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11:55:20 <kaz> meeting: WoT-IG/WG vF2F Meeting in March - Day 1
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12:02:20 <kaz> present+ Kaz_Ashimura, Ben_Francis, Christian_Blick, Cristiano_Aguzzi, Ege_Korkan, Hiroshi_Murayama
12:02:42 <kaz> present+ Jens_Schimmelpfennig
12:02:44 <Jens_Schimmelpfennig> Jens_Schimmelpfennig has joined #wot
12:02:58 <matsuda> matsuda has joined #wot
12:03:07 <kaz> present+ Kunihiko_Toumura, Michael_Lagally, Tetsushi_Matsuda, Yoshiaki_Sonoda
12:03:46 <zkis> zkis has joined #wot
12:04:11 <kaz> zakim, who is on the call?
12:04:11 <Zakim> Present: Kaz_Ashimura, Ben_Francis, Christian_Blick, Cristiano_Aguzzi, Ege_Korkan, Hiroshi_Murayama, Jens_Schimmelpfennig, Kunihiko_Toumura, Michael_Lagally, Tetsushi_Matsuda,
12:04:14 <Zakim> ... Yoshiaki_Sonoda
12:05:01 <kaz> present+ Daniel_Peintner
12:05:25 <kaz> present+ Michael_McCool
12:05:29 <kaz> Chair: McCool
12:05:47 <kaz> Agenda: https://www.w3.org/WoT/IG/wiki/F2F_meeting,_March_2021#Monday_March_15
12:05:56 <kaz> present+ Philip_Tran
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12:07:13 <kaz> topic: Agenda bashing
12:07:35 <kaz> -> https://www.w3.org/WoT/IG/wiki/F2F_meeting,_March_2021#Monday_March_15 agenda for today
12:08:02 <kaz> present- Christian_Blick
12:08:09 <kaz> present+ CHristian_Block
12:08:20 <dsr> dsr has joined #wot
12:08:22 <ryuichi> ryuichi has joined #wot
12:08:42 <kaz> topic: Guests and W3C Patent Policy
12:08:46 <kaz> -> https://www.w3.org/Consortium/Patent-Policy-20170801/ W3C Patent Policy
12:09:15 <kaz> mm: by joining this call, we assume everybody agrees to the W3C patent policy above
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12:10:03 <kaz> present+ Dave_Raggett
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12:10:27 <kaz> mm: today's call is organized for the IG side, though
12:10:34 <kaz> present+ Ege_Korkan
12:10:52 <kaz> present+ Ryuichi_Matsukura
12:11:00 <kaz> present+ Sebastian_Kaebisch
12:11:07 <kaz> present+ Tomoaki_Mizushima
12:11:44 <kaz> mm: (quickly shows the agenda of the vF2F this week and next)
12:11:56 <kaz> ... joint sessions with liaison orgs today
12:12:09 <kaz> ...Discovery on March 17
12:12:17 <kaz> ... Use Cases on March 18
12:12:30 <kaz> ... Architecture and Profiles on March 22
12:12:57 <kaz> ml: includes some use cases discussion with ITU-T as well on March 22
12:13:01 <kaz> mm: ok
12:13:20 <kaz> ... (adds that to the slides)
12:13:27 <kaz> ... any other changes?
12:13:29 <kaz> (none)
12:13:53 <kaz> i/joint/IG: joint/
12:14:13 <kaz> s/...Discovery/... WG: Discovery/
12:14:30 <kaz> s/... Arch/... IG: Arch
12:14:46 <kaz> ... (shows today's agenda)
12:15:14 <sebastian> sebastian has joined #wot
12:15:20 <kaz> topic: scribes
12:15:27 <kaz> kaz: will take notes for the first part
12:15:31 <kaz> ... need one more
12:15:51 <kaz> mm: volunteer?
12:16:05 <kaz> ek: will do
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12:16:32 <kaz> rrsagent, make log public
12:16:36 <kaz> rrsagent, draft minutes
12:16:36 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2021/03/15-wot-minutes.html kaz
12:16:58 <kaz> mm: presenters, please send your slides to me
12:17:05 <kaz> ... will install them on GitHub
12:17:41 <McCool> q+
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12:17:45 <McCool> q?
