W3C

Timed Text Working Group Teleconference

10 Jan 2019

Agenda

See also: IRC log

Attendees

Present
Nigel, Cyril, Andreas, Gary, Glenn, Pierre
Regrets
Chair
Nigel
Scribe
cyril, nigel

Contents


<cyril> scribe: cyril

nigel: no objection or addition to the agenda?
... agenda is approved as posted

gkatsev: I started looking at the preliminary impl report and I can give an overview

TTML Profile Registry

nigel: there are 2 PR and one issue marked for agenda

<glenn> https://github.com/w3c/tt-profile-registry/pull/55

github: https://github.com/w3c/tt-profile-registry/pull/55

nigel: there is one particular comment that need discussion
... It's about the IANA registration part
... this PR adds text that says the document augments the registration
... but this document defines the MIME type and cannot augment it

glenn: I looked at it a bit more and now agree with you
... we can change without IANA approval afaik

nigel: afaik

glenn: then I will edit it and should be able to resolve that

nigel: is it worth going over any other part of this PR

glenn: no

nigel: then we'll continue the discussion about how we reference other specs offline

summary: editor has a way forward to deal with review comments on IANA registration

https://github.com/w3c/tt-profile-registry/pull/57

github: https://github.com/w3c/tt-profile-registry/pull/57

nigel: this PR creates a JSON in the repository to make it easier to view PR
... it's enabled on all repositories of W3C but it needs this file

glenn: I'll approve that, I don't know what previewing a PR means

nigel: at the top of the PR, preview and diff links get added

glenn: I don't think this is enable in TTML2

nigel: it works for respec and bikeshed specs, not for more complicated specs

SUMMARY: Glenn will approve and merge it

https://github.com/w3c/tt-profile-registry/issues/56

github-bot: https://github.com/w3c/tt-profile-registry/issues/56

<github-bot> cyril, Sorry, I don't understand that command. Try 'help'.

github-bot: https://github.com/w3c/tt-profile-registry/issue/56

<github-bot> cyril, Sorry, I don't understand that command. Try 'help'.

github: https://github.com/w3c/tt-profile-registry/issues/56

atai2: we need to double-check the reference

nigel: maybe the etx2 is wrong

atai2: it points to 3350
... it's not wrong, designator and identifier is correct
... what may need to be adjusted is the link to the specification
... but I need to double check it

nigel: in the current editor's draft, there are version links to the 1-0 and 1-2 but there is no link to 1-1.
... it could be my mistake or something is wrong in the EBU specs

atai2: I think you are right
... there should be EBU-TT 1.1

SUMMARY: Nigel will open a PR to modify ext2 to point to EBU-TT 1.1

TTWG Future Requirements

nigel: we have nothing labelled for agenda in the issues
... for the things I've raised I owe the group a bit more details
... I'll provide more until the next meeting
... no one seems to want to add more now, action everybody to continue reviewing the current issues and ask for details

Joint F2F meeting

<nigel> Meeting wiki page

nigel: according to the wiki, we have 4 people listed as attending
... thank you andreas for the doodle for the dinner
... thank you thierry for updating the wiki page
... any admin questions?

cyril: I won't able to travel
... will there be a way to join in

nigel: no problem in setting up a webex
... Frans already set up of webex for the friday morning
... I will set up one for the thursday meeting
... I've given myself action 16
... also I want to mention that the joint meeting with the EBU timed text on the friday morning will discuss live contributions
... there is a proposal that 2 people will report on their implementation experience: Matt Simpson and me
... we shouldn't spend more than 30 min on these 2 slots
... do people have things to contribute?
... If you have any idea, please get in touch with me
... the other slightly admin point is that we'll do it as a W3C meeting in terms of IPR

glenn: on impl experience, are you limiting it to the live scope?

nigel: it is specifically on live contributions

atai2: speaking as a EBU co-chair, we also want to discuss how the EBU TT group and the W3C TT group can collaborate
... we have most of the members in one room
... we should discuss what should be done in w3c and what should be done in ebu tt
... what should moved to w3c if any
... I want to make it one topic

cyril: I would also be interested in discussing what can be done for the EBU features that are in IMSC and not in TTML2
... the fact that IMSC1.1 is not a strict subset of TTML2
... for example, discussing if copyright of EBU TT features could be transfered to W3C

atai2: it would be good to discuss if the EBU TT group thinks extension will be done in the future in EBU or should be done in W3C

nigel: a slighlty broader point is that TTML is extensible but what happens when an extension needs to be adopted more broadly
... I would like to understand why any change is needed
... it may not be the most elegant thing (several namespaces) but it's not that bad
... we need to motivate a change

cyril: there are 2 parts: one is the fact that we have multiple namespaces but the first point is having one place to find the specification

nigel: we also want to modularize

cyril: it's harder to implement a spec if you have to pull sub-specs from different orgs

nigel: I can go ahead and edit the wiki for the agenda
... anything else?
... no

CSS actions review

nigel: I don't think there is anything to discuss

TTML2

glenn: just a clarification, you mentioned future editorial changes
... I'm distinguishing between new features and substantive changes to existing features
... the issues I've been filing recently come from my internal list made during the finalization of the 1st edition
... I have about a dozen more
... hope to finish that before the meeting if we want to discuss some of them

nigel: they are indeed editing tasks, not necessarily editorial

pal: on that TTML2 topic, we had discussed requiring test cases to be submitted with tickets
... we should stick to that

glenn: I don't recall that
... this is not a bad idea

nigel: that would apply to the substantive changes
... a test case would be very helpful

pal: it helps folks testing their implementation quickly

glenn: also important for when we need to move to PR

nigel: it also helps for the review of the spec

glenn: makes it more concrete

RESOLUTION: we reaffirm that we want to have test vectors for substantive changes

WebVTT

nigel: gkatsev wants to give an update

gkatsev: I've started looking a bit more
... big initiative on wpt.fyi
... has an interop section
... shows you which test passes in 1, 2 or 3 browsers
... for the things that can be tested automatically, I'll use that

<nigel> web-platform-tests dashboard for webvtt

gkatsev: overall 80% of the features are implemented in 2 or more browsers
... there are some features for which I'm not sure
... for those that won't pass, I'll discuss with Silvia
... but 80% seems not as bas as I thought

cyril: what about the new features: regions, styles

gkatsev: safari 12.1 is supposed to support regions
... VLC supports it
... those 2 should qualify as implementation

nigel: can you clarify how you reached the number of 80%

gkatsev: I ignored rendering because they do not run automatically
... the value reported on wpt.fyi is wrong

atai

cyril

atai2: do you have an idea if the WPT fully covers the version of WebVTT

gkatsev: I am not 100% sure but it seems the coverage is very good
... but we need to make sure it is before we can rely on WPT

atai2: I'm not sure when the tests in WPT were made
... we should check if changes to the spec were made after the tests were added to WPT

tmichel

tmichel: I am wondering about the coloring of the cells
... light green vs yellow

gkatsev: I assumed the darker the green the higher the % of passing tests
... I think region is the most recent and has more risk

tmichel: you mentioned VLC as a pretty good candidate for region support
... how do we test that?

gkatsev: we can't test it automatically but we can load a VTT file in VLC and see how it work
... we can't test it automatically but we can load a VTT file in VLC and see how it works

<nigel> scribe: nigel

Summary of Action Items

Summary of Resolutions

  1. we reaffirm that we want to have test vectors for substantive changes
[End of minutes]

Minutes manually created (not a transcript), formatted by David Booth's scribe.perl version 1.154 (CVS log)
$Date: 2019/01/10 17:08:24 $