15:51:23 <RRSAgent> RRSAgent has joined #pbgsc
15:51:23 <RRSAgent> logging to https://www.w3.org/2021/03/12-pbgsc-irc
15:51:26 <Zakim> RRSAgent, make logs Public
15:51:27 <Zakim> Meeting: Publishing Steering Committee
15:51:53 <Ralph> agenda: https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-publishing-sc/2021Mar/0002.html
15:52:05 <Ralph> agenda+ Any EPUBcheck updates?
15:52:12 <Ralph> agenda+ London Book Fair
15:52:20 <Ralph> agenda+ Debrief on WCAG 3 presentations to the BG and followup actions
15:52:29 <Ralph> agenda+ Next Publishing@W3C webinar?
15:52:36 <Ralph> agenda+ Around the Table
15:52:39 <Ralph> agenda+ AOB
15:52:56 <Ralph> -> https://www.w3.org/2021/02/12-pbgsc-minutes.html previous 12-Feb
15:53:26 <Ralph> regrets: BillK, George
15:54:07 <Daihei> Daihei has joined #pbgsc
15:54:16 <Daihei> present+
16:00:40 <mateus> mateus has joined #pbgsc
16:02:14 <dauwhe> present+
16:02:20 <tzviya> present+
16:02:35 <liisamk> liisamk has joined #pbgsc
16:02:42 <avneeshsingh> avneeshsingh has joined #pbgsc
16:02:46 <liisamk> present+
16:02:51 <avneeshsingh> present+
16:02:53 <ivan> present+
16:03:11 <Ralph> present+
16:03:17 <mateus> present+
16:03:42 <wendyreid> present+
16:03:45 <Ralph> zakim, who’s on the call?
16:03:45 <Zakim> I don't understand your question, Ralph.
16:04:56 <Ralph> scribe+
16:05:09 <Ralph> zakim, next item
16:05:09 <Zakim> agendum 1 -- Any EPUBcheck updates? -- taken up [from Ralph]
16:05:24 <Ralph> zakim, who’s here?
16:05:24 <Zakim> I don't understand your question, Ralph.
16:05:43 <Ralph> Tzviya: Romain has sent me an update
16:06:08 <Ralph> ... I expect to work with him on an announcement on the release of 4.2.5 and the update to the web site
16:06:51 <Ralph> ... then we’ll continue with the next milestone
16:07:02 <Daihei> q+
16:07:12 <Ralph> Avneesh: I met with Romain yesterday and we discussed the preparation of that announcement
16:07:30 <Ralph> ... in the previous SC call I noted there are two releases coming up
16:07:45 <Ralph> ... the production-ready release will be next week
16:07:52 <Ralph> ... and the test release after that
16:08:01 <tzviya> ack Daihei
16:08:06 <Ralph> ... the new release will have localization updates for 6 or 7 languages
16:08:16 <Ralph> Daihei: how much fundraising remains to be done?
16:08:24 <Ralph> Avneesh: $7k
16:08:26 <ivan> q+
16:08:37 <Ralph> Daihei: I will make a campaign in Japan
16:09:06 <ivan> q+ for Garth
16:09:07 <Ralph> ... there were initial contributions from Japan; there’s been some time since then so it’s a good time to try it again
16:09:09 <tzviya> https://inclusivepublishing.org/epubcheckdonate/
16:09:12 <tzviya> ack ivan
16:09:12 <Zakim> ivan, you wanted to discuss Garth
16:09:21 <tzviya> ack ga
16:09:24 <ivan> q+
16:09:39 <Ralph> Garth: we met with Avneesh, George, Tzviya, and Rick to talk about going-forward fundraising
16:09:48 <Ralph> ... how we get EPUBcheck into a self-sustaining state
16:11:20 <Ralph> ... my back-of-the-envelope calculation was that if we could get the “big five” to decide that for every new EPUB ingested into their pipelines for sales, if they’d contribute 2 cents for each that would get a funding stream of at least $50k/year
16:11:56 <Ralph> ... it was suggested that I ask folk to ponder this in your companies; whether there’s any possibility
16:12:10 <tzviya> ack ivan
16:12:46 <Ralph> Ivan: Ralph and I have been waiting for Romain to settle the final URI for the EPUBcheck page
16:13:22 <Ralph> Ralph: we know the URI on the W3C side; we’re waiting to hear where to proxy it
16:13:24 <Ralph> Ivan: right
16:13:50 <Ralph> Avneesh: that’s fine; Romain will make the site ready -- he’s finishing the bits on Monday
16:13:55 <tzviya> ack Ralph
16:13:58 <Ralph> ... I’ll send you email when it’s ready
16:17:46 <Ralph> Ralph: I’ve been looking into the Web Monetization work
16:17:59 <Ralph> ... it might be of interest to this community
16:18:05 <Ralph> ... even maybe for EPUBcheck
16:18:29 <Ralph> zakim, next item
16:18:29 <Zakim> agendum 2 -- London Book Fair -- taken up [from Ralph]
16:18:52 <Ralph> Tzviya: it sounds like they’re planning an in-person event
16:18:59 <Ralph> ... anyone planning to attend?
