14:39:26 <RRSAgent> RRSAgent has joined #wai-curricula
14:39:26 <RRSAgent> logging to https://www.w3.org/2020/07/28-wai-curricula-irc
14:39:56 <dmontalvo> Meeting: WAI Curricula Task Force Meeting
14:40:04 <dmontalvo> Date: July 28 2020
14:40:16 <dmontalvo> chair: Daniel
14:41:15 <dmontalvo> rrsagent, make logs public
14:43:03 <dmontalvo> Agenda+ FYIs on proposals we have been working on
14:43:24 <dmontalvo> Agenda+ Are images of text functional, complex, or both?
14:44:02 <dmontalvo> Agenda+ Topic on Progressive Enhancement
15:01:32 <shadi> shadi has joined #wai-curricula
15:02:33 <eoncins> eoncins has joined #wai-curricula
15:02:47 <eoncins> present + Estella
15:03:24 <shadi> present+ Estella
15:03:39 <shadi> present+
15:04:18 <shadi> present+ Daniel
15:04:19 <gerhard> gerhard has joined #wai-curricula
15:04:26 <shadi> present+
15:04:33 <Carlos> Carlos has joined #wai-curricula
15:04:52 <shadi> chair: Daniel
15:05:52 <shadi> agenda?
15:05:57 <Carlos> present+
15:06:01 <shadi> zakim, take up next
15:06:01 <Zakim> agendum 1. "FYIs on proposals we have been working on" taken up [from dmontalvo]
15:06:19 <shadi> present+ Gerhard
15:06:38 <shadi> Topic: New layout for competencies to avoid repetition
15:06:45 <dmontalvo> Zakim: https://deploy-preview-238--wai-curricula.netlify.app/curricula/developing-accessible-content/structure-and-semantics/#competencies
15:06:45 <dmontalvo> -
15:07:08 <shadi> DM: gruoped competencies to avoid repetition
15:07:21 <shadi> ...and added explan/collapse to allow skipping
15:07:52 <shadi> ...thoughts on this?
15:08:04 <shadi> GN: looks good
15:08:14 <shadi> ...like this version much more
15:09:26 <shadi> https://wai-curricula.netlify.app/curricula/developing-accessible-content/structure-semantics-and-navigation/
15:10:37 <shadi> EO: like this much more
15:10:52 <shadi> ...but were prerequisits removed?
15:11:00 <shadi> DM: no, just linked to overview page
15:11:31 <dmontalvo> https://deploy-preview-238--wai-curricula.netlify.app/curricula/developing-accessible-content/structure-and-semantics/#competencies
15:11:31 <dmontalvo> -
15:11:44 <shadi> EO: better structured in this new version
15:12:04 <Howard> Howard has joined #wai-curricula
15:12:05 <Howard> present+ Howard
15:12:16 <dmontalvo> https://deploy-preview-238--wai-curricula.netlify.app/curricula/developing-accessible-content/structure-and-semantics/#competencies
15:12:16 <dmontalvo> -
15:13:53 <shadi> Topic: Learning outcomes to sign-post cross references
15:14:33 <dmontalvo> https://deploy-preview-238--wai-curricula.netlify.app/curricula/developing-accessible-content/structure-and-semantics/#topic-page-headings
15:14:37 <shadi> DM: agreed we need to sign-post related requirements for other roles
15:14:57 <shadi> ...new proposal in topic "Section Headings"
15:15:11 <shadi> [[describe complimentary requirements for authoring heading texts and designing visual styles for headings]]
15:15:39 <shadi> ...could have similar learning outcomes throughout as needed
15:15:50 <shadi> ...any thoughts on this approach?
15:17:13 <dmontalvo> [[describe complimentary requirements for authoring text alternatives of textual and complex images]]
15:17:57 <shadi> CD: do you think "complimentary requirements" understood?
15:18:31 <shadi> ...or does it need some description?
15:21:22 <shadi> HK: little confusing
15:21:33 <shadi> ...maybe example but may get too long
15:24:16 <shadi> GN: agree confusing without example or such
15:28:30 <shadi> SAZ: how could we address the issue differently?
