14:46:43 <RRSAgent> RRSAgent has joined #publishingcg
14:46:43 <RRSAgent> logging to https://www.w3.org/2022/09/14-publishingcg-irc
14:48:48 <wolfgang> Zakim, start the September 2022 session of the Publishing Community Group
14:48:48 <Zakim> I don't understand you, wolfgang
14:49:06 <wolfgang> Zakim, start the Publishing Community Group session
14:49:06 <Zakim> I don't understand you, wolfgang
14:49:26 <zheng_xu> Zakim, start the meeting
14:49:26 <Zakim> RRSAgent, make logs Public
14:49:27 <Zakim> Meeting: Publishing Community Group
14:50:33 <zheng_xu> Zakim, agenda+ Recap of previous meeting
14:50:33 <Zakim> agendum 1 added
14:50:47 <zheng_xu> Zakim, agenda+ Update of a11y TF
14:50:47 <Zakim> agendum 2 added
14:51:03 <zheng_xu> Zakim, agenda+ Update of Ed TF work
14:51:03 <Zakim> agendum 3 added
14:51:24 <zheng_xu> Zakim, agenda+ Discuss about digital publishing counterfeiting https://github.com/w3c/publishingcg/issues/39
14:51:24 <Zakim> agendum 4 added
14:51:38 <zheng_xu> agenda?
14:51:53 <zheng_xu> list agenda
14:52:18 <zheng_xu> hahaha
14:52:30 <zheng_xu> just playing around with Zakim :)
14:53:44 <zheng_xu> looks like this is still working https://www.w3.org/2001/12/zakim-irc-bot.html
14:54:02 <zheng_xu> and https://www.w3.org/2002/03/RRSAgent
14:56:18 <zheng_xu> please save agenda
14:56:31 <zheng_xu> Zakim, please save agenda
14:56:37 <Zakim> ok, zheng_xu, the agenda has been written to http://www.w3.org/2022/09/14-publishingcg-agenda.rdf
14:58:00 <rickj> rickj has joined #publishingcg
14:58:06 <rickj> present+
14:58:20 <wolfgang> present+ wolfgang
14:58:49 <zheng_xu> present+
14:58:58 <zheng_xu> scribe+
15:01:08 <gpellegrino> gpellegrino has joined #publishingcg
15:01:11 <wendyreid> present+
15:01:30 <gpellegrino> present+
15:01:59 <liisamk> liisamk has joined #publishingcg
15:02:07 <liisamk> present+
15:02:34 <Joe> Joe has joined #publishingcg
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15:02:50 <JF> Present+
15:02:56 <zheng_xu> next agendum
15:02:59 <p_belfanti> Present+
15:03:03 <Naomi> Naomi has joined #publishingcg
15:03:13 <Naomi> present+
15:03:13 <wolfgang> scribe+ wolfgang
15:04:01 <wolfgang> zheng: update for TF - announcement for starting Education TF - started to tal about counterfeiting issue which we will continue today
15:04:21 <zheng_xu> next agendum
15:05:03 <zheng_xu> No update this time due to TPAC
15:05:05 <zheng_xu> next agendum
15:05:21 <JF> zakim, close item 2
15:05:21 <Zakim> agendum 2, Update of a11y TF, closed
15:05:22 <Zakim> I see 2 items remaining on the agenda; the next one is
15:05:22 <Zakim> 3. Update of Ed TF work [from zheng_xu]
15:05:39 <JF> zakim, next item
15:05:39 <Zakim> agendum 3 -- Update of Ed TF work -- taken up [from zheng_xu]
15:05:41 <jojo> jojo has joined #publishingcg
15:05:41 <zheng_xu> p_belfanti: kicked off ED a few weeks ago
15:06:19 <zheng_xu> ... started to gather use cases
15:07:00 <zheng_xu> ... also creating form of use case template and will send to generic public
15:07:38 <zheng_xu> ... good start
15:09:19 <zheng_xu> wolfgang: yes, we also need to category for Ed TF - younger learning, high ed and so on
15:10:45 <zheng_xu> q+
15:11:01 <ivan> ivan has joined #publishingcg
15:11:29 <zheng_xu> zheng_xu: next meeting for Ed TF will be hold on next week
15:11:38 <zheng_xu> zakim, close item 3
15:11:38 <Zakim> I see a speaker queue remaining and respectfully decline to close this agendum, zheng_xu
15:11:50 <zheng_xu> next agendum
15:11:58 <JF> ack z
15:12:10 <JF> zakin, next item
15:12:28 <JF> zakim, take up next item
15:12:28 <Zakim> agendum 4 -- Discuss about digital publishing counterfeiting https://github.com/w3c/publishingcg/issues/39 -- taken up [from zheng_xu]
15:12:33 <vince> vince has joined #publishingcg
15:12:38 <wendyreid> https://twitter.com/shershovitz/status/1567538503621251073
15:12:38 <zheng_xu> Good job Zakim :)
15:13:57 <JF> this has come around before: https://www.w3.org/2012/08/electronic-books/submissions/webooks2013_submission_41.html
15:14:09 <JF> https://www.ala.org/ala/washoff/contactwo/oitp/emailtutorials/accessibilitya/10.htm
15:14:24 <liisamk> q+
15:14:38 <JF> Q+
15:14:39 <zheng_xu> q+
15:14:42 <gpellegrino> q+
15:15:18 <zheng_xu> wendyreid: explaining about https://github.com/w3c/publishingcg/issues/39
15:16:08 <zheng_xu> ... some way to explore might be content signature? Share secret between publisher and retailer?
