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15:18:15 <Steven> RRSAgent, make logs public
15:18:23 <Steven> Meeting: ixml Group Teleconference
15:18:37 <Steven> Date: 14 December 2021
15:18:43 <Steven> Chair: Steven
15:19:30 <Steven> Agenda:  https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-ixml/2021Dec/0013
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15:33:39 <Steven> Present: MSM, Norm, Tom, Dave Pawson, John Lumley
15:34:14 <Steven> Tom: Prague is happening in June.
15:34:44 <Steven> ... so do we continue to rush, or aim for June?
15:34:58 <Steven> Steven: The point of doing it for Prague was so there was an audience
15:35:05 <Steven> MSM: I would prefer to be ready before June
15:35:26 <Steven> Norm: February seemed like rushing
15:35:36 <Steven> Tom: Aim for April/May
15:36:29 <Steven> Topic:  Previous Actions
15:36:38 <Steven> ACTION (2021-08-004): Steven to create list of existing requirements,
15:36:38 <trackbot> Sorry, but no Tracker is associated with this channel.
15:36:38 <Steven> so that we can identify when a new one comes.
15:36:43 <Steven> Steven: Done
15:36:50 <Steven> ACTION (2021-08-005): Tom and MSM to come with a pragma proposal.
15:36:50 <trackbot> Sorry, but no Tracker is associated with this channel.
15:36:52 <Steven> Done
15:37:40 <Steven> MSM: Let us discuss later in the meeting, to see if we can endorse
15:37:52 <Steven> ACTION (2021-10-001): Steven to draft a mediatypes proposal (see
15:37:52 <Steven> https://github.com/invisibleXML/ixml/issues/6).
15:37:52 <trackbot> Sorry, but no Tracker is associated with this channel.
15:37:55 <Steven> Steven: Continues
15:38:03 <Steven> ACTION (2021-11-001): Norm to classify the error states in the spec,
15:38:03 <trackbot> Sorry, but no Tracker is associated with this channel.
15:38:03 <Steven> as a first step towards standard error codes. (Discharged by
15:38:03 <Steven> https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-ixml/2021Nov/0035.html ?)
15:38:06 <Steven> Done
15:38:55 <Steven> Topic: Status of implementations
15:39:36 <Steven> Norm: I have modified PEP and successfully parsed an ixml grammar
15:40:01 <Steven> ... It parses the ixnml grammar!
15:40:09 <Steven> s/ixnml/ixml/
15:40:22 <Steven> github.com/xproc/pep
15:41:32 <Steven> John: I managed to get a modified version of the ixml grammar working on Steven's server
15:41:43 <Steven> ... with pragmas
15:42:19 <Steven> ... I can then transform and serialise back into ixml, and goes through Steven's ixml processor.
15:42:40 <Steven> ... Opens a need for taking the XML form of ixml
15:44:03 <Steven> MSM: That's why there is prose in the pragma's proposal about XML form of pragmas
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15:45:56 <Steven> Steven: I'm working on serialising to memory, so that you can parse straight from that. Adding XML would be the same process, using a different format, since the XML and the parse tree are essentially isomorphic.
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15:47:31 <Steven> Steven: The new version is running, is written in ABC< as a basis for a future C version
15:47:45 <Steven> MSM: Stasis. Working on the test suite, but not on the ixml system
15:47:56 <Steven> Tom: Likewise, no change this month.
15:48:07 <Steven> Norm: What is the state of the test suite?
15:48:16 <Steven> ... for use
15:48:45 <Steven> MSM: I have a relaxing schema for a testsuite catalogue, it allows input and output to be inline or at a URL.
15:50:36 <Steven> Steven: What should I do with my tests?
15:50:48 <Steven> MSM: Put them on github, I will develop a catalogue for it
15:51:19 <Steven> ... I do not regard what I'm doing as official, but we can use it as a basis
15:51:38 <Steven> ACTION: Steve to add his tests to github
15:51:38 <trackbot> Sorry, but no Tracker is associated with this channel.
15:52:36 <Steven> Steven: Are we expec ting to have implementations when we release?
