14:51:47 <RRSAgent> RRSAgent has joined #pbgsc
14:51:47 <RRSAgent> logging to https://www.w3.org/2020/08/21-pbgsc-irc
14:51:49 <Zakim> RRSAgent, make logs Public
14:51:50 <Zakim> Meeting: Publishing Steering Committee
14:52:18 <Ralph> Ralph has changed the topic to: https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Member/member-publishing-sc/2020Aug/0001.html
14:52:42 <Ralph> chair: Ralph
14:53:19 <Ralph> regrets: Daihei, Tzviya, Yoshii
14:53:45 <Ralph> agenda; https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-publishing-sc/2020Aug/0008.html
14:53:58 <Ralph> agenda+ EPUB 3 Working Group startup
14:54:03 <Ralph> agenda+ TPAC Planning
14:54:28 <Ralph> agenda+ Daisy Whitepaper
14:54:30 <Ralph> agenda+ AOB
14:57:12 <Ralph> -> https://www.w3.org/2020/07/24-pbgsc-minutes.html previous: 24-July
14:57:29 <Ralph> present+ Avneesh, Ralph
15:00:08 <Ralph> present+ George, WendyReid
15:01:05 <Ralph> present+ BillKasdorf
15:01:19 <George> George has joined #pbgsc
15:01:38 <Bill_Kasdorf> Bill_Kasdorf has joined #pbgsc
15:01:51 <George> present+
15:02:10 <Bill_Kasdorf> present+ Bill_Kasdorf
15:02:22 <Ralph> present+ Ivan
15:03:56 <Avneesh> Avneesh has joined #pbgsc
15:05:09 <Ralph> present+ Garth
15:06:08 <Avneesh> present+
15:07:15 <Ralph> zakim, next item
15:07:15 <Zakim> agendum 1. "EPUB 3 Working Group startup" taken up [from Ralph]
15:07:31 <Ralph> regrets+ Liisa
15:07:47 <Ralph> regrets+ Dave
15:08:33 <Ralph> Wendy: we got a home page and iCalendar files
15:08:43 <Ralph> ... lots of participants are joining!
15:09:03 <Ralph> ... we've figured out most of the logistics around meeting times and work mode
15:09:19 <Ralph> ... we're discussing the finer points of document structure
15:09:30 <Ralph> ... with an immense amount of help from Matt
15:09:42 <Ralph> ... big news: Matt is back as editor!
15:09:53 <Ralph> ... we'll be looking for more editors for different parts of the spec
15:10:09 <Ralph> ... hoping for some new faces; would be nice to get some new hands and eyes on the spec
15:10:29 <Ralph> Ivan: we have quite a number of Japanese participants already
15:10:42 <Ralph> ... hope that many of them will be active participants
15:10:55 <Ralph> ... every other meeting will be on an East Asia-friendly time
15:11:27 <Ralph> ... so unfortunately only the North Americans will find it convenient to attend every meeting
15:11:39 <Ralph> Ivan: do we want to use the IDPF EPUB logo?
15:11:46 <Ralph> ... is it a branding thing we want to use?
15:12:02 <Ralph> ... do we know where the original source is?
15:12:15 <Ralph> ... BillM had commented that the text should be removed from the logo
15:12:31 <Bill_Kasdorf> s/BillM/BillK
15:13:01 <Ralph> Garth: we can use the logo if we want
15:13:16 <Ralph> ... I'm vaguely in favor of using it
15:14:03 <Ralph> BillK: if we can use it, I'd love to remove the mixed-case text under the logo
15:14:14 <Ralph> ... that's an easy edit to the file
15:14:45 <Ralph> Ivan: I'd like to have the source in SVG
15:14:58 <Ralph> BillK: I'm sure it exists in various forms
15:15:15 <wendyreid> https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Epub_logo_color.svg
15:17:45 <Ralph> Ivan: EPUBCheck says that SVG is not valid
15:18:03 <Ralph> ... because of an EPUB-specific restriction
15:18:29 <Ralph> ... DTDs containing entities
15:19:35 <Ralph> zakim, next item
15:19:35 <Zakim> agendum 2. "TPAC Planning" taken up [from Ralph]
15:20:10 <Ralph> Ivan: EPUB 3 WG is on the list; we're searching for the right date
15:21:22 <Ralph> Ralph: do we have a sense for the CG and BG to meet?
