IRC log of personalization on 2021-10-11
Timestamps are in UTC.
- 09:04:33 [RRSAgent]
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- logging to https://www.w3.org/2021/10/11-personalization-irc
- 09:04:35 [trackbot]
- RRSAgent, make logs public
- 09:04:35 [Zakim]
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- 09:04:37 [trackbot]
- Meeting: Personalization Task Force Teleconference
- 09:04:37 [trackbot]
- Date: 11 October 2021
- 09:04:46 [Lionel_Wolberger]
- zakim, start meeting
- 09:04:47 [Zakim]
- RRSAgent, make logs Public
- 09:04:48 [Zakim]
- please title this meeting ("meeting: ..."), Lionel_Wolberger
- 09:05:01 [Lionel_Wolberger]
- Meeting: Personalization Task Force Teleconference
- 09:05:10 [Lionel_Wolberger]
- Chair: Lionel Wolberger
- 09:05:13 [Lionel_Wolberger]
- agenda?
- 09:05:28 [Lionel_Wolberger]
- agenda+ TPAC scheduling
- 09:05:34 [Lionel_Wolberger]
- agenda+ Progress on the Personalization deck for TPAC
- 09:05:55 [Lionel_Wolberger]
- agenda+ Symbols & i18n LTR/RTL Update (Follow-up on i18n issue #144 actions Lionel, Matt, Charles)
- 09:06:01 [Lionel_Wolberger]
- agenda+ CR template status
- 09:06:04 [Lionel_Wolberger]
- agenda+ John's harmonization of Modules 2.0 and 3.0
- 09:06:11 [Lionel_Wolberger]
- agenda?
- 14:03:44 [RRSAgent]
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- logging to https://www.w3.org/2021/10/11-personalization-irc
- 14:03:46 [Zakim]
- RRSAgent, make logs Public
- 14:03:47 [Zakim]
- please title this meeting ("meeting: ..."), Lionel_Wolberger_
- 14:04:03 [Lionel_Wolberger_]
- Meeting: Personalization Task Force Teleconference
- 14:04:17 [becky]
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- 14:04:26 [becky]
- present+
- 14:04:35 [Lionel_Wolberger_]
- agenda?
- 14:05:00 [janina]
- present+
- 14:05:06 [Matthew_Atkinson]
- present+
- 14:05:13 [mike_beganyi]
- scribe: mike_beganyi
- 14:05:24 [mike_beganyi]
- zakim, next item
- 14:05:24 [Zakim]
- agendum 1 -- TPAC scheduling -- taken up [from Lionel_Wolberger]
- 14:06:04 [mike_beganyi]
- janina: not sure if schedule is posted yet.
- 14:06:37 [mike_beganyi]
- becky: will look that up
- 14:07:05 [mike_beganyi]
- janina: two hours later than this call for Monday the 25th for second meeting with COGA. is it possible?
- 14:07:47 [mike_beganyi]
- Lionel_Wolberger: TPAC COGA and personalization at noon NYC time the 25th?
- 14:07:57 [Matthew_Atkinson]
- Noon EST WFM
- 14:08:33 [mike_beganyi]
- janina: introducing what we do to COGA. don't need all present.
- 14:08:38 [mike_beganyi]
- becky: no schedule yet
- 14:08:41 [Roy]
- q+
- 14:09:15 [Roy]
- q-
- 14:09:24 [mike_beganyi]
- janina: TPAC is next week. presume no meeting on the 18th.
- 14:09:45 [mike_beganyi]
- janina: resume regular meetings on November 1
- 14:10:42 [mike_beganyi]
- Lionel_Wolberger: meeting with Silver? waiting and watch the e-mail list for updates
- 14:11:34 [Lionel_Wolberger_]
- Personalizing the Web for Better Accessibility
- 14:12:14 [mike_beganyi]
- Lionel_Wolberger: that's the meeting requested for Mon, Tues, or Thurs. 18th, 19th, 21st
- 14:12:49 [mike_beganyi]
- janina: we need to get cleared on our materials. who's chairing? Lionel, Sharon, Janina?
- 14:15:06 [mike_beganyi]
- becky: facilitator could do both
- 14:15:50 [mike_beganyi]
- Lionel_Wolberger: once time is set we will find chair. Sharon or Lionel. Chair TBD
- 14:16:15 [mike_beganyi]
- Lionel_Wolberger: second of Janina's question. are we taking questions in the midst of the presentation?