16:19:26 <Ralph> Wendy: Rakuten has not reopened their international travel policy
16:19:33 <Ralph> Tzviya: same for Wiley
16:19:59 <Ralph> ... if they shift it to virtual, are we interested in submitting a presentation?
16:20:08 <Ralph> ... I’ve not been involved in LBF
16:20:23 <Ralph> Liisa: it’s mainly about people trading rights
16:20:31 <Ralph> ... there’s often a small section of digital booths
16:20:51 <Ralph> ... it’s a mini-Frankfurt in a way; they try to get some digital stuff going
16:21:07 <Ralph> Tzviya: so maybe we don’t need to invest time in it now
16:21:34 <Ralph> zakim, next item
16:21:34 <Zakim> agendum 3 -- Debrief on WCAG 3 presentations to the BG and followup actions -- taken up [from Ralph]
16:21:53 <liisamk> q+
16:21:57 <Ralph> Tzviya: Jeanne Spellman’s presentation and followup items; reactions?
16:22:01 <tzviya> ack liisamk
16:22:12 <Ralph> Liisa: the presentation was great; really helpful
16:22:30 <Ralph> ... I’ve had a lot of interesting conversations since then; people are excited about where things are going
16:22:44 <Ralph> ... there are some practical things on getting from here to there we should talk about
16:22:55 <Ralph> ... people I’ve talked with are excited about this new way of validating stuff
16:22:57 <tzviya> q+
16:23:04 <Ralph> ... and wondering how far to go with the criteria now
16:23:19 <Ralph> ... the idea of getting to ‘bronze’ and that being where governments focus is great
16:23:27 <tzviya> ack me
16:23:34 <Ralph> ... what are the incentives to get to silver or gold?