12:17:50 <McCool> ack mccool
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12:18:17 <kaz> present+ Yoshiaki_Sonoda
12:18:42 <kaz> (Sebastian gives all reminder on the IRC)
12:19:22 <kaz> topic: WT summary and status
12:19:55 <kaz> mm: because we have many guests today
12:20:33 <kaz> ... would like to summarize what WoT is like
12:20:59 <kaz> -> slides @@@
12:21:11 <kaz> mm: [W3C Web of Things (WoT)]
12:21:23 <kaz> ... adapting Web technologies to IoT
12:21:30 <kaz> ... we're on our 2nd Charter
12:22:14 <kaz> ... TD metadata format is already done, and big chunk is for this charter includes discovery
12:22:22 <kaz> ... [WoT Descriptive Interperability
12:22:31 <kaz> s/Inter/Intero/
12:22:34 <kaz> s/ty/ty]/
12:22:50 <kaz> ... WoT Architecture and WoT Thing Description
12:23:28 <kaz> ... affordances are abstract layer to handle devices
12:24:02 <kaz> ... [Usage Patterns Overview]
12:24:22 <kaz> ... vertical use cases based on the industry needs
12:24:45 <kaz> ... [WoT Orchestrations]
12:24:59 <kaz> ... multiple things there to be combined with each other
12:25:18 <kaz> ... opensource implementation based on Node-RED named node-gen
12:25:26 <kaz> ... and node-wot for Scripting API
12:25:53 <kaz> ... including discovery capability
12:26:06 <kaz> ... will be mentioned during the plugfest report
12:26:17 <kaz> ... [Current WoT WG Charter Work Items]
12:26:36 <kaz> ... a lot of topics
12:26:49 <kaz> ... [Current Status]
12:26:52 <kaz> ... links here
12:27:00 <kaz> ... architecture 1.1 draft
12:27:03 <kaz> ... TD 1.1
12:27:06 <kaz> ... Discovery
12:27:08 <kaz> ... Profiles
12:27:12 <kaz> ... Binding Templates
12:27:16 <kaz> ... Scripting API
12:27:32 <kaz> ... new Group page at https://www.w3.org/WoT/
12:27:42 <kaz> ... questions?
12:27:43 <kaz> (none)
12:28:16 <kaz> topic: IEC CDD
12:28:59 <kaz> Hiroshi_Murayama(hm)
12:30:35 <kaz> hm: [Common Data Dictionary (CDD) on Parcellized Ontology Model and related standards]
12:30:49 <kaz> ... [CDD in a nutshell]
12:30:57 <kaz> ... Common Data Dictionary
12:31:19 <kaz> ... based on IEC 61360-2, ISO 13584-42
12:31:34 <kaz> ... by IEC SC 3D and ISO TC184/SC4
12:31:52 <kaz> ... evolution of ontology elements
12:32:14 <kaz> ... [CDD in a nutshell 2/2]
12:32:20 <McCool> q+
12:32:33 <sebastian> q+
12:32:50 <kaz> ... ontology developed over time
12:33:11 <kaz> ... used in system infrastructures
12:33:30 <kaz> ... [Base standards]
12:33:52 <kaz> ... data model: IEC 61360-2, ISO 13584-42, IEC 62656-1 and ISO 13584-35
12:35:51 <kaz> ... exchange formats: ISO 13584-32, IEC 62656-1, IEC 62656-8... doain data dictionaries / ontologies being stored and to be stored: IEC 61987-11, 62683, ISO 13584-501, 13584-511, ISO 13399, ISO 23584
12:36:19 <kaz> ... plant automation, switch gear/control panel, laboratory instruments, ...
