W3C

Automotive Working Group Teleconference

15 Jan 2019

Attendees

Present
Ted, Benjamin, Glenn, Magnus, PatrickL, Daniel, Harjot, Don, Laurent, Ryan, Sebastian, PatrickB, Ulf, Hira
Regrets
Peter
Chair
PatrickL
Scribe
ted

Contents


<scribe> scribenick: ted

<Ulf> i have no invitation. can you share it?

JLR backend proposal

Patrick's offboard proposal

<PatrickLue> Patrick's (JLR) proposal: https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Member/member-automotive/2019Jan/0013.html

PatrickB: as I mentioned in Lyon at JLR we want to employ the ViWi submission and utilize it for backend purposes
... backend to client and backend to backend
... I want us to first agree on a framework and then start define the essential building blocks for each OEM backend
... those building blocks from our perspective are identity (for vehicle, user/driver, factories, insurance companies, partners...)
... and as a central piece for connected vehicles remote control/access - ability to send commands such as unlock or start heating/charging, location, status, diagnostics and other barometer readings
... we can start building functionality based on these APIs

PatrickL: as Peter is not on the call I'll share his comments
... he wants one API and not to splinter the group

Peter's reply

scribe: his point was we want a single API for all use cases

PatrickB: if that is a requirement than the proposal doesn't make sense
... I do not see the necessity to have them be the same. offboard API serves different purposes

Ulf: I share Peter's view that we should have one API and feel what we are working on will support both use cases

PatrickL: it needs to be made clearer for rationale for why it should be different

ack

Ted: regarding backend, nearby we have the VSSo ontology work by Daniel and Benjamin which can allow for SPARQL and other queries
... we are also talking to Uber who has some additional ontologies they may want to work with us on for profiles (passenger and driver) and trip data
... I have from a security perspective seen VISS as generally being exposed on the vehicle, can be used to sample data/perform edge computing before sending to a backend but not addressable from cloud
... I also think given connectivity issues push from vehicle is better than trying to pull

Magnus: from my point of view VISS has never only been in the car but a way to communicate outside as well and believe I voiced that before
... we should look at extending it for Patrick's use cases
... as a result I'm inclined to side with Peter

PatrickL: there is sound arguments for a single API as noted
... having an alternate for these different purposes isn't well argumented yet

Daniel: is there currently a blocker for backend using VISS?
... if not it might suit both use cases

Ted: regarding profiles, I understand several OEM are working on them for themselves but would like an understanding of the various architectures since this too is related to backend

PatrickB: we have something that follows OAuth thinking although not OAuth
... we will likely want to stick with that as it works pretty well
... for standardizing we would want to be able to store vehicle and user information within OAuth
... OAuth can do federated IDs and how to authenticate but we would need something specific to vehicles
... idependent of OEM backend

PatrickL: one thing I like about Patrick's proposal is it is a good chance for us to take RSI as a base and that would be a plus for us

PatrickL: what is the procedure for starting a new task force, do we need unanimous?

Magnus: PatrickB was suggesting a separate Working Group not a task force

PatrickB: I was talking about a Working Group but I meant a group focusing on it and don't care about the semantics on type of group
... perhaps a task force is the first thing to do. we have requirement differences for on and offboard
... keeping both solutions combined can impose boundaries on the solution compared to independent
... as an example: in the car we need to find a solution for authentication that can work when the car is on or offline - sporadic connectivity or disabled
... for backend if there is no connectivity there is no backend so need for offline authentication mechanism
... batch download, distribution of services across mixed clouds
... for VISS we are still tied to a root node which doesn't make sense for eg mixed cloud solutions
... we may be limiting ourselves with a common solution

Ted: procedure can vary for forming a new Working Group
... for instance we could have a Member submission as was ViWi or hold a workshop to get position papers and start to form a proposed solution for the WG charter
... another way would be to start this as a task force in the Business Group and then when we start to have something we can clearly communicate propose it as the work for a new Working Group

PatrickL: I propose we revisit this topic on our next call and encourage people to provide input on the current mail thread

Ted encourages people to provide their companies' respective visions for these backend use cases and architectures, they can be vague high level and kept in confidence

Current draft

PatrickL: based on issues list and pull requests it doesn't look like there has been contributions since we last dicussed
... we will keep that until next week
... any additional topics for next week?

Harjot: I wanted a little more clarification on comments about sampling methodology being out of scope of the spec

Ted: I am not saying it shouldn't be standardized, I am just trying to figure out how something that should be communicated to a backend/cloud server belongs in a specification for an in-vehicle service (VISS) to client applications that could be doing the sampling
... based on earlier topic of wanting to standardize backend, there could be a place for it there. others may have different opinions than mine on where it belongs
... some of the other points you raise such as accuracy and frequency may make more sense in VSS not VISS

Harjot's thread

Daniel: I second the suggestion of having some of these details in VSS and it makes sense. we have minimum and maximum but not information about frequency or accuracy
... perhaps raise as an issue on GH

https://github.com/GENIVI/vehicle_signal_specification/

Ted notes it is a different repo

[adjourned]

Summary of Action Items

Summary of Resolutions

[End of minutes]

Minutes manually created (not a transcript), formatted by David Booth's scribe.perl version 1.154 (CVS log)
$Date: 2019/02/05 15:45:40 $