13:44:42 <RRSAgent> RRSAgent has joined #pwe
13:44:42 <RRSAgent> logging to https://www.w3.org/2022/06/07-pwe-irc
13:44:45 <Zakim> RRSAgent, make logs Public
13:44:46 <Zakim> Meeting: Positive Work Environment CG
13:44:57 <Ralph> agenda: https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-pwe/2022Jun/0000.html
13:45:10 <Ralph> Ralph has changed the topic to: 7 June agenda: https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-pwe/2022Jun/0000.html
13:46:02 <Ralph> -> https://www.w3.org/2022/05/24-pwe-minutes.html 24 May meeting notes
13:46:19 <Ralph> -> https://www.w3.org/2022/05/10-pwe-minutes.html 10 May meeting notes
14:00:55 <Ralph> present: Chris, Tzviya, Ralph
14:03:25 <Ralph> present+ JudyB
14:03:53 <Ralph> present+ WSeltzer
14:04:56 <Judy> Judy has joined #pwe
14:04:58 <tzviya> present+
14:05:14 <Ralph> present+ Sheila
14:05:22 <sheila> sheila has joined #pwe
14:05:26 <Ralph> topic: Working mode of PWE, next action items for PWE
14:05:27 <Judy> present+
14:05:46 <Ralph> Tzviya: Liz and I talked about things have been kind-of haphazard recently
14:05:53 <Ralph> ... it's been hard to complete action items
14:06:17 <Ralph> ... we have 3 chairs now; Wendy Reid just started, though she's on vacation today
14:06:31 <Ralph> ... we took on the work of the Inclusion & Diversity CG last year
14:06:41 <Ralph> ... this is an opporunity to talk about where we go from here
14:07:00 <sheila> q+
14:07:05 <Ralph> ... there's a lot sitting waiting for progress that might happen with the legal entity
14:07:16 <tzviya> ack s
14:07:49 <Ralph> Sheila: a clarifying question: where would you say things are getting stuck? specific places things are breaking down or just general lack of progress?
14:08:06 <Ralph> Tzviya: people volunteer for tasks then do it off-line
14:08:30 <Ralph> ... we should work on-line so that others can pick things up later if necessary
14:08:54 <tzviya> q?
14:08:55 <cwilso> q+
14:09:00 <tzviya> ack cw
14:09:01 <Ralph> ... in some areas we're writing policy for the organization and that needs to be passed up the pipeline; we should be able to clarify how we do that
14:09:21 <Ralph> Chris: the work on the CEPC was critical and the group deserves credit for it
14:09:38 <Ralph> ... has the merger with IDCG been part of the problem?  too many disparate things assigned to this group?
14:09:57 <Ralph> ... on the Ombuds program there is a clear ability to move forward and we just need to unblock
14:10:05 <Ralph> ... we have something ready to propose; we should propose it
14:10:25 <Ralph> ... if additional funding is needed, I think I can help find it
14:10:32 <Judy> q+
14:10:50 <tzviya> ack Judy
14:11:02 <Ralph> ... I'm not sure how to move some things like disciplinary actions forward
14:11:31 <Ralph> Judy: focus could be an issue, though we have so little discussion of inclusion or even diversity that I'm not sure that is a distraction
14:11:48 <Ralph> ... my concern that that work would get lost in the merger have proven accurate
14:11:52 <wseltzer>  q+
14:11:59 <Ralph> ... W3C desperately neeeds work on diversity and inclusion
14:12:09 <tzviya> q+
14:12:09 <Ralph> ... w.r.t. the PWE area, I believe the need for that is also really high
14:12:21 <Ralph> ... the CEPC has already helped us in many ways, some more and some less visible
14:12:26 <Ralph> ... we need to do an update
14:12:48 <Ralph> ... there are some things that are not adequately defined to address scenarios that come up frequently
14:13:02 <Ralph> ... overall the CG is lacking clear goals and motivation towards those goals
14:13:19 <Ralph> ... getting the Ombuds program versioned-up could be one of those goals
14:13:28 <Ralph> ... we have a sketch of what we want but we're not moving forward
14:13:32 <Liz> Liz has joined #pwe
14:13:39 <Ralph> present+ Liz
14:13:49 <Liz> (sorry, meeting ran long)
14:14:01 <Ralph> Wendy: I recognize W3C should be doing more but we've had successes
14:14:25 <tzviya> ack ws
14:14:48 <sheila> q+
14:15:12 <Ralph> Tzviya: we can talk about how to get back to the goals of IDCG too
14:16:03 <tzviya> q?
14:16:05 <tzviya> ack me
14:16:06 <Judy> q+
14:16:07 <tzviya> ack sh
14:16:07 <Ralph> ... the Ombuds program ties-in with the disciplinary work too
14:16:43 <Judy> +1 to concern about resourcing for the aspects of work needed
14:16:45 <Ralph> Sheila: there's a budget connection too
14:16:49 <Ralph> present+ WendyReid
14:16:56 <wendyreid> wendyreid has joined #pwe
14:16:58 <Ralph> [WendyReit joins]
14:17:05 <wendyreid> present+
14:17:36 <wseltzer> s/Reit/Reid/
14:18:27 <tzviya> q+ to review existing projects
14:18:36 <tzviya> ack Judy
14:20:54 <wseltzer> q+
14:21:05 <tzviya> ack ws
14:21:43 <tzviya> ack tz
14:21:43 <Zakim> tzviya, you wanted to review existing projects
14:22:02 <sheila> +1 to easy access
14:23:04 <Ralph> -> https://github.com/w3c/PWETF/blob/main/DraftOmbudsJobDescription.md Ombuds Job Description W3C, draft
14:23:32 <Ralph> Liz: I can get a draft of the disput resolution process into GitHub
14:24:11 <Ralph> Tzviya: WendyReid is working on the inclusion fund as well
14:26:37 <Ralph> -> https://www.w3.org/Guide/process/banning.html Guidelines to suspend or remove participants from groups
14:26:56 <Ralph> Tzviya: I don't think that falls within the purview of this CG
14:27:27 <Ralph> s/that falls/that the banning guidelines fall/
14:28:13 <Ralph> Tzviya: we're very close to having a proposal for Ombuds; we just need to pull the pieces together
14:28:38 <Ralph> ... I can put that proposal together from the pieces and bring it here to our next meeting
14:28:57 <Ralph> Sheila: we decided to hold on the interview part; do we still need it?
