IRC log of auto-wcag on 2016-09-08

Timestamps are in UTC.

14:04:48 [RRSAgent]
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logging to http://www.w3.org/2016/09/08-auto-wcag-irc
14:05:15 [shadi]
meeting: WCAG Accessibility Conformance Testing (ACT) Task Force
14:05:20 [shadi]
chair: Wilco
14:05:24 [shadi]
scribe: Shadi
14:06:16 [cpandhi]
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14:06:49 [shadi]
present: Wilco_Fiers, Alistair_Garrison, Charu_pandhi, Jon_Gunderson, Mike_Scott, Rob_Fentress
14:07:25 [shadi]
present+ shadi
14:08:21 [cpandhi]
present+ Charu Pandhi
14:09:48 [jongund]
Lori Lane
14:09:52 [jongund]
Mike Scott
14:10:02 [shadi]
present+ Lori_Lane
14:10:19 [shadi]
present+ David_ONeill
14:10:56 [RobF]
Robert Fentress, Virginia Tech, Senior Accessibility Solutions Designer
14:11:13 [Wilco]
1) Tooling introduction next week
14:11:17 [shadi]
present+ Katie_Haritos-Shea
14:11:24 [Ryladog]
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Topic: Tooling Introduction Next Week
14:11:44 [Ryladog]
Present+ Katie_Haritos-Shea
14:11:47 [shadi]
Wilco: task force tools setup
14:12:06 [shadi]
...want to have a call next week to introduce new participants to these tools
14:12:29 [Ryladog]
Sorry I will be on a plane at that time
14:13:00 [shadi]
https://www.w3.org/WAI/GL/task-forces/conformance-testing/
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14:13:27 [Wilco]
https://www.w3.org/WAI/GL/task-forces/conformance-testing/
14:13:49 [Wilco]
shadi: please see the information on the conformanc etesting homepage
14:14:13 [shadi]
present+ Romain_Deltour
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14:14:34 [Wilco]
) Meeting time for ACT TF
14:14:51 [shadi]
Topic: Meeting Time for ACT TF
14:15:04 [shadi]
Wilco: plan is to have weekly meetings for ACT TF
14:15:12 [shadi]
...need to determine possible times
14:15:28 [shadi]
...either Thursday at this time, or same time on Wednesday
14:15:49 [shadi]
...preference for Wednesday, to avoid rescheduling auto-WCAG
14:16:08 [shadi]
Katie: Wednesday works for me
14:16:25 [shadi]
Rob: when is auto-WCAG?
14:16:27 [Alistair]
Wednesday +1
14:16:31 [shadi]
Wilco: at this time
14:16:57 [shadi]
Jon: can you describe the relationship between auto-WCAG and ACT TF?
14:17:13 [Wilco]
https://www.w3.org/WAI/GL/task-forces/conformance-testing/
14:17:40 [shadi]
Wilco: ACT TF will focus on standardizing the format of test rules
14:17:58 [shadi]
...and auto-WCAG will continue to develop test rules according to that new standard
14:18:14 [shadi]
Rob: so auto-WCAG will develop a tool?
14:18:26 [shadi]
Wilco: no, the rules that get implemented by tools
14:18:45 [shadi]
Rob: how is that different to ACT TF?