12:36:54 <kaz> ... IEC DD has been extended in coverage as well as in its functionality
12:37:20 <kaz> ... current IEC CDD is implemented as a subset of IEC 62656-1
12:37:45 <kaz> ... relational ontology model and evolved from ISO 13584-35
12:38:04 <kaz> ... multi-lingual model
12:38:18 <kaz> ... [Cooperation among TCs/SC in IEC & ISO]
12:38:29 <kaz> ... (diagram on the activity)
12:38:37 <kaz> ... [4-layer ontology data model]
12:38:57 <kaz> ... 1. axiomatic ontology (AO)
12:39:03 <kaz> ... 2. meta ontology (MO)
12:39:17 <kaz> ... 3. domain otology (DO)
12:39:22 <kaz> ... 4. domain library (DL)
12:39:56 <kaz> ... [Every layer of ontology in POM is defined as a set of instances of its upper layer, except the Axiomatic Ontology layer at the top]
12:40:21 <kaz> ... M4-M3 for AO M3-M2 for MO, M2-M1 for DO, M1-M0 for DL
12:40:38 <kaz> ... DL is provided by each company
12:41:20 <kaz> ... [Reference mechanism in IEC61360(PLIB) & IEC62656(POM)]
12:41:26 <kaz> ... structure of the ontologies
12:41:55 <kaz> ... class ID -> class -> translated text -> property -> property ID
12:42:19 <kaz> ... relationship between the elements over time to be maintained
12:42:41 <kaz> ... [Class needs to point eactly the specific version, when ontology evolves over time]
12:43:34 <kaz> ... [Reference mechanism in POM/CDD]
12:44:15 <kaz> ... ICID defined in IEC 62656-1 (IO 13584-35) adds separator1 (default "#")
12:44:31 <kaz> ... and separator 2 (default "##") which may be redefined
12:44:46 <kaz> ... [Detail of the RAI
12:44:50 <kaz> s/RAI/RAI]/
12:44:57 <kaz> ... [IEC CDD as online DB]
12:45:55 <kaz> => https://cdd.iec.ch/cdd/iec61360/iec61360.nsf/TreeFrameset?OpenFrameSet IEC 61360
12:46:17 <kaz> s/=>/->/
12:46:29 <kaz> ... [Domain standard development with IEC CDD]
12:46:44 <kaz> ... actual definition is stored within the CDD
12:47:25 <kaz> ... actual content is maintained and updated on the ontology side
12:47:52 <kaz> present+ Christian_Glomb
12:48:15 <kaz> ... [Concept of Class, Property, and Relation]
12:48:23 <kaz> ... [Concept of class in CDD/POM]
12:48:52 <kaz> ... Class C = {X| P1(x1)} ^ P2(x2) ^ ... ^ Pn(xn)}
12:49:30 <kaz> ... [Concept of class and property in CDD/POM]
12:49:43 <kaz> ... [Future? COR on POM as an extended CDD]
12:49:47 <kaz> ... (diagram)
12:50:03 <kaz> ... (this is inline with DPPC final report)
12:50:19 <kaz> ... Common Ontology Repository (COR)
12:50:27 <kaz> ... [Collaboration and cooperation]
12:50:38 <kaz> ... ISO TC184/SC4 and IEC...
12:50:44 <kaz> ... [Summary]
12:51:03 <McCool> q?
12:51:04 <kaz> ... CDD implemented opnsource
12:51:16 <kaz> mm: tx!
12:51:30 <kaz> ... time check
12:51:43 <kaz> ... ok to have discussion within 10mins
12:51:46 <mlagally> q+
12:51:54 <kaz> ... if we need to add anything
12:52:06 <kaz> ... need to understand concrete applications
12:52:26 <kaz> ... we're aiming for finalizing the procedure
12:52:50 <kaz> ... point for connection should be Thing Description and Thing Model
12:53:01 <kaz> ... any existing method to be adapted based on RDF?
12:53:17 <kaz> hm: ontology overtime
12:53:18 <kaz> q?
12:53:19 <kaz> q+
12:53:46 <kaz> mm: additional capability might be version management
12:53:53 <kaz> ... sounds like maybe not completely
12:54:01 <kaz> ... we do support SPARQL
12:54:18 <kaz> ... important to figure out how to access CDD
12:54:37 <kaz> ... maybe search over versions
12:54:44 <kaz> ack mc
12:54:47 <kaz> ack se
12:54:55 <kaz> sk: thanks a lot first
12:55:17 <kaz> ... wondering you use the term "Ontology"
12:55:24 <kaz> ... assuming it's based on RDF
12:55:33 <kaz> ... s/wondering/
12:55:41 <kaz> s/wondering//
12:55:54 <kaz> hm: RDF is just format for the ontology
12:56:10 <kaz> sk: tools to discover the actual definition?
12:56:23 <kaz> ... what kind of format to be exported?
12:56:35 <kaz> hm: mostly XML is used
12:56:42 <kaz> ... JSON is also possible
12:56:56 <McCool> q?
12:57:12 <kaz> ... there is a list of exposed format
12:57:26 <kaz> ml: many thanks
12:57:42 <kaz> ... online DB
12:57:45 <kaz> ... how many entries?
12:57:52 <kaz> ... how many types?
