<janina> scribe: janina
jgw: Opens conversation on his summary WoT draft
js: Nicolo has joined, and we're introducing ourselves ...
<Joshue108> NC: gives intros
<Joshue108> JW: Some of our work on XR will be of interest
<Joshue108> JS: Gives intro
<Joshue108> JW: Gives intro
<Joshue108> scribe: Joshue 108
<Joshue108> JW: Josh, was providing a link on WoT
<Joshue108> JW gives recap of mail and comments on WoT use cases
<Joshue108> The role of individual needs and preferences is v important
<Joshue108> We noted the role of UI a11y as well as using multiple devices
<Joshue108> There are commercial considerations and we are more interested in general overlapping themes
<Joshue108> rather than individual application scenarios
<Joshue108> JS: I think you missed a key point..
<Joshue108> JS: A PwD using AT, or A11y support may fill any of the roles they are naming in their use cases
<Joshue108> Not just a silo with no overlap.
<Joshue108> Any job, the AFB will point you to many areas with peer support, supported employment.
<Joshue108> The WoT group needs to get that.
<Joshue108> +1 to Janina
<Joshue108> JW: I will add and repost.
<Joshue108> JW: They have a wider responsibility to meet the job and be inclusive.
<Joshue108> There are also racial and social implications that we don't know how to address.
<Joshue108> JS: Mentions Angela Hookers presentation/YT vid
<Joshue108> JOC: Which thing are we adding it to?
<Joshue108> JOC: Please put into IRC
<Joshue108> Jason to update this mail with Janina's input etc
<Joshue108> JW: I missed the idea that the WoT and others may be conceiving the role here too narrowly.
https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rqtf/2020Jul/0004.html
<Joshue108> JOC: It is important to identity the locus of responsibility here.
<Joshue108> JS: Also do be plain spoken.
<Joshue108> We want to change minds - and they need to be told what is important.
<Joshue108> PwDs do work.
<Joshue108> and we can help build this into your use cases.
<Joshue108> JOC: Nice to see this coming together,
<Joshue108> JW: If there are other comments can we take it up on list?
<Joshue108> JS: Yup
<Joshue108> JW: APA can take it up and then forward it.
<Joshue108> JOC: It can go to the WoT IG chairs - the two Michaels
<Joshue108> JW: Sounds like an interesting group there.
<Joshue108> JW: Anything else?
<Joshue108> JW: This is associated open issues for RTC etc.
<Joshue108> JS: Can we take up the other one first?
<Joshue108> JOC: Am happy to push RTC stuff to next week
<Joshue108> JS: Discusses where we are at with ML.
<Joshue108> Don't think this is as low level as some.
<Joshue108> When ML kicks in, it may not be obvious.
<Joshue108> Its the inbetween ground that is important.
<Joshue108> Devs will not always write the apps/agents/whatever_thing_is that will empower knowledge domain experts to build the tools that support a11y
<Joshue108> That is the part where we come in.
<Joshue108> We don't want it to be let down by simple a11y rookie errors.
<Joshue108> These agents can be powerful and deterministic.
<Joshue108> JW: Currently Python is the env to do this.
<Joshue108> Programming => Script Linear Learning, Algos => Implementation
<Joshue108> JS: So that is the question.
<Joshue108> We may talk about bias etc and Jutta will talk about that.
<Joshue108> If knowing Python is the requirement, you'd better know it.
<Joshue108> It won't stay that way - hence interest in WIRED article.
<Joshue108> JS: Do we know what the range of learning tools output is?
<Joshue108> A journal article with prose?
<Joshue108> JW: You mean what they produce?
<Joshue108> <gives overview>
<Joshue108> JS: I mean responsive personal assistance - Siri, Alexa etc they are outputs of ML.
<Joshue108> <discusses if they could get names right>
<Joshue108> JS: So there are serious bias issues etc
<Joshue108> JS: Jutta will cover that.
<Joshue108> JOC: Ok, all sounds great - but what do we do?
<Joshue108> JS: Ok, I'll ping Dom and cc the round robin
<Joshue108> JW: I'm writing a book chapter on AI and PwDs.
<Joshue108> Doing literature review.
<Joshue108> JS: I want to avoid the WoT loop that took 7 years to ferment
<Joshue108> JOC: SO what will Janina say to Dom?
<Joshue108> JS: I'm going to tease these questions out.
<Joshue108> <gives examples of meta code tooling>
<Joshue108> JS: They don't think of a11y requirements, as they are not main stream,
<Joshue108> how can we support knowledge domain workers with a11y requirements
<Joshue108> If the toolkits make it easier to build models that do useful stuff that should be accessible to PwDs
<Joshue108> Steven Hawking for example
<Joshue108> THen there is the feednback loop that Josh raised - unintended consequences
<Joshue108> We have examples that will get covered by Jutta I think.
<Joshue108> I'm just want us to be focussed
<Joshue108> JOC: Gets philosophical
<Joshue108> JW: Further comments?
<Joshue108> SN: makes sense
<Joshue108> JW: The other issue is a Maps workshop?
<Joshue108> JS: In Sept
<Joshue108> https://www.w3.org/2020/maps/
<Joshue108> <Janina talks about contacts>
<Joshue108> Linked Data for Accessibility Community Group https://www.w3.org/community/lda/
<Joshue108> Linked Building Data CG https://www.w3.org/community/lbd/
<Joshue108> JOC: Gives overview of Maps for the Web Workshop
<Joshue108> NC: I have already developed something related to geolocation data in the environment.
<Joshue108> JS: Are you interested in presenting?
<Joshue108> NC: Sounds good
<nicolocarp_> nicolo.carpignoli@chialab.it
<Joshue108> JW: I'll put these on the agenda for next week
<Joshue108> JW: Same agenda for next week
<Joshue108> JS: Also we have TPAC news
This is scribe.perl Revision of Date Check for newer version at http://dev.w3.org/cvsweb/~checkout~/2002/scribe/ Guessing input format: Irssi_ISO8601_Log_Text_Format (score 1.00) Default Present: jasonjgw, janina, nicolocarp_, SteveNoble, Joshue Present: jasonjgw janina nicolocarp_ SteveNoble Joshue Joshue108 Found Scribe: janina Inferring ScribeNick: janina Found Scribe: Joshue 108 WARNING: 3 scribe lines found (out of 134 total lines.) Are you sure you specified a correct ScribeNick? Scribes: janina, Joshue 108 Found Date: 08 Jul 2020 People with action items: WARNING: Possible internal error: join/leave lines remaining: <scribe> js: Nicolo has joined, and we're introducing ourselves ... WARNING: Possible internal error: join/leave lines remaining: <scribe> js: Nicolo has joined, and we're introducing ourselves ... WARNING: IRC log location not specified! (You can ignore this warning if you do not want the generated minutes to contain a link to the original IRC log.)[End of scribe.perl diagnostic output]