15:52:38 <Steven> [Yes]
15:52:55 <Steven> MSM: a list of ongoing implementations and their characteristics
15:53:39 <Steven> MSM: There's something on CPAN that might count
15:53:50 <Steven> Tom: Honorable mention
15:54:13 <Steven> MSM: as long as we can distinguish things that are trying to pass the testsuite
15:54:19 <Steven> ... separately
15:56:01 <Steven> Topic: Bug reports / change requests
15:57:32 <cmsmcq> https://github.com/invisibleXML/ixml/issues/12
15:57:35 <Steven> Topic: Bugs - Strings proposal
15:57:35 <Steven> https://github.com/invisibleXML/ixml/issues/12
15:58:40 <Steven> Steven: It doesn't reduce functionality, it does improve diagnostics
15:58:44 <Steven> RESOLVED
15:59:10 <Steven> ACTION: Steven to add strings proposal to spec
15:59:10 <trackbot> Sorry, but no Tracker is associated with this channel.
15:59:23 <Steven> Topic: Bugs - Character ranges
15:59:23 <Steven> https://github.com/invisibleXML/ixml/issues/16
16:00:06 <Steven> Topic: Bugs - Conformance issue:   rule names and XML names
16:00:06 <Steven> https://github.com/invisibleXML/ixml/issues/18
16:02:02 <Steven> Steven: This is a static vs dynamic issue
16:03:34 <Steven>   a: @b; -"!", c.
16:03:34 <Steven>    b: c.
16:03:34 <Steven>    c: "d".
16:08:01 <Steven> MSM: I could live with it either way.
16:09:43 <Steven> ... "all names that are serialized must conform to an XML name"
16:10:05 <Steven> ... plus implementations may warn statically if a name doesn't conform
16:10:17 <Steven> Steven: Agreed?
16:10:21 <Steven> [Yes]
16:10:26 <Steven> [RESOLVED]
16:10:40 <Steven> Topic: Bugs - Conformance issue:   one rule per nonterminal
16:10:40 <Steven> https://github.com/invisibleXML/ixml/issues/19
16:13:08 <Steven> MSM: It doesn't cover the start rule, because it doesn't occur on any RHS
16:13:44 <Steven> Steven: Ah,
16:15:37 <Steven> MSM: "For every nonterminal occurring in the grammar, there must be exactly one rule in the grammar defining that nonterminal."
16:18:01 <Steven> Dave: "Every nonterminal should be defined by a single rule".
16:18:45 <Steven> MSM: replace should with must.
16:20:02 <Steven> John: Modularity, libraries, may have unreachable rules.
16:20:20 <Steven> Tom: Not a 1.0 featuer
16:20:27 <Steven> s/uer/ure/
16:22:32 <Steven> Tom: Not sure we cover the start rule
16:22:49 <Steven> MSM: The LHS name is a nonterminal; if we don't say that, we should.
16:23:43 <Steven> Tom: I propose keeping both rules in this issue
16:26:42 <Steven> MSM: I just looked at "nonterminal" in the spec. I thought "of course the name of a rule is a nonterminal". But the spec doesn't say that. So the redundancy of both rules may help.
16:27:04 <Steven> Tom: Or us "nonterminal" instead of "name".
16:27:09 <Steven> Tom: Leave both in.
16:27:35 <Steven> ... use new wording though for the 1st
16:27:54 <Steven> ACTION: Steven implement the resolution for issue 19.
16:27:54 <trackbot> Sorry, but no Tracker is associated with this channel.
16:28:21 <Steven> Topic: AOB
16:28:35 <Steven> Tom: Move pragmas and release schedule to top of next meeting
16:29:43 <Steven> ... next meeting 11 Jan at 15:30 UTC
16:30:20 <Steven> rrsagent, make minutes
16:30:20 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2021/12/14-ixml-minutes.html Steven
16:32:19 <Steven> RRSAgent, make logs public
16:32:27 <Steven> rrsagent, make minutes
16:32:27 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2021/12/14-ixml-minutes.html Steven
16:35:02 <norm> norm has left #ixml
16:36:30 <Steven> s/ABC</ABC,/
16:37:08 <Steven> s/expec ting/expecting
16:42:26 <Steven> ACTION: Steven implement resolution for issue 18 on XML names
16:42:26 <trackbot> Sorry, but no Tracker is associated with this channel.
16:42:52 <Steven> s/Steve to/Steven to/
16:42:55 <Steven> rrsagent, make minutes
16:42:55 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2021/12/14-ixml-minutes.html Steven