IRC log of act-r on 2019-09-12

Timestamps are in UTC.

14:01:36 [RRSAgent]
RRSAgent has joined #act-r
14:01:36 [RRSAgent]
logging to https://www.w3.org/2019/09/12-act-r-irc
14:01:46 [Wilco]
agenda?
14:02:01 [Jey]
Jey has joined #act-r
14:02:26 [Wilco]
agenda+ AGENDA ITEM, Final call https://github.com/act-rules/act-rules.github.io/pulls?q=is%3Aopen+is%3Apr+label%3A%22Final+call%22
14:02:32 [Wilco]
agenda+ AGENDA ITEM, Reviewers wanted https://github.com/act-rules/act-rules.github.io/pulls?utf8=%E2%9C%93&q=is%3Aopen+is%3Apr+review%3Arequired+
14:02:36 [Wilco]
agenda+ Citing HTML spec: v5.2 or WHATWG? #879
14:02:44 [Wilco]
agenda+ Difference in implementation outcomes by partners #850
14:02:45 [Wilco]
agenda+ Reduce the Final Call period to 1 week #844
14:02:47 [Wilco]
agenda+ Combobox owned elements shouldn't require an accessible name (f0c5c5, e086e5) #826
14:02:49 [Wilco]
agenda+ When are "Authors" deprecated? #799
14:02:51 [Wilco]
agenda+ Split up the repository of website vs the rules #786
14:02:52 [Wilco]
agenda+ Validity of HTML Lang attribute (bf051a) - incorrect info about xml:lang #668
14:02:54 [Wilco]
agenda+ Consider using accessibility tree as an input aspect #638
14:02:56 [Wilco]
agenda+ Recognition for reviewers #239
14:02:58 [Wilco]
agenda+ Potential failure techniques for consideration as ACT Rules #469
14:04:22 [Jean-Yves]
Jean-Yves has joined #act-r
14:09:51 [Wilco]
present+
14:09:57 [Jean-Yves]
present+
14:09:58 [Dagfinn]
present+
14:10:27 [Wilco]
zakim, take up next
14:10:27 [Zakim]
agendum 1. "AGENDA ITEM, Final call https://github.com/act-rules/act-rules.github.io/pulls?q=is%3Aopen+is%3Apr+label%3A%22Final+call%22" taken up [from Wilco]
14:10:56 [Bryn]
https://github.com/act-rules/act-rules.github.io/pull/848
14:12:11 [dmontalvo]
present+ Daniel
14:12:17 [joecron]
joecron has joined #act-r
14:12:36 [Bryn]
Wilco to take a look at No-auto play at Bry's request
14:13:48 [Bryn]
zakim, take up next
14:13:48 [Zakim]
agendum 2. "AGENDA ITEM, Reviewers wanted https://github.com/act-rules/act-rules.github.io/pulls?utf8=%E2%9C%93&q=is%3Aopen+is%3Apr+review%3Arequired+" taken up [from Wilco]
14:14:54 [Bryn]
Is it really necessary to make all test asset paths relative?
14:15:45 [Bryn]
This will invalidate a lot of data that we already have e.g. trusted tester stuff
14:16:12 [Bryn]
Wilco votes not to do this... Jean Yves doesn't know... Wilco needs to take it up with Kasper
14:17:32 [Wilco]
https://github.com/act-rules/act-rules.github.io/pull/822
14:17:58 [Jey]
Suggestion is to have a test for the test-assets wrongly referenced, rather than change any url to relative in PR - https://github.com/act-rules/act-rules.github.io/pull/887
14:18:28 [Bryn]
Dagfin to review https://github.com/act-rules/act-rules.github.io/pull/822
14:18:53 [Bryn]
Reviewers wanted for https://github.com/act-rules/act-rules.github.io/pull/447 which also needs discussion with Wilco and Jeav-Yves
14:19:06 [Wilco]
https://github.com/act-rules/act-rules.github.io/pull/245
14:20:46 [Bryn]
https://github.com/act-rules/act-rules.github.io/pull/419 Wilco to review
14:21:02 [Bryn]
zakim, take up next
14:21:02 [Zakim]
agendum 3. "Citing HTML spec: v5.2 or WHATWG? #879" taken up [from Wilco]
14:21:14 [Wilco]
https://github.com/act-rules/act-rules.github.io/issues/879
14:21:54 [Bryn]
Disagreement on which version of the spec we should cite
14:22:17 [Bryn]
Kasper and Wilco should talk says Jean-Yves
14:23:01 [Bryn]
Some spec will get slowly deprecated which is not ideal
14:24:12 [Bryn]
Wilco's understanding is that w3c will continue to publish versions of the HTML spec
14:24:34 [Bryn]
Not sure how frequently versions will change
14:25:46 [Bryn]
Wilco is strongly in favour of w3c spec is that its required by the ACT rules format
14:26:19 [Bryn]
If we link to docs or specs that change we need to track those changes in the rules
14:26:59 [Bryn]
That is why linking to the newest version is a more manageable solution... wilco to follow up with kasper
14:27:43 [Bryn]
Shadi says snapshots will link to the working group versions
14:27:55 [Bryn]
Not availible yet but this is the future plan
14:27:58 [Bryn]
zakim, take up next
14:27:58 [Zakim]
agendum 4. "Difference in implementation outcomes by partners #850" taken up [from Wilco]
14:28:06 [Wilco]
https://github.com/act-rules/act-rules.github.io/issues/850
14:28:11 [Carlos]
Carlos has joined #act-r
14:30:38 [Wilco]