12:58:05 <kaz> hm: more than 20 ontologies
12:58:35 <kaz> ... and maybe 10 thousand entries?
12:58:54 <kaz> ml: what is the typical target areas?
12:59:01 <kaz> hm: semiconductor, etc.
12:59:15 <kaz> ... but it's just a part
12:59:17 <McCool> q+
12:59:23 <kaz> ack ml
12:59:35 <kaz> yoshiaki_sonoda(ys)
12:59:46 <kaz> ys: let me provide some information
12:59:51 <McCool> q?
13:00:02 <kaz> ... oil, gas, power, etc., is included
13:00:14 <kaz> ... more types of dictionary for ISO community
13:00:43 <kaz> ... originally oil and gas but recently extended for electric power
13:00:50 <kaz> ... imported CDD
13:01:05 <kaz> ... one of the purposes of the open CDD DB
13:01:33 <kaz> ... we'll have more sort of dictionaries (for broader vocabularies)
13:01:42 <kaz> hm: (shows the diagram again)
13:01:54 <kaz> ... [Cooperation among TCs/SCs in IEC & ISO]
13:02:06 <kaz> ml: engineering purposes?
13:02:13 <kaz> hm: including engineering
13:02:46 <kaz> q?
13:03:42 <McCool> q?
13:03:43 <kaz> ack k
13:03:50 <sebastian> q+
13:04:05 <kaz> kaz: tx
13:04:30 <kaz> ... think we should continue collaboration on how to refer to the data defined CDD from the WoT side
13:04:52 <kaz> mm: should work on 2 levels
13:05:01 <kaz> ... 1. short-term for this Charter period
13:05:10 <kaz> ... and 2. longer-term for the future work
13:05:34 <kaz> ... long-term liaison to be considered for the next Charter too
13:05:49 <kaz> ... btw, wondering about the IEC CDD and ECLASS's work
13:06:23 <McCool> q?
13:07:15 <kaz> mm: does ECLASS depends on the IEC work?
13:07:16 <mjk> mjk has joined #wot
13:07:28 <kaz> cb: IEC CDD is data model
13:07:33 <kaz> ... and basis of ECLASS
13:07:46 <kaz> ... ECLASS defined data as part of CDD
13:07:48 <mjk> Can someone please send me the teleconference coordinates?
13:08:33 <kaz> cb: IEC work is industry-independent
13:09:46 <kaz> cb: ECLASS develops its own JSON model as well
13:09:52 <kaz> present+ Michael_Koster
13:10:10 <kaz> sk: so was wondering about RDF export of CDD
13:10:20 <kaz> q?
13:10:26 <kaz> ack m
13:10:27 <kaz> ack s
13:10:50 <McCool> q+
13:11:01 <kaz> sk: if there is an RDF version, could be integrated with Thing Description easily
13:11:16 <sebastian> ack s
13:11:26 <kaz> mm: would like to focus on the next step
13:11:32 <kaz> q+
13:11:35 <kaz> ack m
13:12:36 <kaz> kaz: we should continue more collaborative discussion to reuse CDD data for WoT purposes
13:13:00 <kaz> ... maybe we can do that via official liaison but should have more discussion first
13:13:03 <kaz> ack k
13:13:05 <kaz> mm: right
13:13:21 <kaz> ... should have more discussion to define the goal
13:13:50 <kaz> ... how to proceed?
13:14:07 <sebastian> q+
13:14:14 <kaz> kaz: if it's OK by the IEC side, we can establish/extend a simple liaison for that purpose
13:14:27 <kaz> q?
13:14:30 <kaz> ack s
13:14:36 <kaz> sk: would see use cases as well
13:14:47 <McCool> q+
13:14:50 <kaz> q+
13:14:55 <kaz> ack m
13:14:58 <kaz> mm: makes sense
13:15:22 <kaz> ... we have vertical/horizontal use cases
13:15:49 <kaz> ... concretely and logistically, we hold use cases call biweekly
13:16:13 <kaz> ml: we'll have use cases session during the vF2F as well on Thursday, March 18
13:16:35 <kaz> mm: note that this is the virtual F2F call this week and next
13:16:48 <kaz> ... we hold regular calls biweekly as well
13:17:22 <kaz> mm: (shows the use cases session agenda on March 18)
13:17:31 <McCool> https://www.w3.org/WoT/IG/wiki/Main_WoT_WebConf
13:17:44 <kaz> mm: or you can join the regular Use Cases call
13:18:19 <kaz> ... when will be the next call?
