12:58:35 RRSAgent has joined #apps 12:58:35 logging to http://www.w3.org/2016/09/14-apps-irc 12:58:36 Zakim has joined #apps 13:01:20 agenda: https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-payments-wg/2016Sep/0060.html 13:01:22 regrets+ Conor 13:01:24 present+ Ian 13:02:06 Present+ AdrianHB 13:02:38 Agenda+: Feedback from bank app publisher and web auth api 13:03:28 agenda+ TPAC agenda prioritization 13:03:33 agenda+ Adam's spec 13:03:56 present+ adamR 13:04:05 present+ Mahesh 13:04:11 jnormore has joined #apps 13:05:48 agenda? 13:06:28 present+ jnormore 13:06:28 zakim, take up item 3 13:06:28 agendum 3. "Adam's spec" taken up [from Ian] 13:06:49 IJ: What state are you in and what should we expect by TPAC? 13:06:57 adamr: Turned proposal into spec text 13:07:12 ...I think the registration section is ready for review 13:07:18 ...I'm working on the actual spec of the other part 13:07:29 ...early feedback would be useful 13:07:49 ...I've completed the section (I think) on returning info back to the browser 13:08:12 maheshK has joined #apps 13:08:24 ...I've put everything in a "payment response" for now 13:09:21 ..I'm not seeing any diff between payment app response data and payment request API response data EXCEPT for data that is optional (e.g., shipping address) 13:09:47 AdrianHB: I think we should still discuss whether payment apps should be able to provide some data back beyond the strict payment response 13:10:06 AdamR: For now payment app response => payment request API response 13:10:29 q+ provide feedback 13:10:44 adamr: Regarding whether we can have spec text by Monday...I think we can be code complete by end of this week 13:10:48 ian: Adam++ 13:10:54 ack provide 13:10:59 ack feedback 13:11:09 https://adamroach.github.io/webpayments-payment-apps-api/ 13:11:15 q? 13:11:31 AdrianHB: I looked it over; I think it's great. 13:11:47 ..today I had a meeting, got some questions, and it turns out you answered them in the spec. 13:11:56 ...so I sent the person I was speaking with a link to your draft. :) 13:12:03 ...I think we are heading in the right direction 13:12:10 q+ 13:14:39 IJ: We need to align PMIs with the PMI proposal 13:16:10 IJ: We also need to communicate clearly how it all fits together: 13:16:12 - service workers 13:16:14 - manifests 13:16:17 - registration and updates 13:17:11 IJ: The spec used to say that you update data by calling register again. Is that still true? 13:17:24 Adam: Updates are handled per normal service worker updates; I will point to them. 13:17:58 IJ: What are the bounds of the payment app manifest? 13:18:02 q+ to comment on manifest 13:18:05 q- 13:18:22 AdamR: I'm not treating manifest too much here. I cover what I have heard people want. It's not a file; it's a structure. 13:18:53 ...so the structure is in the spec (but data could come from lots of places) 13:19:29 ack Ad 13:19:29 AdrianHB, you wanted to comment on manifest 13:20:06 AdrianHB: There's been some discussion on github...and debate about whether app manifest evolving for payments 13:21:05 ...bottom line; I don't think there's anything we can use from app manifest. 13:21:13 ...I think for icons, etc. we need to spec it out ourselves 13:21:42 ...though App Manifest does some of these things, it's not clear we can reuse it 13:22:24 q+ 13:25:03 AdrianHB: to be clear, do you think your issue calls for any change to the spec text I’ve written so far? 13:25:17 IJ: Should we rely on app manifest spec for icons, etc? 13:25:30 Adrian: I think we should specify it ourselves, which is frustrating as I'd like to reuse app manifest 13:25:33 adamR: No 13:25:44 AdrianHB: Thanks. 13:26:03 https://adamroach.github.io/webpayments-payment-apps-api/#payment-app-manifest 13:26:17 AdamR: The draft spec aligns with Adrian's view 13:26:18 q? 13:26:20 ack me 13:28:21 IJ: I would love to see section 6 expanded a tiny bit as an overview of "how we are using service workers" 13:29:50 AdamR: If I have time. I want to finish 10 first 13:30:26 IJ: even a single sentence in 6 like "we will expand this section with more overview of how service workers will be used to handle updates, etc." 13:31:13 IJ:I have invited Jake to the FTF meeting 13:31:23 I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2016/09/14-apps-minutes.html Ian 13:31:46 IJ: Any other people or groups we should find at TPAC to look at this? 13:32:55 AdamR: TAG? 13:33:52 ACTION: Ian to write to Dan Appelquist and Andrew inviting TAG (whoever wants) to the payment app discussion 13:34:19 zakim, close this item 13:34:19 agendum 3 closed 13:34:20 I see 2 items remaining on the agenda; the next one is 13:34:20 1. Feedback from bank app publisher and web auth api [from AdrianHB] 13:34:31 zakim, take up item 1 13:34:31 agendum 1. "Feedback from bank app publisher and web auth api" taken up [from AdrianHB] 13:34:38 zakim, take up item 2 13:34:38 agendum 2. "TPAC agenda prioritization" taken up [from Ian] 13:34:59 https://github.com/w3c/webpayments-payment-apps-api/issues 13:36:09 IJ: I may wish to close #34 13:36:49 q+ to suggest two major issues 13:37:07 IJ: Is "where the data lives" an issue we need to address? 