IRC log of smart-cities on 2021-10-18

Timestamps are in UTC.

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logging to https://www.w3.org/2021/10/18-smart-cities-irc
06:44:45 [dom]
RRSAgent, stay
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RRSAgent, make log public
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rrsagent, bye
13:51:09 [RRSAgent]
I see no action items
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logging to https://www.w3.org/2021/10/18-smart-cities-irc
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14:58:00 [kaz]
meeting: Smart Cities Breakout - Day 1
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present+ Alan
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15:02:19 [kaz]
present+ Kaz_Ashimura_W3C, Rainer_Lang, Fatima_Bana__Glocal_QS, Hiroshi_Ota_Yahoo_Japan, Alan_Bird__W3C, Jeff_Jaffe__W3C, Lisa_Seeman, Ralph_Swick, Takio_Yamaoka__Yahoo_Japan, Tetsuhiko_Hirata__Hitachi, Tomoaki_Mizushima__IRI
15:03:13 [kaz]
present+ Walter_Daves, WendySeltzer__W3C, Xiaoqian_Wu__W3C, Xueyuan_Jia__W3C, Yu_Wei_Chang__Yanni
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present+
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present+
15:06:39 [Alan]
scribe+
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15:06:58 [Alan]
Kaz: Here is the Workshop page. Here is the summary report.
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15:07:08 [kaz]
-> https://www.w3.org/2021/06/smartcities-workshop/report.html workshop report
15:07:15 [Alan]
...There is an IG Charter that is in draft status.
15:07:21 [kaz]
-> https://w3c.github.io/wot/charters/smart-cities/diff.html draft IG Charter
15:07:44 [Alan]
...The yellow parts are update from the Workshop Report.
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15:08:20 [Alan]
...The main purpose of this breakout is to review this charter to see if it's OK.
15:08:28 [Alan]
...Any questions or comments.
15:08:51 [Alan]
Mike McCool: One thing I'm wondering is relationship to Smart Buildings.
15:09:05 [Alan]
...Tied to geolocation things like location of pipes.
15:09:11 [Alan]
...So this is a subset.
15:09:25 [Alan]
Kaz: I think Smart Buildings is one use case.
15:09:45 [Alan]
MikeMc: I think we want to make sure we're not excluding Smart Buildings.
15:10:17 [Alan]
Kaz: A lot of this is copied from the Wkshp report.
15:10:38 [Alan]
...The main part is based on feedback from the Workshop and the many stakeholders.
15:11:02 [Alan]
...How do we improve this Charter is the question.
15:11:22 [Alan]
[Kaz reviews Scope section]
15:13:17 [Alan]
[Kaz discusses dependencies / relationships]
15:13:19 [wseltzer]
q+
15:13:58 [LisaSeemanKest]
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15:14:11 [kaz]
qq+ eric, lisa
15:14:22 [kaz]
ack eric
15:14:22 [Zakim]
eric, you wanted to react to a previous speaker
15:14:23 [wseltzer]
qq+ lisa
15:14:52 [Alan]
EricS: I've shared my input with you, we need the support of implementers, the cities or authorities, to get them involved to help set prioritization.
15:15:04 [Alan]
...My fear is we're defining the scope before we get that.
15:15:18 [Alan]
...It's highly regulated which works to our advantage.
15:15:40 [Alan]
...If we can get Singapore, Japan and China on board we'll get momementum.
15:15:56 [Alan]
...The authority tends to be more centralized there which would help.
15:16:12 [Alan]
...Let's make sure this IG enrolls the support of the Authorities and Cities.
15:16:25 [Alan]
...Otherwise we'll be adding more confusion vs. clarity.
15:16:36 [Alan]
Kaz: Good point. This is very important.
15:16:47 [jeff_]
+1 Eric
15:16:57 [Alan]
[discuss emphasis on this]
15:17:18 [Alan]
Kaz: For example the Japanese gov't has just started this work.
15:17:37 [Alan]
Eric: I know Murai-sensi would be supportive of this approach.
15:18:10 [Alan]
Kaz: that is important and somewhat imcremental but needs to be major.
15:18:15 [kaz]
During the group discussion, we'll continue to work on outreach to clarify the primary stakeholders from the industries, countries/cities and communities to involve in the group's work.
15:18:23 [kaz]
ack lisa
15:18:23 [Zakim]
lisa, you wanted to react to eric
15:18:44 [Alan]
LisaS: I see that you have a bullet point re: accessibility which is good.
15:19:09 [Alan]
...On the last bullet point there are many different groups, we need to work with a more broader set of them.