14:29:11 <Ralph> ... is it a level of detail that we need in the proposal?
14:29:34 <Ralph> Tzviya: we didn't want potential interviewees to see it in advance
14:30:33 <Ralph> JudyB: it seems that posting the interview questions publicly might not be the best way to conduct interviews
14:30:58 <Ralph> Sheila: being transparent about the process but not the specific questions
14:31:41 <Ralph> ... we have a general rubric about the selection committee but some open questions about who would serve and the specific questions
14:32:28 <tzviya> q?
14:32:30 <Ralph> Tzviya: so our next step on Ombuds is to pull the pieces together and have a proposal for the next CG meeting
14:32:50 <tzviya> https://github.com/w3c/PWETF/pulls
14:33:03 <Ralph> topic: Open Pull Requests
14:33:04 <tzviya> https://github.com/w3c/PWETF/pull/194
14:33:13 <Ralph> Tzviya: some of the pulls are simply editorial
14:33:31 <Judy> s/+1 to concern about resourcing for the aspects of work needed//
14:33:44 <Ralph> ... e.g. #194 is only to make the sort order more useful
14:33:47 <Ralph> ... any objections?
14:33:48 <Ralph> [none]
14:34:46 <tzviya> https://github.com/w3c/PWETF/pull/184
14:34:50 <Ralph> ... -> https://github.com/w3c/PWETF/pull/183 "Verbal -> Informal #183" is in the disciplinary process so skipping for now
14:35:08 <Ralph> ... added personal attacks to unacceptable #184
14:35:25 <Ralph> ... comments about verbal attacks
14:35:41 <Ralph> ... attacks against individuals vs organizations
14:35:47 <Ralph> ... please add your thoughts
14:36:38 <tzviya> "Verbal or written attacks, insinuations, or denigration of individuals or organizations."
14:36:50 <Ralph> ... Jeanne's comments about insinuations
14:37:09 <Ralph> ... "Verbal or written attacks, insinuations, or denigration of individuals or organizations."
14:37:20 <Ralph> ... comments?
14:38:29 <Ralph> Judy: it's far from plain language
14:39:24 <Ralph> Tzviya: the intent is that we don't want attacks or things that could be construed as an attack
14:39:28 <Judy> q+
14:39:34 <tzviya> ack Judy
14:40:00 <Ralph> Judy: can we capture this at a basic level?  "negative statements about someone's character"
14:40:57 <Ralph> ... there are a number of things in CEPC where a single instance is less severe than repeated occurrences
14:41:15 <tzviya> verbal or written attacks
14:41:28 <tzviya> negative statements about character
14:42:58 <sheila> I personally don't think organizations warrant the same level of protection as individuals
14:43:35 <tzviya> ack ra
14:45:02 <Ralph> Tzviya: I'll close this pull and open a new one with these two suggestions
14:45:31 <Ralph> ... objections?
14:45:33 <Ralph> [none]
14:45:53 <tzviya> https://github.com/w3c/PWETF/pull/201
14:46:07 <Ralph> Tzviya: -> https://github.com/w3c/PWETF/pull/201 "misinfo #201" I added at the request of someone
14:47:16 <Ralph> Ralph: Sarven's question is how is deliberate misinformation different from disinformation?
14:47:18 <sheila> q+
14:47:50 <tzviya> ack sheila
14:47:59 <Ralph> Liz: the definition of disinformation is that it is intentional / deliberate
14:48:32 <Ralph> ... my inclination is to use "deliberate misinformation" as it might not be obvious to some that "disinformation" is deliberate
14:48:44 <Ralph> ... even though they mean the same thing, it's better to be explicit
14:48:52 <Ralph> Tzviya: any objections to merging?
14:48:54 <Ralph> [none]
14:49:26 <tzviya> https://w3c.github.io/PWETF/
14:49:44 <Judy> q+
14:50:05 <Ralph> Tzviya: we've merged a lot of edits and we might want to publish an update
14:50:15 <tzviya> ack Judy
14:50:32 <tzviya> q+
14:51:36 <tzviya> ack tz
14:52:13 <sheila> +1 to changing to threats. additionally, might be worthwhile to add violence to the glossary and define its breadth.
14:52:54 <Judy> q?
14:55:00 <Ralph> [adjourned]
14:55:03 <Ralph> zakim, end meeting
14:55:03 <Zakim> As of this point the attendees have been Chris, Tzviya, Ralph, JudyB, WSeltzer, Sheila, Judy, Liz, WendyReid
14:55:05 <Zakim> RRSAgent, please draft minutes v2
14:55:05 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2022/06/07-pwe-minutes.html Zakim
14:55:08 <Zakim> I am happy to have been of service, Ralph; please remember to excuse RRSAgent.  Goodbye
14:55:12 <Zakim> Zakim has left #pwe
14:55:52 <Ralph> chair: Tzviya
14:56:04 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2022/06/07-pwe-minutes.html Ralph
15:05:37 <csarven> Thank you re PR 201