- 14:16:54 [mike_beganyi]
- Matthew_Atkinson: open to either (at the end or during)
- 14:17:38 [mike_beganyi]
- janina: only caution taking during. responsible to manage time of questions so that you can get to the end of the presentation. want to ensure getting through the whole deck
- 14:18:22 [mike_beganyi]
- Matthew_Atkinson: will monitor. will park questions until the end if they are larger
- 14:18:35 [mike_beganyi]
- zakim, next item
- 14:18:35 [Zakim]
- agendum 2 -- Progress on the Personalization deck for TPAC -- taken up [from Lionel_Wolberger]
- 14:19:09 [mike_beganyi]
- Lionel_Wolberger: progress on the deck? thanks for all your work so far
- 14:20:43 [mike_beganyi]
- Matthew_Atkinson: coming together nicely. trying to keep it short and simple. some figures need updating. should be close to wrapping up after meeting with Lisa tomorrow.
- 14:21:39 [Lionel_Wolberger_]
- q?
- 14:21:42 [mike_beganyi]
- Matthew_Atkinson: testing the right-to-left (RTL). would be nice to have code sample. will ask Lisa about a good sample sentence
- 14:21:58 [CharlesL]
- q+
- 14:22:19 [mike_beganyi]
- ack CharlesL
- 14:22:42 [mike_beganyi]
- CharlesL: can we get link to slide deck, please? want to check from low vision point-of-view
- 14:22:43 [Matthew_Atkinson]
- https://github.com/w3c/personalization-semantics/pull/199 - you can find the URL to the preview version from the PR
- 14:22:58 [Matthew_Atkinson]
- Preview URL is: https://raw.githack.com/w3c/personalization-semantics/tpac-2021-talk/talks/2021/tpac/index.html
- 14:24:40 [mike_beganyi]
- CharlesL: Janina do you know how closed captioning will work? concern about blocking content
- 14:25:17 [mike_beganyi]
- janina: good point. will be manually done, not relying on auto-captioning
- 14:26:03 [mike_beganyi]
- CharlesL: captioning obscuring content. had to investigate a previous presentation with W3C
- 14:27:21 [mike_beganyi]
- Matthew_Atkinson: shouldn't be much of a concern but there are a couple of slides which could be affected. will review and consider this. really good catch, Charles
- 14:28:01 [Lionel_Wolberger_]
- q?
- 14:31:05 [mike_beganyi]
- Lionel_Wolberger: feedback on presentation: I find it useful to show sample code (e.g. data-simplification). another slide that explains the attribute and its values. next slide is demo for eCommerce
- 14:31:28 [mike_beganyi]
- Lionel_Wolberger: this is where I mentioned migraines and it really got the point across during the demo.
- 14:32:20 [mike_beganyi]
- Lionel_Wolberger: author would mark up the personalization option in the demo. going through the demo really helps with the storytelling aspect.
- 14:32:24 [janina]
- q+
- 14:35:03 [mike_beganyi]
- Lionel_Wolberger: talked about how I have been presenting
- 14:35:35 [mike_beganyi]
- Matthew_Atkinson: liked the ideas. will consider adding more technical information.
- 14:36:46 [CharlesL]
- q+
- 14:37:34 [mike_beganyi]
- Matthew_Atkinson: there are three demos that show different user journeys so they cover a nice range
- 14:39:23 [Lionel_Wolberger_]
- q?
- 14:40:12 [mike_beganyi]
- janina: underscore the value of the sample code. W3C is very technical and the code would help the impact. good for emphasis. highlight the curb cut
- 14:40:16 [mike_beganyi]
- ack janina
- 14:41:09 [mike_beganyi]
- CharlesL: just wanted to say "wow" Lionel. great presentation style. need, solution, code samples. also want to emphasize relevance of code samples. demos are great!
- 14:41:32 [mike_beganyi]
- ack CharlesL
- 14:41:54 [mike_beganyi]
- janina: should be publishing slide deck after TPAC
- 14:43:05 [Lionel_Wolberger_]
- q?