15:19:27 [Alan]
...People could become invisible if we don't look for who isn't there in our datasets.
15:20:00 [Alan]
...We need to be making decisions so it's more important that we pay attention to what's missing.
15:20:36 [Alan]
...Looking at a subgroup level is potentially ignoring this.
15:20:59 [Alan]
...Let's not increase the problem, let's work to make it better and easier.
15:21:18 [Alan]
q?
15:21:43 [Alan]
Kaz: During the Workshop accessibility was important so I added things about inclusive design, etc.
15:22:36 [Alan]
LisaS: The applications are really accessible for screen readers but they are very wordy with instructions, but the search for the missing people is important.
15:23:03 [Alan]
Kaz: Regarding this we should tried to make the points but we should work on it more.
15:23:23 [Alan]
...For the Charter text itself, should we expand on the text?
15:23:54 [Alan]
Wendy: What I hear is Lisa mentioning is explicitly who's missing from our datasets so that would be the point to make.
15:24:20 [kaz]
q?
15:24:24 [Alan]
LisaS: Specifically those with cognative and learning issues.
15:24:25 [kaz]
ack ws
15:24:43 [Alan]
Wendy: I noted you jumped right into analysis of the draft Charter.
15:25:09 [Alan]
...Since this is a breakout session where folks may not of seen the previous work I'd encourage folks to look at the links.
15:25:22 [Alan]
...Perhaps we want to hear from people who are newer to this work.
15:25:45 [Alan]
...Scanning the proposed work, where are the areas W3C and Web Standards can help.
15:26:10 [dom]
-> https://w3c.github.io/webcomponents-cg/#constructable-stylesheets-adoptedstylesheets 4. Constructable Stylesheets & adoptedStyleSheets
15:26:55 [Alan]
Kaz: There are so many concepts and implementations, they have different scopes and challenges.
15:27:07 [Alan]
...So we want to see where Web Technologies can help.
15:28:05 [jeff_]
scrive+
15:28:08 [jeff_]
scribe+
15:28:21 [jeff_]
Kaz: Also listed expected participants
15:28:28 [jeff_]
[enumerates list]
15:29:10 [jeff_]
Kaz: Three separate sessions to accommodate time zones
15:29:17 [jeff_]
... feedback and great suggestions
15:29:22 [jeff_]
... identify stakeholders
15:29:37 [jeff_]
... feedback for IG as well
15:29:52 [jeff_]
... liaison with other standards orgs
15:30:07 [jeff_]
... related groups in W3C
15:30:27 [jeff_]
... global organizations (e.g. WEF)
15:30:44 [jeff_]
.. updated proposed charter
15:30:48 [jeff_]
... that's the history
15:31:08 [jeff_]
... ask all for opinions and suggestions
15:31:16 [jeff_]
q+
15:31:21 [kaz]
q?
15:32:02 [jeff_]
ack je
15:32:21 [jeff_]
Jeff: Does anyone have concrete ideas on Eric's comments to grow the set of stakeholders?
15:32:29 [jeff_]
Kaz: Yes, let's discuss that
15:33:11 [jeff_]
... supercity should be included as well
15:33:17 [jeff_]
... wondering about other countries
15:33:33 [jeff_]
Eric: We have relationship with Singapore
15:33:38 [jeff_]
... some say they are leading
15:33:50 [jeff_]
... should add Japan and Chinese colleagues
15:34:02 [jeff_]
... maybe schedule a smaller group meetng
15:34:09 [jeff_]
... strategize; create a plan
15:34:30 [jeff_]
... if you have China, Japan, and Singapore - the rest of the Asian countries will follow
15:34:41 [jeff_]
... "fear of missing out"
15:35:13 [jeff_]
Kaz: Thank you very much.
15:35:27 [jeff_]
... need to add China focus
15:35:50 [jeff_]
... other thoughts?
15:36:12 [jeff_]
... US or Europe?
15:37:13 [jeff_]
Hirata-san: Korea has some examples
15:37:35 [jeff_]
... Busan Smart City project; some others
15:37:41 [jeff_]
... national project
15:37:57 [xueyuan_]
q+
15:38:03 [jeff_]
Kaz: Good suggestion
15:38:11 [jeff_]
Eric: Good suggestion Hirata-san
15:38:27 [wseltzer]
ack x
15:38:48 [jeff_]
Xueyuan: Agree with Eric to have smaller meeting; including stakeholders from China, Singapore, Japan
15:39:03 [jeff_]
... I'll forward the invitation to stakeholders in China
15:39:51 [jeff_]
Kaz: Should we ask Medea(?) about their impressions?
