IRC log of wot-uc on 2023-04-18
Timestamps are in UTC.
- 12:05:24 [RRSAgent]
- RRSAgent has joined #wot-uc
- 12:05:28 [RRSAgent]
- logging to https://www.w3.org/2023/04/18-wot-uc-irc
- 12:05:32 [kaz]
- meeting: WoT Use Cases
- 12:05:40 [kaz]
- chair: Lagally
- 12:05:55 [kaz]
- present+ Kaz_Ashimura, Michael_Lagally, Michael_McCool, Tomoaki_Mizushima
- 12:06:17 [kaz]
- q+
- 12:06:35 [McCool]
- topic: housekeeping
- 12:07:29 [McCool]
- ml: let's review minutes from April 4 and 11
- 12:08:12 [kaz]
- ack k
- 12:08:57 [McCool]
- kaz: I think we already reviewed April 4
- 12:08:58 [kaz]
- i/let's/scribenick: McCool/
- 12:09:08 [McCool]
- ml: I see, ok, no agenda
- 12:09:15 [kaz]
- -> https://www.w3.org/2023/04/11-wot-uc-minutes.html Apr-11
- 12:09:18 [McCool]
- ... so let's just look at April 11
- 12:09:24 [kaz]
- s|-> https://www.w3.org/2023/04/11-wot-uc-minutes.html Apr-11||
- 12:09:26 [kaz]
- -> https://www.w3.org/2023/04/11-wot-uc-minutes.html Apr-11
- 12:09:44 [McCool]
- ... seems to be some formatting issues that need to be corrected
- 12:09:53 [McCool]
- kaz: formatting issues have been corrected
- 12:11:31 [McCool]
- ml: also a deletion that was not applied
- 12:11:34 [McCool]
- kaz: fixed
- 12:11:58 [McCool]
- ml: approve?
- 12:12:06 [McCool]
- ... no objections, will publish
- 12:12:25 [McCool]
- topic: schedule
- 12:12:39 [McCool]
- ml: given that people are busy with testing, etc. should we change the schedule
- 12:13:04 [kaz]
- q+
- 12:15:34 [McCool]
- mm: need to prioritize PR critical paths, think polcies and work items should be discussed after that, in late May
- 12:15:58 [McCool]
- kaz: we also need to consider organization of documents, including use cases
- 12:17:18 [kaz]
- s/use cases/use cases. That work should be done in parallel with the wrapping up for the 1.1 specs. So we should clarify our timeline for both directions, 2.0 prep and 1.1 wrap-up in our schedule./
- 12:17:58 [McCool]
- ml: coming to the question here about use cases, makes sense to suspend for now, and take work up with new charter
- 12:18:28 [McCool]
- mm: so we stop for now, define the new policies, and then proceed in the new charter under whatever new policies we decide
- 12:18:47 [Mizushima]
- +1 kaz
- 12:18:50 [kaz]
- q+
- 12:20:51 [McCool]
- kaz: suspending use case collection and document collection is fine, but when do we start and stop?
- 12:21:29 [mlagally]
- q+
- 12:21:30 [kaz]
- q+ Ege_Korkan
- 12:21:31 [kaz]
- ack k
- 12:22:11 [kaz]
- q- E
- 12:22:17 [McCool]
- mm: how about we meet a month from now?
- 12:22:19 [kaz]
- present+ Ege_Korkan
- 12:22:26 [Ege]
- Ege has joined #wot-uc
- 12:23:01 [McCool]
- ml: also, want to say due to a management change won't be able to contribute as editor for TFs
- 12:23:17 [kaz]
- q+
- 12:23:27 [kaz]
- ack ml
- 12:23:41 [McCool]
- ... so need to wrap up things
- 12:24:33 [mlagally]
- q?
- 12:24:35 [Ege]
- q?
- 12:24:44 [McCool]
- mm: we are also loosing other people, so generally have to reorg
- 12:25:02 [kaz]
- ack k
- 12:25:21 [McCool]
- kaz: resources always limited, will have to decide what we can do based on that
- 12:25:39 [kaz]
- q+
- 12:26:12 [McCool]
- ml: oracle is not pulling out of WoT, however
- 12:26:20 [mlagally]
- q?