13:18:31 <kaz> ml: in April but should confirm
13:19:19 <kaz> kaz: would like to continue the discussion with Murayama-san and Sonoda-san about further collaboration
13:19:58 <kaz> hm: btw, please note that IEC and ECLASS are completely different organizations
13:20:01 <kaz> mm: got it
13:20:44 <kaz> cb: can provide information about ECLASS as well
13:21:07 <kaz> mm: ok
13:21:18 <sebastian> q?
13:21:21 <kaz> ack k
13:21:29 <kaz> [10min break]
13:22:38 <kaz> (Murayama-san and Sonoda-san leave)
13:22:45 <kaz> s/[10min break]//
13:22:51 <kaz> [10min break]
13:31:59 <kaz> scribenick: Ege
13:32:05 <kaz> rrsagent, draft minutes
13:32:05 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2021/03/15-wot-minutes.html kaz
13:33:03 <kaz> topic: WebThings
13:33:29 <kaz> i/agenda for today/scribenick: kaz/
13:33:37 <kaz> -> slides @@@
13:33:50 <kaz> bf: (introduces himself)
13:34:00 <kaz> ... [WebThings Gateway]
13:34:22 <Ege> oops
13:34:28 <kaz> ... backend with NodeJS
13:34:31 <Ege> sorry now taking nodes
13:34:43 <Ege> bf: gateways is a producer and consumer at the same time
13:34:45 <kaz> s/oops//
13:34:51 <kaz> s/sorry now taking nodes//
13:35:07 <Ege> ... to consume TDs and re expose them to the internet securely
13:35:19 <kaz> s/scribenick: Ege//
13:35:27 <kaz> i/gateways/scribenick: Ege/
13:36:22 <kaz> present+ Zoltan_Kis
13:36:22 <Ege> ... The exposed TDs can be made W3C compliant quite easily
13:36:31 <Ege> ... consuming is different
13:37:29 <Ege> ... thanks Siemens for contracting Cristiano to make the gateway TD compliant
13:38:07 <kaz> rrsagent, draft minutes
13:38:07 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2021/03/15-wot-minutes.html kaz
13:38:15 <Ege> ... we have drafted a plan
13:38:25 <McCool> q+
13:38:37 <kaz> s/WT summary/WoT summary/
13:40:43 <Ege> q+
13:40:55 <Ege> ... I have created a PR for the repo to add the slides
13:41:01 <Ege> ... these are the links for issues
13:41:32 <sebastian> find all issues here: https://github.com/WebThingsIO/gateway/labels/w3c-compliance
13:42:01 <kaz> s/slides @@@/Ben's slides @@@/
13:42:16 <kaz> s|slides @@@|https://github.com/w3c/wot/tree/master/PRESENTATIONS/2021-03-online-f2f McCool's slides|
13:42:18 <kaz> rrsagent, draft minutes
13:42:18 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2021/03/15-wot-minutes.html kaz
13:42:27 <Ege> ... I have also submitted feedback for the profile TF
13:42:54 <kaz> i/Hiroshi_Murayama/-> Murayama-san's slides @@@/
13:43:01 <Ege> ... also this week I have reviewed the discovery spec and I have provided feedback
13:43:38 <McCool> q?
13:44:21 <kaz> s|https://github.com/w3c/wot/tree/master/PRESENTATIONS/2021-03-online-f2f McCool's slides|slides tbd|
13:44:33 <kaz> rrsagent, draft minutes
13:44:33 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2021/03/15-wot-minutes.html kaz
13:45:07 <Ege> mm: we had some work on the additional and error, did you check that?
13:45:19 <Ege> bf: yes I have been following those discussions
13:45:26 <kaz> s|-> slides @@@|-> https://github.com/w3c/wot/tree/master/PRESENTATIONS/2021-03-online-f2f McCool's slides|
13:45:28 <kaz> rrsagent, draft minutes
13:45:28 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2021/03/15-wot-minutes.html kaz
13:45:40 <Ege> ... error and additional responses are in a good direction since they are needed for describing the full API
13:46:30 <Ege> mm: maybe there should be a testbed for these dynamic resources
13:47:31 <Ege> bf: TDs cannot describe collections of resources
13:48:11 <kaz> q?
13:48:19 <kaz> ack mc
13:48:40 <McCool> q?
