IRC log of apps on 2017-04-18

Timestamps are in UTC.

13:58:42 [RRSAgent]

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logging to http://www.w3.org/2017/04/18-apps-irc

13:59:32 [AdrianHb]

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present+

14:01:20 [Ian]

present+

14:01:27 [Ian]

present+ Conor

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present+ alyver

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14:02:19 [jnormore]

present+

14:02:26 [ConorH]

present+

14:02:43 [Ian]

zakim, who's here?

14:02:43 [Zakim]

Present: rouslan, Ian, Conor, alyver, jnormore, ConorH

14:02:45 [Zakim]

On IRC I see ConorH, alyver, rouslan, AdrianHb, RRSAgent, MattS, jnormore, Zakim, cweiss, adamR, Dongwoo, Ian, JakeA

14:02:54 [Ian]

present- Conor

14:02:55 [Ian]

present+ AdrianHB

14:03:00 [Ian]

present+ Christian

14:03:04 [Ian]

present+ Joseph

14:04:10 [Ian]

topic: Introduction

14:04:18 [Ian]

[Joseph Xu]

14:04:22 [Ian]

..first time on the call.

14:04:32 [ConorH]

Welcome Joseph :)

14:05:03 [Ian]

-> https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-payments-wg/2017Apr/0039.html Agenda

14:05:06 [Ian]

agenda?

14:05:29 [Ian]

zakim, take up item 1

14:05:29 [Zakim]

agendum 1. "Recent changes to Payment Handler API" taken up [from Ian]

14:06:05 [Ian]

https://w3c.github.io/webpayments-payment-handler/

14:06:31 [Ian]

* Updated short name / URL

14:06:31 [Ian]

* Add support for topLevelOrigin and paymentRequestOrigin

14:06:31 [Ian]

* Added 2 diagrams (worked on with MattS). (Can we close 49?)

14:06:31 [Ian]

* Issue markers

14:06:31 [Ian]

* Many markup fixes, tidy (please tidy edits henceforth!)

14:08:22 [Ian]

present+ MattS

14:08:34 [adamR]

present+

14:08:48 [Ken]

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14:09:03 [Ian]

present+ Ken

14:09:30 [Ian]

zakim, close item 1

14:09:30 [Zakim]

agendum 1, Recent changes to Payment Handler API, closed

14:09:31 [Zakim]

I see 4 items remaining on the agenda; the next one is

14:09:31 [Zakim]

2. Adrian's edits [from Ian]

14:09:33 [Ian]

zakim, take up item 2

14:09:33 [Zakim]

agendum 2. "Adrian's edits" taken up [from Ian]

14:10:24 [Ian]

https://github.com/w3c/webpayments-payment-handler/pull/138/commits/013db090f6513387cc401ed586bd67b5c56c1a15

14:11:11 [Ian]

AdrianHb: My edits were primarily editorial

14:11:40 [Ian]

...the main thrust of what I was getting at was making it clear that what the spec defines is this new event handler

14:11:49 [Ian]

...we are defining a way to response to a particular payment event

14:12:02 [Ian]

...there's a new feature in the platform (payment handlers) that handle this new event

14:12:04 [Newcomer]

Newcomer has joined #apps

14:12:20 [Ian]

..then you build on that - how do I instruct a browser to raise the event when payment events that I can handle are being processed?

14:12:32 [Ian]

...that's when you bring in the term PaymentManager

14:12:48 [Ian]

https://github.com/w3c/webpayments-payment-handler/issues/127

14:12:58 [Ian]

https://github.com/w3c/webpayments-payment-handler/issues/127#issuecomment-294713131

14:13:09 [Ian]

Payment App? Handler? Manager?

14:13:39 [Ian]

AdrianHB:

14:13:52 [MattS]

q+

14:14:02 [Ian]

1) Key thing we are defining in the platform is the payment handler. It stand on its own as a feature

14:14:24 [Ian]

..it allows you to process payment requests. It makes no assumptions about where those requests originate; they don't HAVE to come through the payment request API

14:14:59 [Ian]

...the focus is on payment handlers..pieces of code that are invoked when an event is raised.

14:15:17 [Ian]

2) Another piece of the spec is how we manage metadata about the handlers - methods, instruments, wallets

14:15:30 [Ian]

...I see the PaymentManager as layering on the handler but not essential to the handler functionality

14:16:08 [Ian]

...so the PaymentManager is a feature we are adding (to service worker registration) that qualifies the payment handler

14:16:25 [Ian]

...I think PaymentManager but we could call it something like PaymentMethodManager or PaymentInstrumentManager

14:16:29 [MattS]

+1 to PaymentInstrumentManager, much more explicit

14:16:43 [MattS]

or in fact if thats a mouthful, InstrumentManager

14:17:23 [Ian]

3) A payment app is a specialization of a Web App that uses these features

14:17:28 [adamR]

The problem with “InstrumentManager” is that this is going in to the top-level ServiceWorker scope. It needs to make sense in the context of the broader web platform.

14:17:35 [Ian]

q?