16:23:39 <wendyreid> q+
16:23:51 <Ralph> Tzviya: it’s an early working draft so those criteria aren’t settled yet
16:24:20 <Ralph> ... the section on functional needs and presenting user criteria shifts the guidelines on their head
16:24:35 <Ralph> ... it says “think about this from the perspective of the user with various needs”
16:24:53 <Ralph> ... I’ve been incorporating that now into my discussions and into my internal training
16:25:03 <tzviya> ack wendyreid
16:25:06 <Ralph> ... the WG asked for us to be engaged
16:25:11 <Ralph> ... we need to be engaged
16:25:18 <Ralph> Wendy: I loved the presentation
16:25:55 <Ralph> ... I’m really excited about the incentive being that silver and gold mean that you’re incorporating usability and accessibility into your processes
16:26:41 <Ralph> ... this is Kobo’s a11y initiative but it’s hard to explain externally; saying we’re measuring against silver or against gold will communicate it in a much better way
16:27:17 <Ralph> Tzviya: it’s great that EPUB is mentioned by name in the WG too
16:27:27 <Ralph> ... it would be great if we can provide some examples
16:27:40 <Ralph> ... we rely heavily on Daisy; maybe others could be involved as well
16:28:06 <Ralph> ... Bill has asked Jeanne if she’d do a presentation to IPTC
16:28:21 <Ralph> ... she seems happy to do more presentations
16:29:20 <Daihei> q+
16:29:25 <Ralph> Liisa: I had a few conversations with various people
16:29:39 <Ralph> ... it’s a bit confusing how much of the a11y is the content provider and how much is the reading system
16:29:55 <Ralph> ... it sounded like people are happy to have the information and interested in following the work
16:30:06 <Ralph> ... and would be happy to provide more examples if that would be helpful
16:30:14 <Ralph> ... people might not jump in but could be pulled alont
16:30:18 <Ralph> s/lont/long
16:30:29 <Ralph> Tzviya: the distinction between content and platform is important
16:30:33 <avneeshsingh> q+
16:30:54 <Ralph> ... they’re including clearer documentation about both content and platform
16:31:02 <tzviya> ack Daihei
16:31:02 <Ralph> ... this will be huge
16:31:22 <Ralph> Daihei: in Japan there is increasing attention to adopting a11y in a proper way in publishing
16:31:22 <tzviya> q+ to mention cristina's work on EUAA
16:31:49 <Ralph> ... at the end of January, one of the oldest print publishers established an Accessible Book Committee
16:32:09 <Ralph> ,,, they are looking at adapting the standards in the Japanese industry
16:32:31 <Ralph> ... another publisher established a new division responsible for a11y adaptaion
16:32:39 <Ralph> s/taion/tation
16:33:26 <Ralph> ... we also learned that JIS has also established a11y guidelines
16:33:55 <Ralph> ... we need to find out [the relationship between] WCAG 3 and the JIS work
16:34:07 <Ralph> ... and how to include WCAG 3 into the Japanese adaptations
16:34:39 <Ralph> ... on the March 23 meeting we’d like the Asia-time meeting to have the presentation
16:34:51 <Ralph> ... I will act on this to coordinate
16:35:12 <Ralph> Tzviya: Jeanne sent the presentation in Japanese at the end of the session
16:35:18 <Ralph> Daihei: sorry; I missed that
16:35:26 <Ralph> ... thanks for the reminder!
16:35:47 <Ralph> Tzviya: we can work to see if there is someone who can present in Japanese
16:35:55 <Ralph> ... there is a forum for feedback on WCAG 3
16:36:26 <Ralph> ... the feedback is an ongoing project; please make sure this is known
16:37:16 <tzviya> please see https://www.w3.org/WAI/standards-guidelines/wcag/wcag3-intro/
16:37:26 <Ralph> Daihei: we have decided to appoint a specialst, who was formerly chair of accessibility under the ministry in Japan
16:37:33 <tzviya> ack avneeshsingh
16:37:48 <Ralph> Avneesh: I hear a lot about EPUB being a high priority for WCAG WG
16:38:03 <Ralph> ... we should look at this from a publishing perspective beyond EPUB too
16:38:19 <Ralph> ... WCAG 3 will be several years in the future
16:38:35 <Ralph> ... we want to test that things work well for publishing
16:39:03 <Ralph> ... we can look from the spec point of view but we really need input from the business world to verify that this approach will work for the publishers
16:39:19 <tzviya> +1
16:39:29 <Ralph> ... the business community needs to inform us whether this ground-breaking new framework will help in checking and tracking conformance
16:39:30 <tzviya> ack tzviya
16:39:30 <Zakim> tzviya, you wanted to mention cristina's work on EUAA
16:40:10 <Ralph> Tzviya: Cristina and Luc are working on mapping WCAG to the EU Accessiblity Act
16:40:28 <Ralph> ... they’re working with existing standards to make sure what the EU adopts are existing standards
16:40:51 <Ralph> ... it’s worth mentioning this
16:40:51 <tzviya> ack Ralph
16:41:59 <Ralph> Ralph: Jeanne allowed us to record her presentation
16:42:05 <Ralph> ... so it can be replayed
16:42:31 <Ralph> ... certainly a repeat presentation in Japanese would be ideal but if there’s not a presenter, the video could be used with Jeanne available for Q&A
16:42:34 <Ralph> zakim, next item
16:42:34 <Zakim> agendum 4 -- Next Publishing@W3C webinar? -- taken up [from Ralph]
16:42:46 <liisamk> q+
16:42:50 <Ralph> Tzviya: it’s been a while since our webinar
16:42:53 <tzviya> ack liisamk
16:42:59 <Ralph> ... we might not have time to do it again in July
16:43:01 <Ralph> ... thoughts?