13:49:38 <kaz> ek: wondering how the data consumption is done
13:50:01 <sebastian> q+
13:50:09 <dape> q+
13:50:12 <sebastian> ack e
13:50:31 <kaz> bf: making the WebThings W3C compliant is the question here
13:50:43 <kaz> ... (shows the WebThings Gateway diagram again)
13:51:06 <kaz> ... adapters communicate on the backends
13:51:28 <kaz> ... the individual adapter communicates with the backend
13:52:04 <kaz> q?
13:52:06 <kaz> q+
13:52:44 <kaz> ek: if I have a Zigbee device, should use some specific API?
13:52:54 <kaz> bf: you can use some Thing Description for that purpose
13:53:15 <kaz> ek: in that case, why there is compatible problem there?
13:53:22 <kaz> bf: good question
13:53:41 <mjk> don't we have a TM which was converted from the OneDM model for a Zigbee Level cluster?
13:53:48 <kaz> ... the gateway may bridges some local network and the Internet
13:53:50 <McCool> q?
13:54:08 <kaz> present+ Farshid_Tavakolizadeh
13:54:18 <kaz> i/making/scribenick: kaz/
13:54:23 <kaz> scribenick: Ege/
13:54:49 <Ege> bf: so the gateway consumes WebThings in the network (via Thing URL adapter) and this follows the WebThing API. This requires each adapter to adapt to this
13:55:14 <Ege> sk: I am very happy to see that Webthings will be also using TDs
13:55:39 <Ege> ... what do you think is the best way to approach the 3rd party library developers
13:56:36 <McCool> q?
13:56:39 <McCool> ack s
13:57:01 <McCool> ack d
13:58:07 <Ege> sk: for the python I know someone who can have a look
13:58:47 <Ege> dp: can the third party libraries stay behind?
13:59:21 <Ege> bf: They can but this will be a breaking change and we want all users of the gateway to upgrade timely
13:59:35 <McCool> q?
13:59:57 <Ege> kaz: thank you for considering compatibility with TDs
14:00:14 <Ege> ... we should work on a best practices kind of guideline together
14:00:54 <Ege> mm: thank you for the presentation and guiding this
14:00:58 <mjk> s/don't we have/We have
14:01:08 <kaz> s/together/together and clarify which entity uses what data models and interfaces/
14:01:44 <kaz> topic: T2TRG
14:02:01 <Ege> mm: sadly ari, carsten and others from the group could not join
14:02:18 <kaz> s/join/join this call/
14:02:26 <McCool> https://github.com/t2trg/2021-ietf110
14:02:27 <kaz> s/and/or/
14:02:45 <McCool> https://codimd.ietf.org/notes-ietf-110-t2trg
14:03:50 <Ege> ... the main outcome was MJK working on converting ASDF <-> TD converter
14:04:14 <kaz> s/MJK/Koster's/
14:04:19 <kaz> q?
14:04:21 <kaz> ack k
14:05:14 <Ege> mm: (shows website of IETF meeting on ASDF)
14:05:24 <Ege> ... I did a WoT update session
14:05:45 <kaz> s|https://github.com/t2trg/2021-ietf110|-> https://github.com/t2trg/2021-ietf110 Agenda|
14:05:57 <kaz> s|https://codimd.ietf.org/notes-ietf-110-t2trg|-> https://codimd.ietf.org/notes-ietf-110-t2trg Minutes|
14:06:16 <Ege> mm: milan milenkovic is working on an IOT landscape document
14:06:35 <Ege> ... trying to put a table with a taxonomy
14:06:47 <kaz> s/IOT/IoT/
14:06:51 <Ege> ...I need to get together with MJK and Milan to continue on this work
14:08:19 <kaz> s/MJK/Koster/
14:10:04 <Ege> mk: you can have a TM for a zigbee device that doesn't have network addresses
14:10:10 <sebastian> sdf-2-TM tool: https://github.com/roman-kravtsov/sdf-object-converter
14:12:13 <kaz> q?
14:12:38 <Ege> mm: there is another paper under review about iot edge challenges
14:14:03 <sebastian> q+
14:15:42 <kaz> -> https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-sarikaya-t2trg-sbootstrapping-11 Secure IoT Bootstrapping: A Survey
14:15:58 <Ege> mm: I gave feedback on removing some words like configuration from the IoT bootstrapping analysis
14:16:28 <kaz> s/configuration/"Configuration"/
14:17:18 <kaz> i/https/mm: next on bootstrapping terminology/
14:17:31 <kaz> q?