14:17:36 [MattS]

ok

14:17:41 [Ian]

ack Matts

14:17:59 [Ian]

MattS: I appreciate AHB's description and Ian's scribing. I think the spec does not reflect that yet

14:18:18 [Ian]

..the first point is that the spec is called PaymentHandler...from what you said, the spec should be called Payment App

14:19:20 [Ian]

IJ: Rationale against Payment App was "too broad"

14:19:36 [Ian]

MattS: Make sense but now too narrow, IMO

14:20:04 [AdrianHb]

+1 to PaymentHandlerRequest

14:20:04 [Ian]

MattS: Maybe we need to change PaymentAppRequest/PaymentAppResponse => PaymentHandlerRequest/PaymentAppResponse

14:20:08 [Ian]

q?

14:20:49 [Ian]

MattS: The reason I wanted the diagram was to clarify the entities etc....the diagrams are missing PaymentManager

14:21:05 [Ian]

adrianHB: PaymentManager exists under service worker...you use it to register to register instruments and wallets

14:21:22 [Ian]

q?

14:21:49 [Ian]

MattS: I suggest we leave 127 open for FPWD...but would be nice to have some consistency for FPWD

14:22:05 [Ian]

...at a minimum, I suggest we represent PaymentManager in the diagram (instead of PaymentHandler)

14:22:09 [Ian]

...I will continue to review

14:22:47 [Ian]

q?

14:22:55 [Ian]

https://github.com/w3c/webpayments-payment-handler/pull/138/commits/013db090f6513387cc401ed586bd67b5c56c1a15

14:23:50 [Ian]

IJ: Why not say "one or more payment handler" (cf my proposal)?

14:24:13 [Ian]

https://github.com/w3c/webpayments-payment-handler/pull/138/files

14:25:07 [Ian]

"Payment apps make use of service workers to register their payment handling capabilities with the user agent. This is done through one or more payment handlers, which listen to PaymentRequestEvents raised through the Payment Request API."

14:26:07 [Ian]

IJ: My point is don't say "one"

14:27:30 [MattS]

why not say payment apps must each use a service worker

14:27:32 [Ian]

Payment apps make use of (one or more) service workers, each of which defines...

14:31:51 [Ian]

agenda?

14:31:57 [Ian]

zakim, close item 2

14:31:57 [Zakim]

agendum 2, Adrian's edits, closed

14:31:58 [Zakim]

I see 3 items remaining on the agenda; the next one is

14:31:58 [Zakim]

3. Seeking additional reviewer [from Ian]

14:32:09 [Ian]

zakim, close item 4

14:32:09 [Zakim]

agendum 4, Issue 127: Do we need "Payment Manager" and "Payment Handler”?, closed

14:32:11 [Zakim]

I see 2 items remaining on the agenda; the next one is

14:32:11 [Zakim]

3. Seeking additional reviewer [from Ian]

14:32:15 [Ian]

zakim, take up item 3

14:32:15 [Zakim]

agendum 3. "Seeking additional reviewer" taken up [from Ian]

14:32:46 [rouslan]

q+

14:32:50 [Ian]

ack rouslan

14:33:05 [Ian]

Rouslan: I read the document. I update the android spec as well.

14:33:13 [Ian]

...I had one small issue, which I will put on github

14:33:29 [Ian]

(IJ has read it)

14:34:39 [Ian]

MattS: I will review the updated doc

14:34:51 [Ian]

...will review changes by Thursday

14:35:38 [Ian]

[Example updates?]

14:36:04 [Ian]

AdamR: I think one of the examples is incorrect. There are also stylistic differences...

14:36:19 [Ian]

....e.g., "wait" instead of "then" could be an improvement...

14:36:29 [Ian]

...I think Marco's improves would probably help a lot

14:36:33 [adamR]

s/wait/await/

14:37:34 [Ian]

Rouslan: I will look at AHB's javascript

14:37:59 [Ian]

q?

14:38:21 [Ian]

zakim, take up item 5

14:38:21 [Zakim]

agendum 5. "Status wrt FPWD" taken up [from Ian]

14:38:33 [Ian]

IJ: I would like to start a CfC around 1 May (for 1 week)

14:39:23 [Ian]

...if all goes well, FPWD week of 8 May

14:40:15 [Ian]

PROPOSED: The task force recommends the Chairs start a CFC for Payment Handler (after last round of edits) around 1 May

14:40:24 [rouslan]

+1

14:40:30 [AdrianHb]

+1

14:40:31 [Ian]

+1

14:40:32 [ConorH]

+1

14:40:52 [adamR]

+1

14:41:01 [Ian]

topic: Implementer update

14:41:25 [Ian]

IJ: What are the opportunities implementers will have to play with this?

14:41:43 [Ian]

Rouslan: Chromium has a near complete implementation of this API.

14:41:51 [Ian]

...we'd like to start experimentation after FPWD

14:42:33 [Ian]

IJ: Any firefox updates?

14:42:48 [Ian]

AdamR: Marcos and Matt have been doing some work...no specific update on progress for today

14:44:04 [Ian]

IJ: Can we institute an implementation focused semi-regular call after FPWD so that user agents and app developers can work together

14:44:05 [Ian]

Conor: +1`

14:44:43 [adamR]

Ian: https://github.com/marcoscaceres/web-payments-proto/

14:44:55 [adamR]

Ian: and https://marcoscaceres.github.io/web-payments-proto/

14:44:57 [Ian]

Topic: Next meeting

14:45:06 [Ian]

2 May

14:45:16 [rouslan]

+1

14:45:37 [Ian]

RRSAgent, make minutes

14:45:37 [RRSAgent]

I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2017/04/18-apps-minutes.html Ian

14:45:40 [Ian]

RRSAgent, set logs public

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