium and lower priority assertations>
12:55:06 <kaz> [[
12:55:08 <kaz> Architecture
12:55:08 <kaz> See the WoT Architecture 1.1 Developer Meeting Presentation for explanations of each at-risk assertion and current status. The number before each assertion is the number of implementations still needed to resolve them.
12:55:08 <kaz> List of assertions to resolve (low priority):
12:55:09 <kaz> (1) arch-security-consideration-hal-refuse-unsafe
12:55:09 <kaz> Additional assertions which however have problems and we will retire without attempting to test:
12:55:10 <kaz> (1) arch-security-consideration-use-psk
12:55:12 <kaz> (2) arch-security-consideration-dtls-1-3
12:55:14 <kaz> Thing Description
12:55:16 <kaz> See WoT Thing Description 1.1 Developer Meeting Presentation for explanations of each at-risk assertion and current status.
12:55:19 <kaz> List of assertions to resolve.
12:55:21 <kaz> High Priority
12:55:23 <kaz> All high-priority assertions have been resolved. See w3c/wot-thing-description#1813
12:55:25 <kaz> Medium Priority
12:55:29 <kaz> (1) privacy-immutable-id-as-property Intel to do
12:55:31 <kaz> Lower Priority
12:55:33 <kaz> Less-used features, guidelines
12:55:35 <kaz> (2) td-security-oauth2-device-flow
12:55:37 <kaz> (2) security-context-secure-fetch
12:55:39 <kaz> Discovery
12:55:41 <kaz> See WoT Discovery Developer Meeting Presentation for explanations of each at-risk assertion and current status.
12:55:44 <kaz> The number before each assertion is the number of implementations still needed to resolve them.
12:55:46 <kaz> High Priority
12:55:48 <kaz> List of higher-priority assertions with at least one implementation:
12:55:50 <kaz> (1) tdd-registrationinfo-expiry-config - Intel
12:55:50 <sebastian> MM: High and medium have 4 assertions left
12:55:52 <kaz> These are in support of internationalization, and were added based on wide review, so should be a relatively high priority.
12:55:55 <kaz> (2) tdd-http-alternate-language - Intel
12:55:59 <kaz> (1) tdd-validation-response-lang - Intel
12:56:01 <kaz> Medium Priority
12:56:02 <McCool_> proposal: Conclude testing and proceed with preparation of the PR draft for Architecture 1.1.
12:56:03 <kaz> This is needed because if diff is ignored, result will be different than expected. However, it should be very easy to implement (if an implementation does not support diff, it just has to say so). Note that diff itself IS satisfied by other implementations already, so this is for those that do NOT implement it!
12:56:07 <kaz> (2) tdd-notification-data-diff-unsupported - Intel, Logilab
12:56:09 <kaz> Lower Priority
12:56:11 <kaz> These have one implementation but are in security considerations and can be converted into "guidelines", so are a lower priority.
12:56:14 <kaz> (1) sec-tdd-query-watchdog
12:56:16 <kaz> (1) sec-tdd-intro-no-multicast
12:56:18 <kaz> These have two but are also in security/privacy considerations and can be converted into "guidelines", so are also lower priority:
12:56:21 <kaz> (2) sec-tdd-throttle-queries
12:56:23 <kaz> (2) sec-tdd-limit-query-complexity
12:56:25 <kaz> (2) sec-tdd-intro-limit-response-size
12:56:29 <kaz> (2) sec-tdd-intro-throttling
12:56:31 <kaz> (1) sec-self-proxy - Intel?
12:56:33 <kaz> (2) priv-loc-disable-public-directories
12:56:35 <kaz> (2) priv-loc-anonymous-tds - Intel?
12:56:37 <kaz> (2) priv-loc-gen-ids - Intel?
12:56:39 <kaz> (2) priv-loc-explicit-strip
12:56:41 <kaz> (2) priv-query-anon
12:56:43 <kaz> This is for security bootstrapping with OAuth, would be useful for onboarding:
12:56:45 <kaz> (2) exploration-secboot-oauth2-flows
12:56:47 <kaz> ]]
12:56:49 <kaz> @@@ the style to be fixed later
12:56:55 <McCool_> proposal: Conclude testing and proceed with preparation of the PR draft for Architecture 1.1.
12:57:32 <sebastian> MM: any objections?
12:57:44 <kaz> s|proposal: Conclude testing and proceed with preparation of the PR draft for Architecture 1.1.||
12:57:45 <sebastian> no
12:57:47 <McCool_> resolution: Conclude testing and proceed with preparation of the PR draft for Architecture 1.1.
12:58:03 <sebastian> MM: same for TD:
12:58:19 <kaz> q?
12:58:21 <kaz> ack k
12:58:23 <McCool_> proposal: Conclude testing and proceed with preparation of the PR draft for TD 1.1.
12:58:25 <kaz> q+ Ege
12:58:39 <kaz> q+
12:58:40 <kaz> ack e
12:58:55 <sebastian> Ege: What happens if somebody actually submits a test input?
12:59:52 <sebastian> MM: if you have results until tomorrow, we could probably squeeze it in
13:00:01 <McCool_> proposal: Conclude testing and proceed with preparation of the PR draft for TD 1.1.
13:00:08 <sebastian> MM: any objections?
13:00:17 <sebastian> no
13:00:26 <McCool_> resolution: Conclude testing and proceed with preparation of the PR draft for TD 1.1
13:01:47 <McCool_> proposal: Conclude testing and proceed with preparation of the PR draft for Discovery
13:01:54 <kaz> i/proposal:/kaz: Given (1) the original deadline was 2 weeks ago and (2) we're making resolution for Proposed Rec transition now, we should finalize the implementation report now. We still can accept implementation reports themselves any time./
13:02:07 <kaz> q+
13:02:21 <McCool_> resolution: Conclude testing and proceed with preparation of the PR draft for Discovery
13:02:51 <kaz> ack k
13:03:52 <McCool_> proposal: Each TF will be responsible for how to resolve remaining at-risk assertions, then there will be a one-week review of the final PR drafts.
13:04:17 <McCool_> resolution: Each TF will be responsible for how to resolve remaining at-risk assertions, then there will be a one-week review of the final PR drafts.
13:04:46 <kaz> i/Each/kaz: fine with the resolutions to move ahead, but we should record how to proceed with the drafts for PR publication, e.g., removing features, making some of them informative, changing "MUST" to "must"./
13:04:54 <sebastian> topic: next charter
13:04:55 <kaz> rrsagent, draft minutes
13:04:57 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2023/05/17-wot-minutes.html kaz
13:05:35 <kaz> i/Each/MM: OK. Let's record another resolution for that purpose./
13:05:35 <sebastian> MM: we need to plan a meeting to organize next charter (schedule, planed deliverables, etc)
13:05:50 <sebastian> ... Kaz will provide a doodle
13:06:00 <kaz> [adjourned]
13:06:01 <sebastian> adjourn
13:06:06 <kaz> s/[adjourned]//
13:06:13 <kaz> rrsagent, draft minutes
13:06:14 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2023/05/17-wot-minutes.html kaz
13:06:23 <sebastian> I have to go, see you in TD call
13:06:48 <kaz> (Test call starts in 24 mins for quick updates)
13:06:51 <kaz> rrsagent, draft minutes
13:06:52 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2023/05/17-wot-minutes.html kaz
13:33:00 <MIzushima> MIzushima has left #wot
15:04:49 <Zakim> Zakim has left #wot