14:18:23 <Ege> mk: we have finalized ASDF and have draft 5 which is a stable release for implementations
14:18:33 <kaz> -> https://github.com/one-data-model/ OneDM repo
14:19:20 <Ege> mk: we can create TMs from SDF definitions
14:19:27 <kaz> q+
14:20:50 <Ege> mm: for ben, maybe you can take TMs instead of TDs for integrating into the gateway
14:21:03 <benfrancis> q+
14:21:14 <kaz> q--
14:21:17 <McCool> q?
14:21:23 <kaz> q- later
14:21:47 <Ege> sk: regarding edge discussion, was there any discussion on edgex foundry?
14:22:12 <Ege> mm: that is a completely different projects, like webthing
14:22:52 <kaz> s/projects/project/
14:22:56 <Ege> ... it allows integrating Things through a gateway
14:23:30 <McCool> q?
14:23:32 <sebastian> ack s
14:23:46 <kaz> ack b
14:23:48 <Ege> bf: I need to look at onedm
14:24:51 <Ege> ... Have you tried zigbee definitions with physical devices?
14:25:34 <Ege> ... there is another project called zigbee to mqtt and the community did an amazing job of classifying zigbee devices
14:26:42 <kaz> s/zigbee to mqtt/"zigbee2mqtt"/
14:27:29 <Ege> mk: onedm will help with defining new zigbee devices
14:27:32 <McCool> q?
14:28:13 <Ege> mk: bluetooth is also onboard
14:29:35 <Ege> bf: we have capability schemas on our repository
14:31:38 <McCool> q?
14:32:33 <Ege> mk: we were lagging behind with ? due to huawei ban
14:32:48 <McCool> s/?/oneM2M/
14:33:24 <Ege> ... regarding iotschema.org, we talked with Dan Brickley. They will not be merged. They want to focus on datatypes and not interested in affordances
14:34:52 <Ege> kaz: after onedm bringing sdf idea to ietf, is this repository still used by onedm?
14:35:43 <Ege> mk: we wil also have our CI tool so that you can use it in your own repos
14:36:14 <kaz> s/due to huawei ban//
14:36:41 <kaz> s/wil /will /
14:36:49 <Ege> topic: echonet
14:37:06 <kaz> -> Matsuda-san's slides tbd
14:37:36 <kaz> Tetsushi Matsuda (tm)
14:38:05 <Ege> tm: I am representing Itahara-san (not sure about the name)
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14:38:15 <Ege> ... who is the liaison
14:38:35 <kaz> s/ Itahara-san (not sure about the name)/ Hirahara-san/
14:39:02 <kaz> s/liaison/liaison contact from ECHONET/
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14:40:43 <Ege> tm: each device is described via properties
14:40:57 <Ege> ... actions are done via setting a property
14:40:58 <kaz> s/via/as classes via/
14:41:36 <kaz> (tm shows the structure of the ECHONET Lite Web API Guidelines)
14:43:09 <kaz> tm: devices are modeled with property, action and event as in WoT
14:43:20 <Ege> ... there are read status, control and notication funcitons
14:43:30 <kaz> s/... there/tm: there/
14:43:42 <Ege> ... notify function is like observable in WoT
14:44:52 <kaz> q+ to ask if "getting the list of devices" is kind of discovery
14:45:48 <Ege> ... you can define a group of devices and client can set them with one API call
14:46:06 <McCool> q+
14:46:11 <kaz> q+ to ask if there is any specific API to group multiple devices
14:46:26 <Ege> ... the cloud can do the individual requests
14:47:02 <kaz> q+ to ask what the data model for history is like
14:47:04 <Ege> ... it is also possible to implement historical data in servers. The client cannot ask for the recording to begin but can read historical data
14:48:50 <Ege> ... we also have guidelines for the API such as HTTPS, HTTP 1.1, json, utf8
14:52:32 <Ege> ... For INF (notification) it is desireable to support push notification mechanisms
14:52:42 <Ege> ... echonet specifies websocket, MQTT and longpoll
14:53:27 <McCool> q?
14:55:02 <sebastian> q+
14:55:04 <McCool> ok
14:55:10 <kaz> q- later
14:55:38 <kaz> tm: differences with WoT
14:55:58 <kaz> ... syntax, ...