15:16:26 <JF> AND accessibility experts too
15:16:29 <JF> ;-)
15:16:33 <wolfgang> q?
15:17:00 <zheng_xu> ... still need to explore idea and we need to learn methods and what we can standize
15:17:36 <zheng_xu> Lars: maybe can think about potential of blockchain. maybe worth of exploring
15:18:03 <wolfgang> ack Liisa
15:18:04 <zheng_xu> ack liisamk
15:18:10 <p_belfanti> q+
15:19:07 <Lars> Lars has joined #publishingcg
15:19:48 <zheng_xu> liisamk: we worked title by title to make sure counterfeit title to be taken done
15:20:03 <wolfgang> s/done/down/
15:20:15 <zheng_xu> ... but still see this happens in self publishing platform
15:20:57 <zheng_xu> ... this happens a lot after a new book released especially getting into library and epub are exposed to hackers
15:21:08 <Lars> help
15:21:14 <zheng_xu> q?
15:21:28 <Lars> Never  mind ;)
15:22:12 <zheng_xu> ... sometimes content is modified and maybe even injected a few words at end of last page which is used for marketing purpose
15:22:29 <Lars> How do I put myself on the queue? I forgot :p
15:22:42 <zheng_xu> use "q+"
15:23:10 <JF> Q+ Lars
15:23:26 <zheng_xu> ... sometimes they add certain character to part of metadata
15:23:33 <Lars> Thanks!
15:23:34 <Lars> Q+
15:24:58 <zheng_xu> ... retailers are willing to take down counterfeits but no one has good idea about how to prevent it or slow it down yet.
15:26:05 <zheng_xu> ... it's bad for consumer as well since the quality is bad. sometimes image are wrong, css are ripped off so the layout can be terrible.
15:26:31 <zheng_xu> q?
15:27:04 <wolfgang> ack JF
15:27:53 <rickj> * I have to leave to get to the AC meeting at TPAC.  Thanks for the good conversations
15:28:14 <zheng_xu> JF: it's also happened for music. There are multiple problems. Most DRM can not be used since it is bundle to certain distributors
15:28:42 <zheng_xu> ... some DRM are not good for a11y
15:29:48 <zheng_xu> ... recognizing the problem but to find a solution can be tricky
15:29:51 <zheng_xu> q?
15:30:12 <JF> https://www.w3.org/2012/08/electronic-books/submissions/webooks2013_submission_41.html
15:30:22 <JF> https://www.ala.org/ala/washoff/contactwo/oitp/emailtutorials/accessibilitya/10.htm
15:30:46 <Leonardo> Leonardo has joined #publishingcg
15:31:09 <wolfgang> ack zheng_xu
15:31:21 <wolfgang> scribe+ wolfgang
15:31:24 <Charles> Charles has joined #publishingcg
15:32:15 <liisamk> q+
15:32:37 <JF> another relevant link: https://www.wired.com/story/ebooks-drm-blind-accessibility-dmca/
15:32:40 <wolfgang> Zheng: problem that DRM will be cracked, is not our issue here - which behaviour is more damaging to the industry?
15:32:52 <wolfgang> q?
15:32:54 <JF> me +1 to Wendy
15:33:21 <gpellegrino> https://content-blockchain.org/building-blocks/what-is-the-iscc/
15:33:28 <gpellegrino> https://isccdemo.content-blockchain.org/
15:33:59 <zheng_xu> gpellegrino: comparing two code there is possibility to compare book
15:34:10 <zheng_xu> q+
15:34:11 <Lars> Thanks Gregorio! I was looking for this. Highly recommended solution
15:34:14 <zheng_xu> ack gpellegrino
15:34:28 <JF> Q+
15:34:32 <zheng_xu> ack p_belfanti
15:34:40 <wolfgang> ack p_belfanti
15:34:44 <wolfgang> q?
