See also: IRC log
<patrick_h_lauke> running a few mins late be right there
<patrick_h_lauke> M1 - https://github.com/w3c/Mobile-A11y-Extension/blob/gh-pages/SCs/m1.md
<patrick_h_lauke> TPAC: https://www.w3.org/2016/09/TPAC/
<patrick_h_lauke> correction on the second link - it should be https://github.com/w3c/Mobile-A11y-Extension/blob/gh-pages/SCs/m3.md
<Kim> Kathy: hour and a half session – overview so people can see the whole
<patrick_h_lauke> https://github.com/w3c/Mobile-A11y-Extension/blob/gh-pages/SCs/m1.md
kim: How do you feel about the text for M1?
Kathy: looks good
Patrick: Very high level, of course things will work with pointer.
<patrick_h_lauke> https://www.w3.org/TR/WCAG20/#keyboard-operation
Patrick: Only interested in actual functionality than how the person is moving the pointer.
Kathy: The SC text "for instance"
should be in the description.
... We prbably want a link to glossary terms.
Kim: Under description it says
"ToDo". (Patrick: that will be removed)
... remove the word "situations"
Marc: Do we need specific
timings, or is that not applicable?
... All functionality can be operated by pointer inputs without
specific timings?
Patrick: I talk about the timing stuff in M3, which is Pointer Gestures. Probably not necessary to add it here as well.
Kathy: Benefits, no assistive
devices that mimic mouse input, and not just keyboard
input.
... Anything not usable with mouse would actually be blocked on
such an AT.
Marc: Also under benefits, helps users of devices without a physical keyboard.
Kim: Right now it's "Ensuring that all functionality can be used by pointer input"
Kim/Patrick: [ Interesting editorial discussion ]
Kim: Testability looks good to me, any comments...
Kathy: I think the stuff you have in brackets should be put in as a note or a technique.
Kim: Is this one set?
Marc: Do we need to find justification/evidence? The benefit is clear, do we need supporting evidence?
Kathy: If we need it, we have it.
Kim: We could say: " According to direct experience of those in the group"
Kathy: There were some devices that were no longer mimicking keyboard events, but mouse pointer events.
<patrick_h_lauke> https://github.com/w3c/Mobile-A11y-Extension/blob/gh-pages/SCs/template.md
<marcjohlic> https://github.com/w3c/wcag21/wiki/Proposals-for-new-Success-Criteria
Patrick: we could write something very generic, like "this is obvious" or "from our experience"
Kim: I think it is useful to have
an example so it's "picturable"
... What would an example be?
Patrick: You can't summon the iOS Keybaord at an arbitrary point, you have to be in an editable text field.
Kim: There's a user that uses an onscreen keyboard, what would cause a user to be stuck?
Patrick: They can't ask for the onscreen keyboard, so if events are relied on to happen in a specific way to focus elements, and the onscreen keyboard isn't requested, they couldn't get the keyboard attached to the screen.
Kim: Could you add a specific
example where if this wasn't done, this wouldn't be
accessible.
... Any other comments on this?
<patrick_h_lauke> Kim: as many people left, maybe we take a high level view
<patrick_h_lauke> and raise it next time
<patrick_h_lauke> Kim: question: if one is pointer and one pointer gestures is this going to be confusing?
<patrick_h_lauke> I guess this is a Q for Jeanne
<patrick_h_lauke> Jeanne: one-word short handles is a problem, but WCAG WG doesn't agree with me
<patrick_h_lauke> that's something the WG will debate
<patrick_h_lauke> Patrick: for context, the previous SC (M1) generically says "must work with a pointer", this one (M3) goes further and says "but also don't require precise/timed gestures"
<patrick_h_lauke> Jeanne: both are at Level A, so that may be a problem, but we'll leave that discussion for the WG
<patrick_h_lauke> Kim: so M3 means "NO pointer gestures"
<patrick_h_lauke> Patrick: agree, changing to "NO pointer gestures" makes this clearer
<patrick_h_lauke> Kim: the notes currently in the SC Text would make good examples for the Description if expanded upon
<patrick_h_lauke> Patrick: removing the TODO bits, which shows me that I actually need to generate some benefits and testability
<patrick_h_lauke> so more content writing required here
<patrick_h_lauke> [high-level discussion, minor tweaks, need to cross-reference this with the "Touch with AT" SC to make sure this is clearly exempted]
<patrick_h_lauke> Patrick: by the way, all SCs already reviewed by the group (as per wiki) are now also in GitHub https://github.com/w3c/Mobile-A11y-Extension/tree/gh-pages/SCs
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