14:56:42 <kaz> mm: would extend the meeting by 5 mins to finalize the discussion
14:56:50 <dape> q+ to bulk actions revoced if one action fails?
14:56:59 <kaz> ... interested in the "grouping" functionality
14:58:16 <kaz> sk: how to handle eventing using HTTPS?
14:58:21 <Ege> sk: thank you for the nice presentation and comparison to WoT. how do you realize eventing
14:58:32 <kaz> s/sk: how to handle eventing using HTTPS?//
14:58:59 <Ege> tm: we use longpolling, websocket, mqtt and webhook to implement eventing
14:59:01 <kaz> ack m
14:59:02 <kaz> ack s
14:59:08 <McCool> q?
14:59:23 <Ege> https://github.com/w3c/wot-thing-description/issues/892 regarding historical data
15:00:05 <Ege> q+
15:00:40 <Ege> sk: is there no form data in the device description?
15:00:40 <McCool> (right, so it seems the URLs etc. are implied by the property name, etc)
15:01:04 <Ege> tm: since we support only http, we simplify the device description and do not include binding templates
15:01:45 <kaz> ack k
15:01:45 <Zakim> kaz, you wanted to ask if "getting the list of devices" is kind of discovery and to ask if there is any specific API to group multiple devices and to ask what the data model for
15:01:48 <Zakim> ... history is like
15:04:39 <McCool> (so discovery starts with the hub URL, where you can get list of devices, and also devices by type, but there is not a general content-based query mechanism)
15:05:54 <kaz> q?
15:06:41 <kaz> tm: regarding grouping, the client can define a group of devices with some expected actions
15:06:48 <kaz> ack d
15:06:48 <Zakim> dape, you wanted to bulk actions revoced if one action fails?
15:07:48 <kaz> tm: my question was HTTP body encoding
15:08:02 <Ege> dp: regarding the href, a WoT thing can choose to that kind of hierarchy but does not have to
15:08:17 <kaz> s/tm: my question was HTTP body encoding//
15:09:24 <kaz> tm: if the transaction succeeded, you'll get the new property value back from the device side
15:09:49 <kaz> (=equal to the set property itself)
15:10:15 <Ege> dp: regarding the bulk operation, what happens if one does not turn on? do you notice it somehow?
15:10:32 <kaz> dp: what if we turn on several lamps at once and part of them failed
15:10:44 <kaz> s/failed/failed?/
15:11:00 <McCool> q?
15:11:58 <Ege> tm: it is best effort
15:12:19 <kaz> tm: the client can identify if the action failed
15:12:54 <kaz> q?
15:12:57 <kaz> ack e
15:13:34 <Ege> https://github.com/w3c/wot-thing-description/issues/892
15:14:51 <kaz> tm: the client can get a history object
15:15:05 <McCool> (we have to wrap up though... so I'm going to have to close the queue and ask for next steps)
15:15:07 <kaz> i/the/ek: question on hitory/
15:15:18 <kaz> zakim, close the queue
15:15:18 <Zakim> ok, kaz, the speaker queue is closed
15:15:25 <kaz> q?
15:17:23 <kaz> mm: would like to have a follow-up call, e.g., during the Use Cases calls
15:17:32 <kaz> ... can you join the Use Cases call?
15:17:33 <kaz> tm: yes
15:18:32 <kaz> ... but the liaison procedure on the ECHONET side is still being discussed
15:18:41 <kaz> kaz: will talk with them again about that
15:18:43 <kaz> mm: ok
15:19:26 <kaz> sk: also would be great if ECHONET can join the upcoming Plugfests
15:19:30 <kaz> mm: yeah
15:19:38 <kaz> ... that would be in October
15:20:08 <kaz> ek: wondering if there is any device publicly exposed?
15:20:12 <kaz> tm: no
15:20:38 <kaz> ... maybe could provide something for the WoT guys for Plugfests
15:20:47 <kaz> ... but need confirmation from the ECHONET org
15:20:53 <Ege> ek: are there any public API?
15:21:20 <kaz> s/any device/any API/
15:21:42 <kaz> topic: Wrapup
15:21:46 <kaz> mm: Discovery on Wed
15:22:01 <kaz> [adjourned]
15:22:07 <kaz> rrsagent, draft minutes
15:22:08 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2021/03/15-wot-minutes.html kaz
15:22:12 <Ege> tm: there is the experiment cloud that is open to members, we should discuss
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