15:28:52 <shadi> EO: think one of the issues is the term "describe"
15:29:03 <shadi> ...would use a more specific verb
15:29:13 <shadi> ...maybe "identify" or "list"
15:29:45 <shadi> CD: also wonder about the term "complimentary"
15:29:58 <shadi> ...maybe can be more explicit that these relate to other roles
15:31:00 <shadi> ...like "describe requirements for content authors that write headings and visual designers that style them"
15:31:55 <shadi> GN: maybe "have an idea of how write and design headings"
15:33:51 <shadi> DM: maybe "list"
15:34:00 <shadi> ...inline Bloom's Taxonomy
15:34:38 <shadi> EO: also change from passive to active
15:35:58 <shadi> DM: will take back this input
15:36:22 <shadi> Topic: Broadening scope of Module 2
15:36:46 <dmontalvo> https://deploy-preview-238--wai-curricula.netlify.app/curricula/developing-accessible-content/navigational-menus/
15:37:29 <shadi> DM: now also include application menus
15:37:44 <shadi> ...was planning to have them in the widgets module
15:37:50 <shadi> ...but now have them here
15:38:21 <shadi> ...thoughts on this?
15:39:36 <shadi> https://wai-curricula.netlify.app/curricula/developing-accessible-content/navigational-menus/
15:39:47 <dmontalvo> https://wai-curricula.netlify.app/curricula/developing-accessible-content/navigational-menus/
15:40:07 <shadi> CD: concerned about complexity of this topic
15:40:17 <shadi> ...requires knowledge of WAI-ARIA
15:40:40 <shadi> ...is this something that students know?
15:41:05 <shadi> DM: refer to some ARIA concepts in the prior module
15:41:15 <shadi> ...like headings and landmarks
15:41:26 <shadi> ...maybe need to add to the competencies
15:41:30 <shadi> CD: agree
15:42:24 <shadi> GN: not sure if application menus should be commonly used
15:42:30 <shadi> ...sometimes misused
15:42:39 <shadi> ...should add comment on that
15:43:51 <shadi> DM: could be a learning outcome
15:43:58 <shadi> ...scoping application menus
15:44:10 <shadi> ...to clarify when to use and potential down-sides
15:44:25 <shadi> ...not interchangeable to use both types of menus
15:44:49 <shadi> ...explicitly for desktop-like applications
15:45:15 <shadi> EO: replaced "single-level" and "multi-level"?
15:45:26 <shadi> DM: not exactly, just organized content differently
15:50:11 <shadi> HK: good thing is consistency with Tutorials
15:50:21 <shadi> ...easier cross-referencing
15:51:27 <shadi> SAZ: was definitely not by intention
15:51:45 <shadi> ...started off from scratch to not get biased
15:52:01 <shadi> ...but went in circles and came back to Tutorials structure
15:52:17 <shadi> ...probably good indication for Tutorials!
15:52:26 <shadi> ...or subconcious bias
15:52:41 <shadi> HK: good thing to have this consistency
15:52:52 <shadi> CD: looks good
15:53:07 <shadi> ...agree with GN about adding caution note
15:53:29 <shadi> DM: need to be much more clear about scope of application menus
15:53:39 <shadi> ...and explaining the difference to other menus
15:54:03 <shadi> HK: maybe specifically add "not common"
15:54:39 <shadi> ...directly in the heading
15:56:10 <shadi> SAZ: in the past such generic labelling had become limiting
15:56:22 <shadi> ...prefer to do in the learning outcomes
15:56:32 <shadi> ...teachers need to decide what they want to teach
15:57:14 <shadi> CD: first learning outcome "identify situations where an application menu is appropriate"
15:57:41 <shadi> ...although not sure if that is a competency for developers
15:57:57 <shadi> DM: "identify" does not mean they are solely responsible for it
15:58:24 <shadi> ...enough to have some degree of awareness
15:59:16 <shadi> Topic: Closing
15:59:35 <shadi> DM: would like to ask you to go through the two remaining agenda items
15:59:55 <shadi> ...where would you place "images of text" in the current organization?
16:00:20 <shadi> ...and other agenda item is on Module 6
16:00:33 <shadi> ...currently first topic is introduction to WAI-ARIA
16:00:43 <shadi> ...but that repeats the Intro curriculum
16:01:08 <shadi> ...suggest introducing concept of progressive enhancement instead
16:02:00 <shadi> DM: not sure about meeting next week, will let you know
16:02:53 <shadi> Topic: Introductions
16:03:11 <shadi> GN: first project on accessible design in 1997
16:03:24 <shadi> ...did some lectures over the years
16:03:34 <shadi> ...look forward to this work on curricula
16:03:45 <shadi> DM: thank you Gerhard!
16:05:14 <dmontalvo> rrsagent, draft minutes v2
16:05:14 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2020/07/28-wai-curricula-minutes.html dmontalvo
16:38:08 <dmontalvo> s/gruoped/grouped
16:38:48 <dmontalvo> s/explan/expand/
16:43:56 <dmontalvo> rrsagent, draft minutes v2
16:43:56 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2020/07/28-wai-curricula-minutes.html dmontalvo