IRC log of tt on 2019-09-20

Timestamps are in UTC.

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Meeting: Timed Text Working Group Teleconference

01:23:29 [trackbot]

Date: 20 September 2019

01:23:42 [nigel]

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I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2019/09/20-tt-minutes.html nigel

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01:24:06 [nigel]

Present+ Nigel_Megitt

01:24:09 [nigel]

Chair: Nigel

01:24:27 [nigel]

Agenda: https://www.w3.org/wiki/TimedText/tpac2019#Friday_20th_September

01:24:32 [nigel]

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I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2019/09/20-tt-minutes.html nigel

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01:34:45 [nigel]

Present+ Atsushi_Himori, Gary_Katsevman, Cyril_Concolato, Eric_Carlson, Michael_Li, Keiichi_Suzuki, Akihiko_Koizuka,

01:34:48 [nigel]

scribe: nigel

01:35:03 [nigel]

Topic: TPAC Day 2

01:35:23 [nigel]

Present+ Andreas_Tai

01:35:28 [nigel]

Present+ Glenn_Adams

01:35:57 [nigel]

Present+ Masaya_Ikeo

01:37:26 [nigel]

Nigel: [iterates through agenda]

01:38:35 [nigel]

.. Any other things to cover today?

01:38:43 [nigel]

Andreas: Implementation demo if we can make 5-10 minutes

01:40:56 [nigel]

group: [introductions]

01:41:01 [nigel]

Topic: WebVTT

01:42:44 [nigel]

Gary: Around June I got pretty close to completing an Implementation Report for WebVTT.

01:42:49 [nigel]

.. It's the first real one for it.

01:43:13 [nigel]

.. There are definitely, to my surprise considering how badly historically WebVTT was implemented, there's quite a lot of support.

01:43:18 [nigel]

.. There's a lot of support for the basic features.

01:43:34 [nigel]

.. But there are some issues around the newer features like regions, as well as styling.

01:43:43 [nigel]

.. There were specifically 7 issues opened from this IR

01:43:53 [nigel]

.. because they did not pass the 2 independent implementations test.

01:44:01 [nigel]

.. We should go through them today to discuss how to address them.

01:44:14 [gkatsev]

-> https://www.w3.org/wiki/TimedText/WebVTT_Implementation_Report WebVTT IR

01:44:34 [nigel]

.. There are a lot of failures in some cases

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01:45:38 [nigel]

Nigel: The CR exit criteria are about features, so if some tests fail it doesn't necessarily mean the feature isn't supported.

01:45:43 [nigel]

.. We can tell a story about the features.

01:46:03 [nigel]

Gary: Yes, I know in Firefox there's a specific "Edge cases" test that doesn't pass but we might be able to ignore that

01:46:07 [nigel]

.. for the CR exit criteria.

01:46:55 [nigel]

.. I have this pull request that's been ongoing for a while.

01:47:00 [gkatsev]

-> https://github.com/w3c/webvtt/pull/460 snapshot PR

01:47:19 [nigel]

.. This collates all the things we want to mark as at risk because there are not enough implementations.

01:47:39 [nigel]

.. It covers line alignment, position alignment etc which ultimately may need to be removed from the spec.

01:47:55 [nigel]

Andreas: Aren't those pretty core features of WebVTT?

01:48:08 [nigel]

Gary: They are fairly new features to WebVTT and there are basically no implementations that support them.

01:48:37 [nigel]

.. I think the working mode is to update WebVTT to match what is out there, considering we should fix bugs, to get to V1

01:48:47 [nigel]

.. and then if a feature is important then bring it in for the next version.

01:49:05 [nigel]

.. Then with a Rec we would have more power to request browser vendors to implement the new features, and have

01:49:13 [nigel]

.. more of a conversation rather than everyone ignoring it.

01:49:58 [nigel]

Present+ Song_Xu

01:51:30 [nigel]

Topic: [IR] VttCue region test failing webvtt#463

01:51:38 [gkatsev]

github: https://github.com/w3c/webvtt/issues/463

01:51:46 [nigel]

s/Vtt/VTT

01:51:55 [nigel]

Gary: This test is about the API for VTTCue.

01:52:02 [nigel]

.. The API states that region is a property on the cue.

01:52:18 [nigel]

.. It's failing across the board because Chrome and Edge don't support the region API at all.

01:52:35 [nigel]

.. Firefox is failing because it's very strict and an older version of the spec said to throw if there's an incorrect value

01:52:42 [nigel]

.. but the current version says ignore invalid values.

01:53:01 [nigel]

.. The Safari one is interesting - it still implements the old version with a regionId property referencing a global

01:53:03 [nigel]

.. list of VTT Regions.

01:53:15 [nigel]

.. It does work but not spec-compliant to the current version of the spec.

01:53:18 [nigel]

.. There is an open issue for it.

01:53:32 [gkatsev]

-> https://bugs.webkit.org/show_bug.cgi?id=168716 safari bug for vttregion

01:54:09 [nigel]

.. Is that likely to get fixed soon?

01:54:27 [nigel]

Eric: Yes inasmuch as I am able to control things, yes.

01:54:51 [nigel]

Gary: We won't be able to exit CR unless we write a shim.

01:54:58 [nigel]

Eric: I will take that feedback back.

01:55:04 [nigel]

Present+ David_Singer

01:55:20 [nigel]

Gary: I spoke about a different issue about the parser in Firefox and they seem to be on board,

01:55:27 [nigel]

.. so we can reach out to them and they'll be okay to update this.

01:55:30 [nigel]

Eric: Chrome?

01:56:07 [nigel]

Gary: I asked Mounir earlier in the week and he was unable to promise a timeframe but did seem willing.