15:35:00 <zheng_xu> p_belfanti: the issue is probably more about re-distribute the book - counterfeit
15:35:21 <Lars> Reach out to Sebastian Posth (@posth )
15:35:43 <wolfgang> ack lars
15:36:00 <wendyreid> https://www.scenarex.ca/
15:36:11 <zheng_xu> Lars: There is a company in Canada ^ for blockchain tech on digital books
15:37:06 <wolfgang> ack liisamk
15:37:10 <wendyreid> q+
15:37:18 <wolfgang> q?
15:37:25 <zheng_xu> liisamk: we are not trying to address DRM.
15:37:49 <JF> +1 Liisa
15:38:00 <zheng_xu> ... the counterfeiting is the real issue
15:38:40 <zheng_xu> ... what we are trying to find is to build some guide to help people maybe in suplychain to understand to recognize counterfeit
15:38:53 <zheng_xu> q?
15:38:55 <wolfgang> ack zheng_xu
15:39:21 <wolfgang> scribe+ wolfgang
15:40:12 <wolfgang> Zheng: who could provide a copyright check - publisher or distributor (Amazon, etc.) - tool for similarity check on products handed in
15:40:32 <wolfgang> ... maybe rough mechanism could help
15:40:57 <wolfgang> ... would it make sense to have a TF for this issue?
15:41:01 <wolfgang> q?
15:41:09 <liisamk> +1 to an anti-counterfeit TF
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15:42:50 <wolfgang> ack JF
15:43:19 <zheng_xu> JF: we need to properly scope the issue, problem and solution
15:43:22 <zheng_xu> q?
15:43:41 <zheng_xu> ack wendyreid
15:43:44 <wendyreid> https://github.com/w3c/publishingcg/issues/39
15:44:20 <zheng_xu> wendyreid: can we have more detailed info in above github issue
15:44:29 <wolfgang> q?
15:45:15 <zheng_xu> ... lightweight platform / solution is recommended
15:45:34 <zheng_xu> ... maybe some signature could help (signature.xml)
15:46:06 <wolfgang> q?
15:46:08 <liisamk> q+
15:46:09 <zheng_xu> ... we can explore this way
15:46:11 <JF> +1 to "True and Verified"
15:46:11 <zheng_xu> q?
15:47:03 <wolfgang> ack liisamk
15:47:20 <zheng_xu> liisamk: recommend further discussion in a separate TF
15:47:39 <zheng_xu> ... I can lead the taskforce
15:47:42 <zheng_xu> q+
15:47:45 <wolfgang> q?
15:47:46 <zheng_xu> q?
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15:48:02 <wolfgang> scribe+ wolfgang
15:48:02 <JF> Q+ to remind about Verified Credentials as a possibility
15:48:37 <wolfgang> Zheng: we can set up a different TF for counterfeiting issue
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15:48:53 <JF> Q?
15:48:53 <johnr> present John Roque
15:48:55 <zheng_xu> q?
15:49:01 <zheng_xu> ack zheng_xu
15:49:02 <zheng_xu> q?
15:49:03 <johnr> present + John Roque
15:49:19 <wendyreid> q+
15:49:26 <zheng_xu> q+
15:49:47 <zheng_xu> ack JF
15:49:47 <Zakim> JF, you wanted to remind about Verified Credentials as a possibility
15:49:50 <wolfgang> ack JF
15:50:03 <JF> https://www.w3.org/TR/vc-data-model/
15:50:23 <zheng_xu> JF: there is some spec ^ in W3C and shared in the github issue. That might help
15:50:59 <zheng_xu> q?
15:51:40 <zheng_xu> ack wendyreid
15:51:43 <wolfgang> ack wendyreid
15:52:10 <zheng_xu> wendyreid: can check with Ivan about the vc data model
15:53:12 <zheng_xu> ... recommend to reach out more retailer, publisher and other group as well as BISG
15:53:16 <zheng_xu> q?
15:53:27 <wolfgang> ack zheng_xu
15:53:35 <wolfgang> scribe+ wolfgang
15:54:42 <zheng_xu> q?
15:54:42 <wolfgang> Zheng: we can kick off - try to shout out to people outside of PCG - to expand the network makes sense - has not to be a member of PCG - reach out to distirbutors
15:55:05 <zheng_xu> q?
15:55:49 <zheng_xu> wolfgang: have a good day and see you next meeting
16:06:23 <zheng_xu> zakim, end meeting
16:06:23 <Zakim> As of this point the attendees have been rickj, wolfgang, zheng_xu, wendyreid, gpellegrino, liisamk, JF, p_belfanti, Naomi
16:06:25 <Zakim> RRSAgent, please draft minutes v2
16:06:25 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2022/09/14-publishingcg-minutes.html Zakim
16:06:28 <Zakim> I am happy to have been of service, zheng_xu; please remember to excuse RRSAgent.  Goodbye
16:06:32 <Zakim> Zakim has left #publishingcg
16:06:49 <JF> rrsagent, please part
16:06:49 <RRSAgent> I see no action items