- 14:43:38 [mike_beganyi]
- Matthew_Atkinson: slides should be published, yes. will be available
- 14:43:49 [mike_beganyi]
- zakim, next item
- 14:43:49 [Zakim]
- agendum 3 -- Symbols & i18n LTR/RTL Update (Follow-up on i18n issue #144 actions Lionel, Matt, Charles) -- taken up [from Lionel_Wolberger]
- 14:45:10 [Matthew_Atkinson]
- URL for the email Lionel is summarizing: https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-personalization-tf/2021Oct/0003.html
- 14:45:19 [mike_beganyi]
- Lionel_Wolberger: completed action. wrote summary to e-mails. information learned: consulted an expert in RTL languages. there are no LTR or RTL issues. exactly as John said but now we have expert backup. 1:1 ratio of words to symbols
- 14:45:19 [Matthew_Atkinson]
- q+
- 14:45:25 [CharlesL]
- q+
- 14:45:39 [mike_beganyi]
- ack Matthew_Atkinson
- 14:46:34 [mike_beganyi]
- Matthew_Atkinson: did some basic testing. haven't put code samples in. when flipped into RTL everything gets flipped. images come first just as LTR. positioning is exactly opposite which seems to be correct
- 14:46:57 [janina]
- q+ to offer vocabulary to describe rtl -- retrograde
- 14:47:32 [mike_beganyi]
- Matthew_Atkinson: we need to be careful with where the symbol is located. depending on positioning, that probably could be affected by changing writing direction
- 14:48:23 [Matthew_Atkinson]
- ack Matthew_Atkinson
- 14:48:26 [mike_beganyi]
- Matthew_Atkinson: potential issues with top-down. will do more investigation
- 14:48:29 [mike_beganyi]
- ack CharlesL
- 14:48:42 [mike_beganyi]
- CharlesL: thought there were some symbols for groups of words. is that not the case?
- 14:50:05 [mike_beganyi]
- Lionel_Wolberger: some symbols can capture multiple words. symbol boards the expert showed me were one or two symbols per word. expert said that symbols exist in isolation. they are not combined.
- 14:50:24 [mike_beganyi]
- Lionel_Wolberger: don't put two symbols together. separate symbols
- 14:50:31 [mike_beganyi]
- ack janina
- 14:50:31 [Zakim]
- janina, you wanted to offer vocabulary to describe rtl -- retrograde
- 14:51:09 [mike_beganyi]
- janina: "retrograde" as the term for things being the same LTR as RTL
- 14:51:47 [mike_beganyi]
- janina: don't want to be caught up in Bliss' nomenclature and process
- 14:52:36 [Matthew_Atkinson]
- q+
- 14:53:06 [mike_beganyi]
- Lionel_Wolberger: what people need are recipes and procedures according to expert.
- 14:55:17 [Matthew_Atkinson]
- I think this may be the site Lionel referred to: https://globalsymbols.com/
- 14:55:23 [janina]
- +1 to Lionel's suggestions
- 14:55:25 [mike_beganyi]
- Lionel_Wolberger: exciting conversation. recommended recipe. thought it could in combination with simplification
- 14:55:33 [Lionel_Wolberger_]
- q?
- 14:55:40 [mike_beganyi]
- ack Matthew_Atkinson
- 14:56:56 [mike_beganyi]
- Matthew_Atkinson: concerned about some messages. we need to be clear about the use case so that we can capture as wide an audience as possible initially
- 14:58:21 [mike_beganyi]
- Lionel_Wolberger: finding other symbols more useful than Bliss'
- 14:59:08 [mike_beganyi]
- janina: recipe is a great word. we want to support all use cases and mechanisms
- 14:59:12 [Lionel_Wolberger_]
- ARASAAC
- 14:59:26 [Lionel_Wolberger_]
- https://globalsymbols.com
- 14:59:41 [mike_beganyi]
- Lionel_Wolberger: this is a symbol set from the global symbols site
- 15:00:18 [mike_beganyi]
- Lionel_Wolberger: proposing using recipe instead of Alice in Wonderland. which recipe should we pick?
- 15:00:50 [mike_beganyi]
- janina: why not just use cup of tea as it has been around for a long time
- 15:01:51 [mike_beganyi]
- Lionel_Wolberger: maybe too simple. how about salsa?
- 15:03:22 [mike_beganyi]
- Lionel_Wolberger: Charles please get recipe to Matthew and involve Steve Lee
- 15:03:36 [mike_beganyi]
- CharlesL: will find and send forward
- 15:04:29 [mike_beganyi]
- Matthew_Atkinson: be mindful of licensing. ARASAAC seems to be creative commons and non-commercial. should be fine for W3C but may be an issue later
- 15:05:00 [mike_beganyi]
- Lionel_Wolberger: still some unanswered questions but have enough to mark up new content
- 15:06:11 [Matthew_Atkinson]
- RRSAgent, make minutes
- 15:06:11 [RRSAgent]
- I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2021/10/11-personalization-minutes.html Matthew_Atkinson
- 15:09:56 [LisaSeemanKest]
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