19:52:06 <RRSAgent> RRSAgent has joined #aria-at
19:52:06 <RRSAgent> logging to https://www.w3.org/2021/03/04-aria-at-irc
19:52:21 <Matt_King> rrsagent, make log public
19:52:37 <Matt_King> MEETING: ARIA and Assistive Technologies Community Group
19:52:52 <Matt_King> CHAIR: James Schoels
19:52:59 <Matt_King> present+
19:53:05 <Matt_King> rrsagent, make minutes
19:53:05 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2021/03/04-aria-at-minutes.html Matt_King
19:54:57 <Matt_King> zakim, clear agenda
19:54:57 <Zakim> agenda cleared
19:58:17 <michael_fairchild> michael_fairchild has joined #aria-at
20:00:45 <michael_fairchild> https://bocoup.com/blog/how-to-scribe-at-tpac
20:01:30 <jscholes> jscholes has joined #aria-at
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20:04:59 <jscholes> present+ IsaDC
20:07:37 <Matt_King> TOPIC: Issue 369 - Setup scripts
20:07:51 <Matt_King> github topic: https://github.com/w3c/aria-at/issues/369
20:10:22 <Matt_King> js: Want to talk about both how written and used by testers
20:10:46 <Matt_King> How will it interact with the apg examples, e.g., scroll an option into view
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20:11:07 <Matt_King> ideally, want to reuse individual bits of logic when multiple tests use the same bit of logic
20:12:21 <Matt_King> This could require modifying apg examples to be controlled by script.
20:12:35 <Matt_King> Look at select only combobox as example.
20:13:52 <Matt_King> The apg combox scripts looks for all comboboxes on page, but aria-at setup scripts modifies that to look for one.
20:14:01 <rob-fentress> +present
20:14:13 <michael_fairchild> present+
20:15:27 <rob-fentress> present+
20:16:35 <Matt_King> The issues is that the APG JS encapsulates the combobox object, so we can access it from a setup script; it is not global.
20:17:13 <Matt_King> Then we can not access that object to select a specific item in the combobox dropdown. the JS from APG has amethod for doing that, but we can't access it.
20:18:58 <Matt_King> We want to re-used the methods that has ben developed by APG.
20:19:27 <Matt_King> Sina: what is ideal aopproach?
20:19:46 <Matt_King> js: Every APG example stores its entry point
20:19:53 <Matt_King> or entry points
20:20:15 <Matt_King> so a calling script can access that functionality.
20:23:54 <Matt_King> Sina: Can we define a global entry point, like an interface, for the examples that that are instantiated as a class
20:24:58 <Matt_King> Sina: define a function that you can always call, e.g., driveable,
20:25:27 <Matt_King> js: If there was a property on the window object, e.g., APG, and that is the controller for the example code
20:28:19 <Matt_King> MK: James, can you create an issue in APG that defines what you need.
20:34:00 <Matt_King> mk: This will address avoiding aria-at modification to apg js, but not to html. we should take up automation of apg html as part of apg redesign project.
20:34:45 <Matt_King> js: Now, let's discuss how to chain scripts together and how testers run setup scripts
20:35:24 <Matt_King> js: on chaining, it's on me to write up that for bocoup and determine how they want to solve
20:36:03 <Matt_King> js: For testers, it would seem that we want a button on the page for them to execute the script instead of running it on page load.
20:36:21 <Matt_King> this brings up the possible need for a tare down after the test
20:36:50 <Matt_King> Say for example, say the test is testing checkbox and the box is not checked
20:36:55 <Matt_King> the tester checks it
20:37:03 <Matt_King> now it is not in the right starting state.
20:37:35 <Matt_King> mf: What if we replace that button with a reset button that reloads the page.
20:37:56 <Matt_King> then after reset reloads, the button becomes run setup
20:40:54 <Matt_King> sina: +1 to that ida
20:41:09 <Matt_King> s/ida/idea/
20:43:22 <Matt_King> mf: what happens when the button name changes from run setup to reset? need to avoid scren reader side effects.
20:44:08 <Matt_King> js: when we can control that by how we sequence the events in the setup script. we will only change the name of the button, not make a new one. then we will intentionally set focus where we want in the example.
20:44:27 <Matt_King> js: what about error handling? what if setup script fails?
20:45:08 <Matt_King> mf: could fail in multiple ways. we might not have failures that result in a known state that we can handle.
20:46:39 <Matt_King> mk: I think it should be up to humans to understand if tthe setup script didn't do what is supposed to do
20:49:14 <Matt_King> TOPIC: Issue 300- track status of a test
20:49:32 <Matt_King> js: this is on Bocoup to add a flag to a test
20:50:41 <michael_fairchild> mk: we have to decide whether or not we have the status on the test itself be something distinct from the status of the test results
20:51:37 <michael_fairchild> mk: if you think of our workflow as a single sequence, where we have one deliverable that is the test and results. Alternatively we could say that the test is one deliverable and the results are a different deliverable.
20:52:16 <michael_fairchild> js: should the tests be versioned?
20:52:23 <michael_fairchild> mk: I don't know
20:55:24 <michael_fairchild> js: how would we respond to changes to assistive technologies? For example would there ever be a case where a new version of NVDA invalidates our assertions?
20:56:40 <michael_fairchild> mk: yes, there could, and they would need to raise an issue with us
20:57:14 <michael_fairchild> js: that means we would need to maintain the previous version of that assertions so that we can still publish our previous results.
20:59:51 <Matt_King> js: can we do this incrementally, maybe not implement versioning initially?
20:59:57 <Matt_King> mk: possibly yes
21:00:40 <Matt_King> mk: think it is good idea to know where we would be going in terms of asolution so we get the status on the correct object in the data model
21:00:46 <Matt_King> rrsagent, make minutes
21:00:46 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2021/03/04-aria-at-minutes.html Matt_King
21:34:24 <Matt_King> zakim, bye
21:34:24 <Zakim> leaving.  As of this point the attendees have been Matt_King, zcorpan, boazsender, michael_fairchild, s3ththompson, weston, Sina, jongund, jscholes, hadi, IsaDC, present,
21:34:24 <Zakim> Zakim has left #aria-at
21:34:41 <Matt_King> rrsagent, make minutes
21:34:41 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2021/03/04-aria-at-minutes.html Matt_King