IRC log of wot-arch on 2022-09-08

Timestamps are in UTC.

10:00:16 [RRSAgent]
RRSAgent has joined #wot-arch
10:00:16 [RRSAgent]
logging to https://www.w3.org/2022/09/08-wot-arch-irc
10:01:28 [kaz]
meeting: WoT Architecture
10:01:37 [mlagally]
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10:01:38 [ktoumura]
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10:01:46 [kaz]
present+ Kaz_Ashimura, Michael_McCool
10:01:54 [kaz]
chair: Lagally
10:04:39 [Mizushima]
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10:06:50 [kaz]
present+ Michael_Lagally, Tomoaki_Mizushima
10:07:44 [kaz]
agenda: https://www.w3.org/WoT/IG/wiki/WG_WoT_Architecture_WebConf#Architecture_Sept_8st.2C_2022
10:08:16 [kaz]
topic: agenda
10:08:24 [kaz]
ml: (goes through the agenda)
10:08:29 [kaz]
i/goes/scribenick: kaz
10:09:19 [kaz]
... anything to be added?
10:09:21 [kaz]
(none)
10:09:39 [kaz]
topic: minutes
10:09:55 [kaz]
-> https://www.w3.org/2022/09/01-wot-arch-minutes.html Sep-1
10:11:29 [kaz]
ml: (goes through the minutes)
10:12:37 [kaz]
... wondering about the Issue 809
10:12:48 [kaz]
mm: need some time to fix it
10:12:54 [kaz]
... please assign that to me
10:13:36 [kaz]
... need to fix it by CR transition anyway
10:13:57 [kaz]
-> https://github.com/w3c/wot-architecture/issues/809 Issue 809 - Fix normative references / convert to informative, where applicable
10:15:30 [kaz]
mm: will do that immediately after this call
10:15:58 [kaz]
ml: (adds a label of "by CR transition")
10:15:59 [mlagally]
https://github.com/w3c/wot-architecture/issues/828
10:17:27 [kaz]
s/ml: (adds a label of "by CR transition")/ml: (creates another issue 828 on "Prepare CR publication" and adds a label of "by CR transition" to it)/
10:17:37 [kaz]
topic: Issues
10:17:39 [mlagally]
https://github.com/w3c/wot-architecture/issues/820
10:17:54 [kaz]
i/820/subtopic: Issue 820/
10:17:55 [kaz]
closed
10:17:56 [mlagally]
https://github.com/w3c/wot-architecture/issues/818
10:18:05 [kaz]
i/818/subtopic: Issue 818/
10:18:46 [kaz]
Consider whether this makes more sense as a Note [TAG feedback]
10:19:27 [kaz]
ml: (adds comments)
10:19:44 [kaz]
... discussion about the scope and the future deliverables
10:19:53 [kaz]
... in the next Charter period
10:20:04 [kaz]
... during the TPAC meeting
10:20:09 [kaz]
(closed)
10:20:25 [kaz]
q+
10:21:11 [kaz]
kaz: depending on the response from TAG, would suggest again we have a joint discussion with them
10:21:20 [kaz]
mm: e.g., we can invite them to our TPAC meeting
10:22:09 [kaz]
kaz: could you please try to contact Daniel Appelquist and Amy Guy?
10:22:13 [mlagally]
https://www.w3.org/2001/tag/
10:22:22 [McCool]
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10:23:38 [kaz]
-> https://www.w3.org/groups/other/tag TAG info page
10:24:03 [kaz]
topic: PRs
10:24:19 [kaz]
s/topic: PRs//
10:25:09 [kaz]
topic: Discovery-related issues
10:25:17 [kaz]
-> https://github.com/w3c/wot-architecture/issues?q=is%3Aissue+is%3Aopen++label%3Adiscovery+ issues with "discovery" label
10:25:44 [kaz]
mm: we can apply another label of considering to be closed
10:26:41 [kaz]
-> https://github.com/w3c/wot-architecture/issues?q=is%3Aissue+is%3Aopen++label%3A%22close+next+week%22+ issues with "close next week" label
10:27:30 [kaz]
mm: next week, we'll discuss issues around the next Charter
10:27:31 [kaz]
q?
10:27:32 [kaz]
ack k
10:27:35 [kaz]
q?
10:28:11 [kaz]
subtopic: Issue 824
10:28:29 [kaz]
-> https://github.com/w3c/wot-architecture/issues/824 Issue 824 - Adjust policy-like security and privacy assertions
10:28:37 [kaz]
mm: (describes the situation)
10:28:45 [kaz]
... Security TF has not discussed this yet
10:29:09 [kaz]
... would suggest we review the updated draft during the CR period
10:29:13 [kaz]
q+
10:29:27 [kaz]
... changed a lot of things
10:29:38 [kaz]
... e.g., "isolation" is a vague word
10:29:57 [kaz]
... we really care is untrusted code
10:30:13 [kaz]
s/code/code out of the sandbox/
10:30:43 [kaz]
... anyway, I don't want to ask people to do something impossible
10:31:29 [kaz]
kaz: continuing the review during the CR period is ok
10:31:57 [kaz]
... but we need to make sure there would not be any changes which have impacts for implementations
10:32:00 [kaz]
mm: right
10:32:05 [kaz]
... there should not be any impacts
10:32:18 [kaz]
subtopic: PR 827
10:32:50 [kaz]
-> https://github.com/w3c/wot-architecture/pull/827 Revise Security and Privacy assertions
10:33:00 [kaz]
(fixes the issue 824)
10:33:26 [kaz]
ml: "isolated" execution is now "sandboxed" execution
10:33:44 [kaz]
s/execution/execution environments/
10:33:47 [kaz]
s/execution/execution environments/
10:34:27 [kaz]
mm: this has much longer text after it
10:34:40 [kaz]
... about data access
10:34:50 [kaz]
ml: about security and data protection
10:34:53 [kaz]
mm: yes
10:35:23 [kaz]
... private data protection is important here
10:35:36 [kaz]
... btw, typo there...