https://act-rules.github.io/testcases/9eb3f6/f1b3be194f69c6f222f53cfd46cad299d94c8445.html
14:30:49 [Bryn]
Should we be ignoring the entire test result for a check if an implimenter doesn't provide a definitive answer to one of the test cases
14:32:44 [Bryn]
If not all test cases have a result then the implimentation is not complete
14:32:55 [Jey]
https://act-rules.github.io/pages/implementations/mapping/
14:33:41 [Bryn]
Curently we allow untested on inapplicable... but this is not good practice. Untested should be allowed on all types
14:33:58 [Bryn]
... all types be passed and failed
14:35:21 [Bryn]
RGAA is stricter and checks beyound WCAG and that should be factored in for implementations that challenge ACT
14:37:09 [Bryn]
Jey to talk to Audrey about this
14:37:12 [Bryn]
zakim, take up next
14:37:12 [Zakim]
agendum 5. "Reduce the Final Call period to 1 week #844" taken up [from Wilco]
14:37:26 [Wilco]
https://github.com/act-rules/act-rules.github.io/issues/844
14:38:00 [Bryn]
Kasper and Jean-Yves disagree with shortening the FC to 1 week
14:38:25 [Bryn]
Rules take a long time to write so why cut the 2 week review to 1
14:38:45 [Bryn]
Wilco would like to propose that we reduce FC for updates
14:39:01 [Bryn]
Jean-Yves agrees depending on the update
14:39:47 [Bryn]
Use commonsense for judging magnitude of change and state review period as part of the update
14:40:08 [Bryn]
Could update PR template to include FC period
14:40:12 [Bryn]
Wilco to take this
14:40:20 [Bryn]
zakim, take up next
14:40:20 [Zakim]
agendum 6. "Combobox owned elements shouldn't require an accessible name (f0c5c5, e086e5) #826" taken up [from Wilco]
14:41:00 [Bryn]
Hang on, jumped ahead to quickly there
14:41:08 [Bryn]
any objections to the previous proposal
14:41:23 [Bryn]
Jey suggests using labels for 1 week or 2 weeks
14:41:32 [Wilco]
https://github.com/act-rules/act-rules.github.io/issues/826
14:43:21 [Bryn]
Not clear as to if a combo box should or should not have an accessible name
14:43:50 [Bryn]
Do we want to put an exception for combo boxes into our rules
14:44:00 [Bryn]
Wilco can provide test data if needed
14:46:50 [Bryn]
if we can show that a combo box not having an accessible name is not a WCAG failure then can we exclude combo box from failing
14:47:28 [Bryn]
Wilco to provide test data so we can make a decision to move forward one way or the other
14:47:44 [Bryn]
zakim, take up next
14:47:44 [Zakim]
agendum 7. "When are "Authors" deprecated? #799" taken up [from Wilco]
14:47:57 [Wilco]
https://github.com/act-rules/act-rules.github.io/issues/799
14:49:53 [Bryn]
W3c differentiates between authors and contributers
14:50:21 [Bryn]
Wilco likes idea of previous authors field
14:50:36 [Bryn]
but at what point do you say you are not the current author
14:51:18 [Bryn]
Shadi suggests author is the person primarily leading the process
14:52:15 [Jey]
https://github.com/act-rules/act-rules.github.io/blob/develop/_rules/html-has-lang-b5c3f8.md
14:52:17 [Jey]
Here is an example
14:52:43 [Wilco]
https://act-rules.github.io/rules/bf051a
14:52:49 [Jey]
https://github.com/act-rules/act-rules.github.io/blob/develop/_rules/html-xml-lang-match-5b7ae0.md
14:52:55 [Jey]
another one
14:52:56 [Bryn]
Jean Yves took over a rule from Anne which has now changed drastically - should Anne still be listed as the author
14:53:40 [Bryn]
He is fine keeping them but both contributors consent would be required
14:53:56 [Bryn]
Shadi says this is a clear case of previous and current or new author
14:55:04 [Bryn]
Wilco has a proposal... add fields to front matter for previous author, current author, contributor
14:55:45 [Bryn]
It would be up to reviewers additionally to spot new authors and flag this as part of the review process
14:56:13 [Bryn]
Wilco to Jey: we can add a couple of fields
14:56:49 [Bryn]
Dagfin agrees that old authors that haven't contributed to major changes should not be listed anymore
14:58:17 [Bryn]
Final thoughts...
14:58:40 [Bryn]
lots of agenda items worked through today, looking forward to Copenhagen
14:59:42 [Bryn]
Wilco - changing meeting date for October 10 which is now moving to Oct 17
14:59:53 [shadi]
rrsagent, make logs world
14:59:58 [shadi]
rrsagent, make minutes
14:59:58 [RRSAgent]
I have made the request to generate https://www.w3.org/2019/09/12-act-r-minutes.html shadi
15:00:22 [shadi]
rrsagent, make logs world
15:00:29 [shadi]
rrsagent, bye
15:00:29 [RRSAgent]
I see no action items