<Jemma> start this meeting

<Jemma> rragent, make log public

<Jemma> https://github.com/w3c/aria-practices/wiki/May-26%2C-2020-Meeting

furture meeting agenda

<scribe> scribe: carmacleod

ARIA default value

jongund: why do we have default values? because we want authors to use them?

<BGaraventa> I agree with default values being added within the code

jongund: from an educational standpoint, if we put the default values in the apg source code, it will teach devs

sarah_higley: if directly relevant to the specific example, could add a comment

Jemma: what is the downside to adding a comment?

jongund: in this case, it's a required attribute, so if it's not set it needs a comment

mck: there aren't any required attributes that have default values any more - they are fallbacks

jongund: I don't think we need a hard and fast rule - if something needs a comment, add one

mck: ok, no changes to the code review guidelines

ARIA-AT update

mck: in lieu of having screen reader specifications, we are trying to establish what expected behaviors are in a non-normative way
... starting tomorrow, we are going to run a pilot test

<Jemma> http://aria-at-staging.w3.org/

mck: there will be a system where we have specific tests and trained authorized testers
... making sure that all of the minimum viable product features are there and function
... if it goes well, we will run tests on half a dozen patterns, with expected behaviors reviewed by AT developers

jamesn: do you want to present this for 5 - 10 minutes to the main ARIA group?

mck: sure!

jamesn: I can put this on this week's agenda

mck: this is exciting, because a lot of technology goes into putting pixels on glass... need to give people who rely on ATs the same level of product maturity

Select-only combobox example

mck: defining the part that is deterministic and objective, and making sure that part works reliably

<Jemma> https://github.com/w3c/aria-practices/pull/1396

sarah: prefer not to have label on listbox
... not on other comboboxes, not on native

mck: in some implementations, you see the input and the popup simultaneously

BGaraventa: if the listbox covers up the input, what is the point of the input?
... my point from a screen reader user point of view is that it doesn't matter where the listbox is positioned visually

sarah: not sure how this affects whether or not the listbox has a label

BGaraventa: I always recommend that the listbox be labelled
... then if you are browsing, you know where you are

sarah: in that case, I prefer that the listbox label be the exact same as the combobox label

carmacleod: if the combo is "Favorite ice cream", the listbox contains 17 flavors that are not all your favorite?

sarah: regular listbox label would just be "Favorite ice cream"

carmacleod: right

mck: also, when you type a character, it opens the popup and scrolls to that item
... should we call out this behavior in a section that lists differences between native select and this combobox?

final check

sarah: need PR 1395 merged so the build doesn't fail on linting

jongund: tabindex values need to be added to the states & properties & tabindex tables

<Jemma> 1) https://github.com/w3c/aria-practices/pull/1017

Combobox date picker

<Jemma> https://github.com/w3c/aria-practices/pull/1017#issuecomment-629183916

mck: is this ready to merge?

<Jemma> separate issue Simon created. https://github.com/w3c/aria-practices/issues/1405

jongund: yes, I think so - I addressed comments as they came up

mck: was there a live region that needed to be removed?

jongund: that was taken out of the script a long time ago. need to just remove it from the html.

<jamesn> huge +1

<Jemma> https://github.com/w3c/aria-practices/pull/1362#issuecomment-629277094

<Jemma> https://github.com/w3c/aria-practices/pull/1362

<Jemma> Update menu button datepicker dialog example

Jemma: the last comment says it is modifying an additional file - what do we need to do before merging

<Jemma> https://github.com/w3c/aria-practices/pull/1362#issuecomment-629277094

mck: let's get combobox date picker merged first and then we can fix up 1362
... I'll move it to a fresh branch, and then people can review without all the history

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Present: mck jongund carmacleod BGaraventa jamesn curtbellew Sarah_Higley Jemma mark
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