10:35:47 [kaz]
ml: (fixes it)
10:36:27 [kaz]
s/fixes it/adds comments about that
10:36:39 [kaz]
... (around line 4172)
10:37:15 [kaz]
... remove "perform"
10:39:05 [kaz]
(still pending status, though)
10:40:32 [kaz]
ml: link to the WoT Security and Privacy Guidelines?
10:40:42 [kaz]
mm: can add an anchor there
10:40:49 [kaz]
(around line 4204)
10:41:15 [kaz]
mm: next point is the word of "guarantee"
10:41:20 [kaz]
... which means "SHOULD"
10:41:35 [kaz]
(around line 4296)
10:42:38 [kaz]
mm: then around line 4608/4604
10:42:44 [kaz]
... MUST to be SHOULD
10:43:28 [kaz]
... mutable IDs required for some use cases
10:44:02 [kaz]
(around line 4613/4609, "required to" to be "should"
10:44:11 [kaz]
s/should"/should")/
10:44:13 [kaz]
q+
10:44:32 [kaz]
(around 4617/1613, MUST to be SHOULD)
10:44:55 [kaz]
(around 4619/4615, "cannot" to be "should not")
10:45:16 [kaz]
mm: we can remove some of the text, though
10:45:58 [kaz]
... you can add a suggestion using the GitHub interface
10:46:06 [kaz]
ml: (adds a suggestion)
10:46:58 [kaz]
mm: line 4614-4616 (on the right side) to be removed
10:48:05 [kaz]
kaz: what about the other lower-case "should" sentences?
10:48:21 [kaz]
... like line 4609 on the right side?
10:48:54 [kaz]
... I'm OK with removing them, but we should make sure about our policy at this stage
10:48:59 [kaz]
mm: right
10:49:48 [kaz]
... also we can add a text mentioning lower-case keywords are not assertions withing the RFC2119 description section
10:51:29 [kaz]
ml: (around line 4620, "sould not use nosec" to be "should use access control")
10:51:34 [kaz]
s/sould/should/
10:52:17 [kaz]
... (then shows the preview)
10:52:30 [kaz]
-> https://pr-preview.s3.amazonaws.com/mmccool/wot-architecture/pull/827.html#conformance preview: section 2. Conformance
10:52:51 [kaz]
mm: the question is that the text here comes from ReSpec automatically
10:53:33 [kaz]
... I'm OK with either merging this and add fix later, or wait to fix them
10:53:39 [kaz]
ml: ok to merge?
10:53:43 [kaz]
(no objections)
10:53:47 [kaz]
merged
10:53:56 [kaz]
topic: Issues
10:54:30 [kaz]
s/Issues/Tag review issues/
10:54:40 [kaz]
-> https://github.com/w3c/wot-architecture/issues?q=is%3Aissue+is%3Aopen+label%3Atag-needs-resolution TAG review issues
10:54:58 [kaz]
subtopic: Issue 817
10:55:08 [kaz]
-> https://github.com/w3c/wot-architecture/issues/817 Issue 817 - Review for unnecessary normative statements [TAG feedback]
10:55:32 [kaz]
ml: (adds comments)
10:55:57 [kaz]
... several normative statements have been weakened from "MUST" to "SHOULD"
10:56:06 [kaz]
... specifically in the security section
10:56:27 [kaz]
... also some of the redundant assertions have been removed
10:57:21 [kaz]
... group-wide review will be done when the implementation report is done
10:58:58 [kaz]
... collecting testing inputs and we'll see which assertions need to be @@@
10:59:20 [kaz]
mm: for CR transition, we need to identify feature at risk
11:01:19 [kaz]
-> https://github.com/w3c/wot-architecture/issues/829 new issue 829 - Provide implementation report on architecture for node-wot
11:02:38 [kaz]
s/@@@/identified as "at risk"/
11:03:09 [kaz]
topic: Resolution for CR candidate
11:03:21 [kaz]
mm: need to make a resolution
11:03:29 [mlagally]
proposal: submit the current editors draft as CR candidate and ask for group-wide review
11:04:26 [kaz]
present+ Kunihiko_Toumura
11:04:55 [mlagally]
resolution: submit the current editors draft as CR candidate and ask for group-wide review
11:05:19 [kaz]
[adjourned]
11:05:23 [kaz]
rrsagent, make log public
11:05:37 [kaz]
rrsagent, draft minutes
11:05:37 [RRSAgent]
I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2022/09/08-wot-arch-minutes.html kaz