16:43:22 <Ralph> Liisa: I’d like us to produce a webinar for the self-published and the small file world out there
16:43:41 <Ralph> ... I got into a debate with someone who is preparing a small self-published work
16:43:51 <Ralph> ... and don’t really know much about the standards
16:44:01 <Ralph> ... it would be great to pull them into the CG
16:44:12 <Ralph> ... and find what cool and interesting stuff they may be doing
16:44:15 <wendyreid> q+
16:44:30 <Ralph> ... or at least make it valid EPUB so we can handle it easier
16:44:51 <tzviya> ack wendyreid
16:44:58 <mateus> q+
16:45:06 <Ralph> Tzviya: I agree it it an interesting community but I wonder if that’s where we most need to infuse right now
16:45:11 <Ralph> ... we did promise regular updates
16:45:25 <Ralph> Wendy: it might be more effective to liaise with the platforms they are using
16:45:46 <Ralph> ... my team has been doing amazing work to work with the authors to help them level-up
16:46:04 <Ralph> ... we could talk with the independent writers’ associations that are helping the authors
16:46:18 <Ralph> ,,, that might be more effective than going to individual authors
16:46:32 <Ralph> ... the Community Group is still quite technical
16:46:51 <Ralph> ... I wouldn’t want to invite throw people into the deep end
16:46:57 <tzviya> ack ma
16:47:02 <Ralph> Mateus: Wendy read my mind!
16:47:26 <Ralph> ... it’s a good idea to keep our community up to date, so a webinar -- or a few -- is good
16:47:50 <Ralph> ... we do expect that anyone who joins the CG to propose an idea that would require a new Task Force that they would lead that TF
16:48:20 <Ralph> ... so if we do get folk who are interested in issues of self-publishers or self-publishing platforms, there’s that expection but we should be nice to them
16:48:29 <Ralph> ... count on us to help with a joint webinar
16:48:47 <Ralph> Tzviya: sounds like we have consensus that a webinar to keep the community informed is a good idea
16:48:56 <wendyreid> +1 to summer
16:49:01 <Ralph> ... given our workload, I’m hesitant to put this on our calendar before June or July
16:49:05 <mateus> +1
16:49:07 <avneeshsingh> July may be holidays
16:49:21 <Ralph> ... we can start to draft an agenda
16:49:38 <liisamk> q+
16:49:39 <Ralph> ... it will be an update, less heavy on the survey, but an update on what we’ve done with the survey
16:49:51 <tzviya> ack liisamk
16:49:53 <Ralph> zakim, next item
16:49:53 <Zakim> agendum 5 -- Around the Table -- taken up [from Ralph]
16:50:19 <Ralph> Liisa: as people are working on a11y and come up with questions about best practices, do we have a good space for that conversation?
16:50:42 <Ralph> ... I have someone in my team who would like someone to talk with about potential directions they are considering
16:50:52 <Ralph> ... where in our scheme do we talk about best practices?
16:51:15 <Ralph> Avneesh: what stops them from sending email to the Publishing CG ?
16:51:28 <Ralph> ... opening a new a11y issue in the Publishing CG where people can comment
16:51:38 <Ralph> Liisa: it might work; we can try it
16:51:44 <ivan> q+
16:51:52 <Ralph> Avneesh: the EPUB 3 repo has active a11y questions
16:51:59 <tzviya> ack Ralph
16:52:03 <Ralph> ... let’s try to get some momentum without new infrastructure
16:52:08 <tzviya> q+ to mention https://www.w3.org/WAI/about/groups/waiig/
16:52:11 <mateus> +1 Avneesh
16:52:35 <Ralph> Ralph: are these questions about best practices specifically for EPUB?