13:37:13 AdamR: I don't think it is 13:39:14 IJ: I am hearing that "origin" is more important for payment method manifest 13:39:49 AdrianHB: Even if we don't need to talk about a payment app manifest file, we still need identify payment apps 13:40:00 IJ: Identifier needs: 13:40:07 - You want to install an app? Go here! 13:41:20 AdrianHB: Service workers need to be called in the context of a page..the page for getting info about installing an app should not be required to be same as page with service worker 13:42:12 ...payment method data may include data like "URL of where to get service worker" 13:42:36 ...and when it executes it registers 13:42:44 ----- 13:42:54 * You want to install an app? Go here! 13:43:08 * You want to ship some payment request data to an app for processing? Go here! 13:45:53 Ian: To be clear, are you referring to the “https://www.example.com/bobpay/process” URL in the example at file:///Users/Adam/devel/webpayments-payment-apps-api/index.html#post-example ? 13:46:09 Ugh, sorry, that’s my local copy URL. :) 13:46:13 IJ: what does "payment app identifier" mean? 13:46:22 AdrianHB: A string to identify a payment app? 13:46:38 ...and the proposal from Jake is that by being a URL, that establishes a scope for the service worker 13:47:01 AdamR: The scope URL (except under some rare circumstances) will be the same thing passed into "register()" 13:47:43 Ian / AdrianHB: This small section might help untangle the terminology: https://www.w3.org/TR/service-workers/#dfn-activate 13:47:47 AdrianHB: If I want to "get a payment app" there are 100 places I can get that. 13:49:06 https://www.w3.org/TR/service-workers/#dfn-scope-url 13:49:13 AdrianHB: Payment app identifier is a URL (for scope) but is not to be dereferenced. 13:49:31 ..."payment app identifiers" should be used in payment method manifests to identify payment methods 13:51:12 IJ: I believe we need to define: 13:51:16 - payment app identifier 13:51:38 - statement that these identifiers are scope URLs for service worker and we do not expect them to be dereferenced 13:51:48 - these are typically going to be used in payment method manifests 13:52:31 jnormore: One of the main purposes of the identifier is to restrict which payment apps can use that method. How is there a restriction there? 13:52:59 AdrianHB: My understanding is you can't create the service worker at origin A and claim it works on origin B 13:53:46 https://github.com/w3c/webpayments-payment-apps-api/issues/35#issuecomment-246976419 13:54:02 q+ on proprietary payment method vs payment app identifier 13:54:10 ack mah 13:54:10 maheshK, you wanted to comment on proprietary payment method vs payment app identifier 13:54:12 q- 13:54:38 maheshK: I understand why the payment app identifier is useful...I assume there should not be any reason why the same identifier can't be used for both 13:54:43 (I agree) 13:56:00 q+ to talk about ordinatlity of methods versus apps 13:56:16 open q: if a merchant wants to recommend a payment app and they use the payment app identifier the browser may not know where to go to actually install/use the app 13:56:30 ack adam 13:56:30 adamR, you wanted to talk about ordinatlity of methods versus apps 13:57:07 IJ: I want to talk about methods/apps differently. I don't want to prevent people from using the same URI if they have a reason to do so. 13:57:53 TPAC TOPIC: Payment method id and payment app id usage 13:59:06 AdrianHB: Push payments...I also got feedback in my earlier today conversation 13:59:12 +1 13:59:19 ...how to deal with failures (e.g., app dies and site doesn't know if payment completed) 14:00:53 ACTION: Ian to walk through issues list with Adrian to prep for TPAC 14:01:26 agenda? 14:01:29 zakim, take up item 1 14:01:30 agendum 1. "Feedback from bank app publisher and web auth api" taken up [from AdrianHB] 14:01:39 https://www.entersekt.com/ 14:01:42 AdrianHB: I spoke with a company that sells technology to banks. 14:01:47 ..they mostly do authentication 14:02:42 ..they are interested in writing a payment app 14:02:47 ...that does auth using w3c web auth Api 14:02:57 ...so they would be a great org to do a proof of concept 14:03:08 q? 14:03:17 rrsagent, make minutes 14:03:17 I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2016/09/14-apps-minutes.html Ian 14:03:20 rrsagent, set logs public 14:03:46 Ian: If you could send me your editorial comments via email, I’ll incorporate them in my next set of edits. 14:03:50 yes 14:04:01 Thanks! 14:07:30 jnormore has joined #apps 14:55:51 AdamR? 14:56:08 Just a quick note that I have a call now so will get you edits in 90 mins or so 14:56:10 Ian 14:56:17 Ah, okay. Thanks