15:40:08 [jeff_]
Xueyuan: Does Hualiang want to talk?
15:40:10 [kaz]
s/Medea(?)/Midea/
15:40:24 [jeff_]
Hualiang: I will check the link
15:40:33 [kaz]
q+ Rob
15:40:38 [jeff_]
Kaz: You are interested in this topic?
15:40:43 [jeff_]
Hualiang: Yes
15:40:51 [kaz]
ack r
15:40:55 [jeff_]
Kaz: We will involve you; definitely.
15:41:04 [jeff_]
Rob: OGC has some activity
15:41:11 [jeff_]
... did you make contact with them?
15:41:22 [jeff_]
Kaz: They already participated well in workshop
15:41:25 [jeff_]
... great input
15:41:39 [jeff_]
Rob: Thanks
15:42:26 [jeff_]
Kaz: Let's revisit Michael's point about Smart Buildings
15:42:30 [kaz]
q+ Michael
15:42:44 [jeff_]
Michael: Business information systems is a big thing.
15:43:06 [jeff_]
... e.g. library is both a Smart-City item, but also a Smart building standard
15:43:15 [jeff_]
... not sure what to include, but we need a placeholder.
15:43:35 [jeff_]
Kaz: We should add it to the list of tasks
15:43:39 [jeff_]
Michael: Agreed.
15:43:57 [jeff_]
Kaz: such as in Singapore
15:44:18 [jeff_]
... also W3C's WoT is already being used for building management in Japan
15:45:03 [jeff_]
Michael: Also Geospatial standards are important. But requirements are different: VR, land management,
15:45:10 [jeff_]
... need to ferret out different standards
15:45:30 [jeff_]
... need latitude and longitude before we enter; room number after we entire.
15:46:02 [jeff_]
... OGC is already looking at coordinate systems v layout
15:46:09 [jeff_]
... what about energy management?
15:46:16 [jeff_]
... so we need a placeholder
15:46:25 [jeff_]
... can be done in the IG
15:46:39 [jeff_]
Kaz: We should list application areas
15:46:52 [jeff_]
Michael: Can coordinate with building data CG
15:47:25 [jeff_]
... for distributed energy there are known use cases
15:47:33 [jeff_]
... sustainability is a key issue
15:48:03 [jeff_]
Eric: If we don't get the right regulators to hear where they care
15:48:14 [jeff_]
... we can wander into all sorts of areas
15:48:21 [jeff_]
... Smart Cities is wide and diverse
15:48:31 [jeff_]
... so we need input and support
15:48:39 [jeff_]
Michael: I support that
15:48:52 [jeff_]
... we can speculate about many topics
15:48:59 [jeff_]
... but what is key?
15:49:04 [jeff_]
... what fits with W3C?
15:49:21 [jeff_]
... we need to bootstrap by working with some cities.
15:49:34 [jeff_]
... Japan organization will prioritize for Japan
15:50:01 [jeff_]
Kaz: Specifically the Ministry for (?) Technologies
15:50:12 [jeff_]
Eric: which Murai-sensei set up
15:50:20 [jeff_]
Kaz: been discussing with Jun
15:50:23 [kaz]
s/(?)/Digital/
15:50:40 [jeff_]
... should clarify our starting point
15:51:26 [jeff_]
... Ota-san - any ideas?
15:51:33 [jeff_]
Ota-san: Smart Cities is very big
15:51:40 [jeff_]
... contains many domains
15:51:47 [jeff_]
... need overview document
15:51:50 [jeff_]
... what is included
15:51:54 [jeff_]
... what is in scope
15:52:07 [jeff_]
... many people can work on it
15:52:17 [jeff_]
Kaz: Really important
15:53:19 [jeff_]
Topic: Wrap-up
15:53:28 [jeff_]
Kaz: We reviewed the workshop
15:53:36 [jeff_]
... great advice about next steps
15:53:47 [jeff_]
... look at important stakeholders
15:54:04 [jeff_]
... small team of Asian stakeholders
15:54:11 [jeff_]
... involve more countries later
15:54:22 [jeff_]
... need to update IG charter based on feedback.
15:54:30 [jeff_]
... Second session later this week
15:54:38 [jeff_]
... (Thursday)
15:55:27 [jeff_]
[adjourned]
15:55:33 [jeff_]
rrsagent, make minutes
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I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2021/10/18-smart-cities-minutes.html jeff_
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rrsagent, make log public
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rrsagent, draft minutes
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I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2021/10/18-smart-cities-minutes.html kaz
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