14:41:04 <RRSAgent> RRSAgent has joined #personalization
14:41:04 <RRSAgent> logging to http://www.w3.org/2017/10/16-personalization-irc
14:41:11 <lisa> rrsagent, make logs public
16:33:39 <lisa> agenda: this
16:33:40 <lisa>  agenda+        updates: TPAC,
16:33:42 <lisa> agenda+ what to downgrade in the speck (survey: https://www.w3.org/2002/09/wbs/101569/2017-10-12_priorities/results)
16:33:43 <lisa> agenda+ Specification as a vocablory - https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-personalization-tf/2017Oct/
16:51:42 <Roy> Roy has joined #personalization
16:59:12 <lisa> present+
17:00:27 <janina> janina has joined #personalization
17:00:41 <janina> zakim, who's here?
17:00:41 <Zakim> Present: lisa
17:00:42 <Zakim> On IRC I see janina, Roy, RRSAgent, Zakim, lisa, MichaelC, jasonjgw
17:00:46 <clapierre> clapierre has joined #personalization
17:00:54 <janina> present+
17:01:00 <clapierre> present+
17:01:07 <jasonjgw> present+
17:01:22 <Roy> present+
17:01:49 <AndyHeath> AndyHeath has joined #personalization
17:01:54 <Thaddeus> Thaddeus has joined #Personalization
17:02:29 <Thaddeus> + present thaddeus
17:04:50 <janina> scribe: janina
17:04:51 <lisa> scribe: janina
17:05:07 <lisa> present+
17:05:26 <lisa> zakim, next item
17:05:26 <Zakim> agendum 1. "updates: TPAC," taken up [from lisa]
17:05:33 <AndyHeath> present_
17:05:40 <AndyHeath> present+
17:06:34 <janina> chair: clapierre
17:08:53 <clapierre> Tuesday 11-noon (css)
17:08:53 <clapierre> web platform 2-3 editing
17:09:28 <janina> cl: Asking informal Wednesday after hours mtg?
17:09:35 <janina> ls: As available
17:09:58 <janina> cl: Benetech expecting to host an event
17:10:11 <janina> cl: Probably Thursday evening
17:12:39 <janina> js: Noting the wcag excursion to meet with Bay Area Accessibility
17:12:51 <janina> cl: May need a different evening, then!
17:13:20 <janina> cl: Also need to coordinate with Joanie for ARIA joint mtg time
17:14:06 <thaddeus> thaddeus has joined #personalization
17:14:37 <janina> Thaddeus intro ...
17:14:52 <clapierre> zakim, agenda?
17:14:52 <Zakim> I see 3 items remaining on the agenda:
17:14:53 <Zakim> 1. updates: TPAC, [from lisa]
17:14:53 <Zakim> 2. what to downgrade in the speck (survey: https://www.w3.org/2002/09/wbs/101569/2017-10-12_priorities/results) [from lisa]
17:14:53 <Zakim> 3. Specification as a vocablory - https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-personalization-tf/2017Oct/ [from lisa]
17:14:59 <thaddeus> +present
17:15:12 <clapierre> q?
17:16:31 <lisa> zakim, next item
17:16:31 <Zakim> agendum 2. "what to downgrade in the speck (survey: https://www.w3.org/2002/09/wbs/101569/2017-10-12_priorities/results)" taken up [from lisa]
17:16:59 <lisa> q+
17:17:48 <janina> cl: Notes first time I created a wbs -- have 30 questions ...
17:18:19 <AndyHeath> q+
17:19:00 <janina> [discussion about extending the survey]
17:19:53 <janina> ls: We agreed on basic "low priority" language last week
17:20:06 <janina> ls: Q on what that might apply to
17:20:19 <janina> ls: Also looking for info on implementations
17:21:06 <janina> ls: Important would mean that we would push for implementations
17:21:40 <janina> ls: Asking the call whether anyone is confused?
17:21:41 <lisa> ack l
17:22:00 <janina> ah: Was daunted by the size
17:22:28 <janina> ah: Do these map to WCAG SC eventually?
17:22:52 <janina> ah: e.g. simplification
17:23:15 <lisa> q+
17:23:22 <janina> ah: Recalling my experience with Drupal trying to establish this
17:23:41 <janina> ls: That's an important question we need to clarify
17:23:49 <clapierre> ack Andy
17:23:54 <janina> ls: I won't say it doesn't matter, but it is independent of this spec
17:24:35 <janina> ls: Most does map, imo
17:24:38 <AndyHeath> q+
17:25:28 <janina> ls: How they map is an AGWG issue
17:25:48 <janina> s/issue/concern/
17:27:23 <janina> ah: Believe there's lots for WCAG
17:27:35 <janina> ah: multiple implementation scenarios in multiple techs
17:28:19 <janina> ls: But we don't need to concern with that here, in this group
17:28:22 <lisa> ack l
17:28:23 <AndyHeath> ack
17:28:38 <AndyHeath> q-
17:29:22 <janina> cl: Are you thinking it would all go AAA in WCAG?