- 12:26:20 [kaz]
- ack k
- 12:28:13 [McCool]
- mm: ok, so we should pause the UC calls and update the readme to say contibutions are paused while we adjust policies
- 12:28:28 [kaz]
- rrsagent, make log public
- 12:28:32 [kaz]
- rrsagent, draft minutes
- 12:28:34 [RRSAgent]
- I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2023/04/18-wot-uc-minutes.html kaz
- 12:32:36 [kaz]
- q+
- 12:35:17 [kaz]
- ack
- 12:35:22 [kaz]
- s/ack//
- 12:35:24 [kaz]
- ack k
- 12:35:27 [kaz]
- scribe+
- 12:36:31 [kaz]
- kaz: again, just saying "suspending the TF" is vague, because we need to continue the discussion on our policy and procedure. Having initial discussion during the WoT main call is also fine, but that kind of plan should be also clarified there./
- 12:36:45 [kaz]
- s|there./|there.|
- 12:37:04 [Mizushima]
- +1 kaz
- 12:38:16 [kaz]
- q+
- 12:39:28 [kaz]
- ack k
- 12:42:08 [McCool]
- mm: think we need to define overall process first, before we discuss internal details of UC TF procedures
- 12:42:49 [kaz]
- i/think we/scribenick: McCool/
- 12:42:51 [McCool]
- ml: can look at other standards groups for requirements process, eg. DVB consortium has a good process
- 12:43:48 [McCool]
- ... there is a commercial group that gathers commercial requirements, then these are approved by steering board (members from other TFs).
- 12:43:56 [kaz]
- q+
- 12:44:30 [McCool]
- mm: we definitely need a process that lets us prioritize for industry adoption
- 12:44:33 [McCool]
- ml: right
- 12:45:12 [McCool]
- kaz: can look at other SDOs, also IETF, ISO, etc; however, most important part is our own intentions
- 12:45:20 [McCool]
- q+
- 12:45:55 [McCool]
- kaz: we should clarify as WG the basic policies about what kinds of ideas to be obtained from what kind of people and how
- 12:46:06 [McCool]
- ... in my mind can be quite simple
- 12:47:09 [McCool]
- mm: I think we are clear on the goal: wide industry adoption
- 12:47:24 [McCool]
- ... but I'm not convinced it's clear how to get there
- 12:47:49 [McCool]
- ml: would not necessarily survey all other SDOs, just giving an example
- 12:48:23 [Ege]
- q+
- 12:48:41 [McCool]
- ml: we have to avoid just adding a bunch of features without motivation
- 12:48:50 [kaz]
- ack k
- 12:49:01 [McCool]
- ack m
- 12:49:10 [McCool]
- ege: what do the other W3C groups do
- 12:49:40 [McCool]
- ml: my understanding is that groups are self-organizing
- 12:49:41 [kaz]
- q+
- 12:49:46 [kaz]
- ack e
- 12:50:20 [McCool]
- kaz: have been working as a team contact for a long time and for many groups
- 12:50:43 [McCool]
- ... all those groups have started with use cases and as part of liaisons with external SDOs
- 12:51:09 [McCool]
- ... but relationships with external orgs is getting more and more complicated
- 12:51:43 [McCool]
- ... what should be clarified is something like what ML is showing (@@link)
- 12:52:36 [kaz]
- ack k
- 12:53:29 [mlagally]
- https://github.com/w3c/wot-usecases/pull/225
- 12:53:44 [McCool]
- mm: do think we need to work harder on gathering stakeholders and contributions
- 12:54:42 [McCool]
- mm: do want to say that UC document is a good baseline for future work
- 12:54:53 [McCool]
- s/mm:/ml:/
- 12:55:19 [kaz]
- q+
- 12:55:59 [McCool]
- mm: want to say we appreciate your contributions and hope that you next project is interesting!
- 12:57:39 [McCool]
- kaz: myself also; but if not working on use cases, need to think about policy
- 12:57:50 [kaz]
- q-
- 12:57:55 [McCool]
- mm: that is my intention
- 12:58:24 [kaz]
- s/about policy/about policy, procedure and strategy for the next Charter period./
- 12:58:30 [kaz]
- rrsagent, draft minutes
- 12:58:32 [RRSAgent]
- I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2023/04/18-wot-uc-minutes.html kaz
- 12:58:50 [kaz]
- topic: Next calls
- 12:59:04 [kaz]
- q+
- 12:59:24 [kaz]
- ack k
- 12:59:52 [kaz]
- s/topic: Next calls//
- 12:59:54 [kaz]
- [adjourned]
- 13:00:06 [kaz]
- rrsagent, draft minutes
- 13:00:08 [RRSAgent]
- I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2023/04/18-wot-uc-minutes.html kaz