12:54:08 RRSAgent has joined #dpvcg 12:54:08 logging to https://www.w3.org/2021/11/17-dpvcg-irc 12:56:24 ScribeNick: harsh 12:56:27 Meeting: DPVCG Meeting Call 13:04:19 Chair: harsh 13:04:44 Present: harsh, georg, beatriz, julian, paul, mark 13:04:51 Date: 17 NOV 2021 13:05:04 Agenda: https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-dpvcg/2021Nov/0004.html 13:05:44 previous minutes - https://www.w3.org/2021/11/10-dpvcg-minutes.html 13:06:59 Topic: Joint Controllers 13:07:17 previous discussions were regarding using plural vs singular i.e. controller(s) 13:07:24 paul: should be plural i.e. controllers 13:09:31 Agreement on using plural, the concept will be JointDataControllers 13:10:50 previous discussions about how to refer to joint data controllers were about subclassing it from DataController and using hasDataController 14:05:29 Use-case for discussion - Two DataController A and B are engaged in a JointDataControllers relationship AB. One could specify multiple hasDataController [A,B] which would make them JointDataControllers or explicitly say hasDataController AB and indicate AB hasDataController [A,B] 14:05:49 Agreement on JointDataControllers as a concept and its use within DPV 14:06:04 Topic: Indicating who carries out the data processing 14:06:41 georg: In a personal data handling instance, how to specify who is carrying out the processing, i.e. DataController or DataProcessor 14:07:22 We have as the current way to indicate data goes to some entity, and it is implied that the entity then carries out processing for specified information 14:07:56 However, sometimes it is important to explicitly indicate which entity is carrying out the processing and not just being a recipient for it. 14:08:38 Proposal for a property "isProcessedBy" with range Entity to indicate who carried out processing. Since receiving data / collecting data is a type of processing, it will fall under isProcessedBy ? 14:09:25 The property can be used at appropriate 'levels' as necessary e.g. directly on Processing types such as collect or use, on PersonalDataHandling instances, or for annotating Policy instances 14:09:39 To be revisited in later discussion for finalising 14:09:56 Topic: Referencing Agreement between Data Controller and Data Processor 14:10:35 A DataController engages a DataProcessor under a DataProcessorAgreement which outlines the instructions and obligations for carrying out processing. 14:11:19 How to reference this agreement within the personal data handling use e.g. hasDataController A [as DataController] ; isProcessedBy B [as DataProcessor] ; and A--B has some agreement 14:11:42 Current proposal puts the DataProcessorAgreement under TechnicalOrganisationalMeasure given its derivation from LegalAgreement 14:12:09 paul: The placement of DataProcessorAgreement under TechnicalOrganisationalMeasure does not seem correct or elegant since its not an organisational measure 14:13:13 harsh: we have two ways of using this, one is creating a property called "hasEntity" and using that to associate entities with agreements (and elsewhere as necessary) - which works when representing the Controller--Processor relationship from a third party perspective 14:14:18 harsh: The second one is from a Processor perspective the agreement is its legal basis, so using hasLegalBasis ; and for the Controller it is also the legal basis so using hasLegalBasis ; and both pointing to the DataProcessorAgreement instance 14:15:40 harsh: For the Controller using this in a PersonalDataHandling instance, the use could be something like hasTechnicalOrganisationalMeasure DataProcessorAgreement with the DataProcessorAgreement using hasEntity or hasDataController to connect to the entity with type and role 14:15:56 Topic: Entity and Data Subject Subclasses 14:16:48 julian: The discussion of these concepts arose from prior proposals, and it should be considered whether to include them all in an ad-hoc manner within the DPV or only those that add value - such as due to there being obligations or requirements associated with them from laws or domains 14:17:07 Consensus on adding only those concepts which are necessary to be modelled based on requirements 14:20:24 For entities and organisations, the ADMS vocabulary provided some categorisation such as National/Regional/SupraNational authorities which we propose for inclusion 14:20:42 ADMS itself is a mix of different concepts, so inclusion of a few here would be better 14:20:54 Topic: Next Meeting 14:21:28 We will meet next WED NOV-24 13:00 WET / 14:00 CET 14:21:44 Discussion will continue regarding Entity and Data Subject subclasses and other items on agenda 14:22:16 There may be a guest presentation by DPVCG member Fajar on use of DPV within the WELLFORT project. Details and timings TBD. 14:23:38 zakim, bye 14:23:38 leaving. As of this point the attendees have been harsh, georg, beatriz, julian, paul, mark 14:23:38 Zakim has left #dpvcg 14:23:49 rrsagent, publish minutes v2 14:23:49 I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2021/11/17-dpvcg-minutes.html harsh 14:23:53 rrsagent, set logs world-visible 14:30:20 rrsagent, bye 14:30:20 I see no action items