16:52:37 <Ralph> Liisa: yes
16:53:17 <Ralph> ... “we have this situation and think that maybe coding it this way is best but it’s not working here and here; is there a better way?”
16:53:21 <tzviya> ack ivan
16:53:26 <tzviya> ack tzviya
16:53:26 <Zakim> tzviya, you wanted to mention https://www.w3.org/WAI/about/groups/waiig/
16:53:33 <tzviya> https://www.w3.org/WAI/about/groups/waiig/
16:53:36 <Ralph> Tzviya: there’s the WAI IG email list
16:54:09 <Ralph> ... that Interest Group list is like that; sending questions about a11y and experts answer them
16:54:19 <Ralph> ... it would be great if we started asking questions about EPUB there
16:54:31 <Ralph> ... look at the archive; the questions there are so specific
16:54:42 <Ralph> ... let’s start asking about EPUB there
16:54:49 <Ralph> Avneesh: that would help in many ways
16:55:33 <Ralph> Ivan: in the EPUB WG meeting earlier today George raised an interesting idea
16:55:51 <Ralph> ... one of the big problems we have in the WG right now is not having enough participation and feedback
16:56:03 <Ralph> ... there’s a small number of individuals doing the work
16:56:55 <Ralph> ... George said that the survey we did a year ago influenced the charter; he suggested we could go back to those who responded to the survey and note their specific issues and ask them to engage
16:57:04 <liisamk> q+
16:57:11 <tzviya> ack liisamk
16:57:19 <Ralph> ... do we have permission to use the survey respondents’ contact?
16:57:22 <avneeshsingh> q+
16:57:28 <Ralph> Liisa: we set it up to allow people to opt-in
16:57:47 <Ralph> ... they can opt-in to stay informed and (separately) to be involved
16:58:02 <Ralph> ... it’s a subset of the whole but we should be able to use those lists
16:58:10 <Ralph> Ivan: it’s at the level of “be informed”
16:58:20 <Ralph> ... we can work on the phrasing of the message
16:58:48 <Ralph> ... part of the message is that the Working Group has been set up and working for several months, we have these specific questions, and we welcome feedback”
16:59:01 <Ralph> ... it’s great to know this is a possibility
16:59:04 <tzviya> ack avneeshsingh
16:59:33 <Ralph> Avneesh: the expecations of the people who responded were quite high
16:59:54 <Ralph> ... I am concerned about how to manage their expectations
16:59:59 <liisamk> +1 to Avneesh- we need to talk about the big and the small
17:00:10 <Ralph> ... we’re not going to resolve all their issues
17:00:33 <Ralph> [adjourned]
17:03:08 <Ralph> zakim, end meeint
17:03:08 <Zakim> I don't understand 'end meeint', Ralph
17:03:12 <Ralph> zakim, end meeing
17:03:12 <Zakim> I don't understand 'end meeing', Ralph
17:03:16 <Ralph> zakim, end meeting
17:03:16 <Zakim> As of this point the attendees have been Daihei, dauwhe, tzviya, liisamk, avneeshsingh, ivan, Ralph, mateus, wendyreid
17:03:18 <Zakim> RRSAgent, please draft minutes v2
17:03:18 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2021/03/12-pbgsc-minutes.html Zakim
17:03:21 <Zakim> I am happy to have been of service, Ralph; please remember to excuse RRSAgent.  Goodbye
17:03:25 <Zakim> Zakim has left #pbgsc
17:19:11 <Ralph> chair: Tzviya
17:19:44 <Ralph> s/,,, they are/... they are
17:20:03 <Ralph> s/,,, that might/... that might
17:20:20 <Ralph> RRSAgent, please draft minutes
17:20:20 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2021/03/12-pbgsc-minutes.html Ralph
17:22:22 <Ralph> rrsagent, bye
17:22:22 <RRSAgent> I see no action items