17:29:26 <janina> ls: NO. Some AA
17:29:58 <jasonjgw> q+
17:30:03 <janina> ls: Common controls might be AA
17:30:24 <janina> cl: Is this stated in the doc?
17:30:32 <janina> ls: In the wiki, but doesn't belong in the spec
17:30:36 <clapierre> q?
17:31:04 <clapierre> ack jas
17:31:32 <janina> jw: Whatever we take to TR needs to be carefully and well defined
17:31:54 <janina> jw: e.g. misusing metadata can be harmful
17:32:59 <janina> jw: Believe there's considerable opportunity here for misuse
17:34:01 <janina> jw: In favor of rigorously chosen small set of implementable metadata properties
17:34:02 <lisa> q+
17:34:21 <janina> cl: Note we have 15 proposed items
17:34:36 <janina> cl: Believe we need examples of how this looks in the real world
17:34:56 <janina> cl: Concerned that we're taking on too much
17:35:10 <janina> cl: Saying yes to everything means we won't get it done
17:35:31 <janina> cl: We need to choose what will get done. Remainder can come in later rev
17:36:10 <AndyHeath> q+
17:36:24 <janina> ls: We're not at the stage where we need to toss something that's not clear. That can come later.
17:37:19 <clapierre> ack lisa
17:37:29 <janina> ls: Prefer to see what people will implement first
17:37:43 <MichaelC> q+ to say need to set and keep to a timeline and useful spec - make decisions that support that
17:37:53 <AndyHeath> q-
17:38:07 <clapierre> ack MichaelC
17:38:07 <Zakim> MichaelC, you wanted to say need to set and keep to a timeline and useful spec - make decisions that support that
17:38:20 <janina> mc: I'm OK with keeping things for now, but we also need to set and meet a timeline
17:38:45 <janina> mc: Simple and useful would be an important goal
17:40:02 <lisa> https://github.com/w3c/personalization-semantics/wiki/Task-list-for-semantics
17:40:29 <janina> ls: Reason I want to maintain a table on wiki is for the reason that we could more readily update
17:40:39 <thaddeus> +1 for the table idea
17:41:47 <janina> cl: Believe lists are easier for most
17:41:54 <janina> js: List easier for mwa
17:42:32 <AndyHeath> +1 for list
17:42:50 <thaddeus> anything that is actionable and updateable
17:42:58 <thaddeus> +1 list is fine
17:43:32 <janina> cl: Meanwhile, we still have the survey ...
17:44:21 <janina> cl: Myself, I deprioritized logs only, because of the taxonomic complexity
17:44:42 <janina> ls: Well, I drafted, so it's there because i thought it was important
17:44:49 <janina> q+ To ask Lisa about logs
17:45:27 <janina> ls: Anyone can answer the WBS?
17:45:33 <janina> cl: No, internal only
17:45:50 <janina> ls: In favor of open
17:46:12 <janina> ls: To get implementers to +1
17:47:30 <janina> mc: If we have reason to make a public survey, OK, but not as a general rule
17:49:35 <janina> ls: It's about gathering information
17:49:57 <clapierre> q?
17:50:15 <clapierre> ack janina
17:50:15 <Zakim> janina, you wanted to ask Lisa about logs
17:53:18 <janina> js: Asks about logs
17:53:27 <janina> ls: Bread crumbs, different representations
17:56:17 <AndyHeath> q+
17:56:51 <janina> ls: Have it only if you want it
17:57:38 <janina> ack ja
17:58:09 <janina> cl: Maybe "logs" not the best handle
17:58:17 <clapierre> ack andy
17:58:26 <janina> ah: Bread crumbs is an implementation technique
17:58:49 <janina> ah: We're missing a user model of needs
17:58:56 <lisa> q+
17:59:30 <lisa> https://rawgit.com/w3c/coga/master/gap-analysis/table.html
18:01:31 <lisa> i need a concret example of what is missing andy so I know what you think is missing
18:01:53 <janina> ls: Need concrete example of what's missing
18:02:00 <janina> ah; There's lots. Will do off line
18:02:08 <janina> cl: next call, next Monday!
18:02:17 <janina> cl: Please respond on survey
18:02:49 <janina> zakim, bye
18:02:49 <Zakim> leaving.  As of this point the attendees have been lisa, janina, clapierre, jasonjgw, Roy, AndyHeath, present
18:02:49 <Zakim> Zakim has left #personalization
18:02:58 <janina> rrsagent, make minutes
18:02:58 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2017/10/16-personalization-minutes.html janina
18:03:08 <janina> rrsagent, bye
18:03:08 <RRSAgent> I see no action items