15:21:47 <ivan> regrets+ mateus
15:23:19 <Ralph> Avneesh: I've heard interest from Liisa and Daihei for the BG to meet
15:23:38 <Ralph> BillK: makes sense from a prospective member / guest perspective
15:23:58 <Ralph> ... something that appropriately shows the difference between a WG, BG, and CG
15:24:18 <Ralph> ... a joint meeting for those three groups to dialog where they overlap and do not overlap
15:24:42 <Ralph> ... we benefit from the distributed situation; you only need to join a Zoom call
15:25:14 <Ralph> Ralph: good points
15:25:27 <Ralph> ... especially useful for the CG and WG to have a joint discussion about {,non}overlaps
15:25:45 <Ralph> Wendy: we're thinking about how long people will agree to sit on a Zoom call
15:25:51 <Ralph> ... and we have the timezone issue as well
15:26:17 <Ralph> Ivan: my experience in virtual F2F meetings worked out well:
15:26:20 <Ralph> ... we had two dates
15:26:36 <Ralph> ... on one day we had two 90-minute sessions with a 30-minute break between
15:26:42 <dauwhe_> present+
15:27:15 <Ralph> ... and alternated the time on the second day
15:27:48 <Ralph> ... that sort-of worked
15:28:07 <Ralph> ... whether we need two days for the WG or more, we don't yet know
15:28:30 <Ralph> BillK: coordinating between groups sounds like a SC meeting
15:29:19 <ivan> present+ dauwhe
15:29:42 <Ralph> Wendy: the SC meetings aren't meant to be public meetings
15:30:06 <Ralph> regrets- Dave
15:30:37 <Ralph> zakim, next item
15:30:37 <Zakim> agendum 3. "Daisy Whitepaper" taken up [from Ralph]
15:30:51 <Ralph> [Wendy departs]
15:31:24 <Ralph> -> https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-publishing-sc/2020Aug/0009.html "White paper for your review prior to press release announcement" [George]
15:31:45 <Ralph> George: Daisy has been asked by many groups to clarify the difference between PDF and EPUB
15:32:28 <Ralph> ... Dan Goldstein, retired attorney, very well-known A11Y lawyer
15:32:44 <Ralph> s/lawyer/lawyer contributed
15:33:01 <Ralph> ... we want to publish around September 11
15:33:07 <Ralph> ... with a supporting webinar
15:33:20 <Ralph> ... we were thinking that a blog from W3C would be appropriate
15:34:39 <Ralph> Ralph: sure; it feels appropriate to have a W3C blog post
15:34:47 <Ralph> George: I'm volunteering to write it
15:35:06 <Ralph> Ivan: I scanned it and love it
15:35:39 <Ralph> ... it's extremely polite but between the lines says PDF isn't good for accessibility
15:37:31 <Ralph> Avneesh: I would have liked to include a few other formats in the comparison too
15:38:15 <Ralph> George: I'll draft a short blog and share it here for comment
15:38:43 <Ralph> ... maybe mention the new EPUB 3 WG
15:38:48 <Ralph> <ralph> +1
15:38:59 <Ralph> Ivan: and EPUB A11y being a part as well
15:39:25 <Ralph> BillK: it makes sense to focus on PDF and EPUB; in the world I work in, those are the two formats people say need to be accessible
15:39:43 <Ralph> ... people tell me "508 requires PDF" -- I tell them "no, it doesn't"
15:40:02 <Ralph> ... that's the world we live in right now
15:41:58 <Ralph> Avneesh: Daisy's strategy is to institutionalize accessible publications
15:42:07 <Ralph> ... we're not interested in getting into format wars
15:42:30 <Ralph> George: any format that evolves over time we'll be focused on this principal
15:43:09 <Ralph> Ivan: the whitepaper is produced by Daisy
15:43:27 <Ralph> ... it might give more weight to the W3C blog if it's signed by someone not in Daisy
15:44:14 <Ralph> George: I'm happy to help in the writing, it would be wonderful if someone from this group wants to sign it
15:46:43 <Ralph> ... it will be very short
15:47:12 <Ralph> George: on document formats ...
15:47:34 <Ralph> ... I have all my papers since 1990 prior to EPUB in HTML
15:47:44 <Ralph> ... I have them as a single publication
15:48:08 <Ralph> ... I've shared it with people and they're unaccustomed to seeing documents in HTML; it's very foreign to them
15:48:23 <Ralph> BillK: with a CSS file?
15:48:36 <Ralph> George: Markus created the CSS for me
15:48:40 <Ralph> ... in-line
15:49:21 <Ralph> Avneesh: I still unzip EPUB and read the HTML in a browser
15:52:32 <dauwhe_> https://the-digital-reader.com/2018/05/01/dropbox-quietly-launches-an-epub-viewer/
15:52:57 <Ralph> Ralph: thanks George
15:53:06 <Ralph> ... also, kudos to BillK's recent article
15:53:21 <Ralph> BillK: thanks, unfortunately it's behind Springer's paywall
15:54:09 <Ralph> zakim, next item
15:54:09 <Zakim> agendum 4. "AOB" taken up [from Ralph]
15:55:14 <Bill_Kasdorf>  "We're at an Inflection Point for Publishing and the Web": https://rdcu.be/b36KJ.
15:55:42 <Ralph> [adjourned]
15:55:53 <Ralph> zakim, end meeting
15:55:53 <Zakim> As of this point the attendees have been Avneesh, Ralph, George, WendyReid, BillKasdorf, Bill_Kasdorf, Ivan, Garth, dauwhe_
15:55:55 <Zakim> RRSAgent, please draft minutes v2
15:55:55 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2020/08/21-pbgsc-minutes.html Zakim
15:55:58 <Zakim> I am happy to have been of service, Ralph; please remember to excuse RRSAgent.  Goodbye
15:56:02 <Zakim> Zakim has left #pbgsc
16:00:51 <Ralph> rrsagent, bye
16:00:51 <RRSAgent> I see no action items