14:19:01 [shadi]
Wilco: auto-WCAG writes the tools, ACT TF standardizes the format
14:22:46 [shadi]
Shadi: output of ACT TF is a standard of the rule format and the benchmark requirements
14:23:07 [shadi]
...and output of auto-WCAG is a repository of test rules
14:23:30 [shadi]
...those that pass the benchmark will be marked as such
14:23:48 [shadi]
Wilco: back to agenda - hearing no objections to Wednesday
14:23:52 [shadi]
Charu: fine for me
14:24:00 [shadi]
David: fine too
14:24:04 [shadi]
Lori: fine too
14:24:12 [shadi]
Romain: probably fine too
14:24:41 [Wilco]
3) Sign up for ACT TF: https://www.w3.org/WAI/GL/participation
14:24:44 [shadi]
RESOLUTION: ACT TF will meet Wednesday from end-September onwards
14:24:51 [shadi]
Topic: Sign-Up for ACT TF
14:25:11 [shadi]
Wilco: need to register for ACT TF
14:26:00 [Wilco]
shadi: the act tf will be a taskforce of the wcag wg, who are responsible for the standardization. they will do the validation and vatting to ensure uniform interpretations
14:26:27 [Wilco]
... the work will start very soon. If you want to participate, you need to join WCAG WG
14:26:41 [Wilco]
... there are different procedures if you work for a w3c member organization or you don't
14:26:45 [shadi]
https://www.w3.org/WAI/GL/task-forces/conformance-testing/
14:27:02 [Wilco]
... on the homepage of the act tf there is information, go to 'how to participate'. there is a link to wcag wg participation
14:27:30 [Wilco]
... if you work for a w3c member, your ac rep need to asign you to the working group. You need to let Shadi know that you want to join
14:27:50 [Wilco]
... also let the chairs of the wcag wg know if you only want to participate in the taskforce
14:28:08 [Wilco]
... if you are not from a w3c member org, there is a procedure for invited experts
14:28:22 [Wilco]
... this is reviewed case by case, depending on what organization you are from
14:29:02 [Wilco]
... We will move all activities to the ACT TF, and auto-wcag will only keep working on test rules.
14:29:17 [Wilco]
... You are welcome to participate in both groups.
14:29:55 [Wilco]
David: Do I need to reapply as a invited expert?
14:30:04 [Wilco]
shadi: I'll need to check
14:30:23 [Wilco]
shadi: Let us look separately
14:30:59 [Wilco]
Charu: I have to get internal permission internally as well
14:31:41 [Wilco]
shadi: if you have any questions please email me
14:32:04 [Wilco]
rob: question, the auto-wcag group is a CG, and it does not go through the same process
14:32:06 [Wilco]
shadi: yes
14:33:07 [Wilco]
shadi: depending on your organization, you may need permission, but anyone can join a community group. It is much more open and easy to get involved
14:33:18 [Wilco]
... we want to do the rule development in that group
14:33:50 [shadi]
Wilco: several people not on the call
14:34:00 [shadi]
...can I send them the links
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14:34:18 [shadi]
https://www.w3.org/WAI/GL/task-forces/conformance-testing/#contribute
14:34:55 [Wilco]
4) TPAC meeting: https://www.w3.org/WAI/GL/task-forces/conformance-testing/wiki/Face-to-Face_Meetings
14:34:57 [shadi]
Shadi: suggest that link from the homepage
14:35:06 [shadi]
Topic: TPAC Meeting
14:35:15 [jongund]
no
14:35:36 [shadi]
Alistair: not attending in-person
14:36:36 [shadi]
Wilco: goal is to work on the requirements document
14:37:00 [david]
regrets, conflict with usbln conference
14:38:07 [Wilco]
shadi: TPAC is from the 19th to the 23rd of september, you can still join until tomorrow
14:38:25 [Wilco]
... This is an informal meeting to interact with the WCAG WG to get the group started
14:38:40 [Wilco]
... We'll work on the requirements to help kickstart the work
14:38:58 [Wilco]
... there will be remote participation for ACT participants
14:39:23 [shadi]
Topic: User Stories
14:39:28 [Wilco]
5) User stories: https://www.w3.org/WAI/GL/task-forces/conformance-testing/wiki/User_stories
14:40:21 [shadi]
Wilco: approach to help evolve the requirements
14:40:31 [shadi]
...grouped user stories into specific groups
14:41:21 [shadi]
[Wilco walks through the document]
14:42:44 [shadi]
David: like the approach and categorization
14:42:54 [shadi]
...just nit-pick on #7
14:43:11 [shadi]
...think policy makers often don't get to that level of detail implied
14:43:46 [shadi]
...likely will refer to a body of work that their team is allowed or encouraged to use
14:43:57 [shadi]
Katie: can leave it as-is
14:44:12 [shadi]
...but rephrase a "QA-lead following a policy"
14:44:26 [shadi]
...or such
14:44:44 [shadi]
David: agree with Katie
14:45:36 [shadi]
...this work relates to policy but not policy
14:45:47 [shadi]
...agree that QA is where rubber will hit the road
14:46:06 [shadi]
Wilco: agree, QA-lead is that I was thinking about
14:46:21 [shadi]
Katie: but ensure to say "following a policy"
14:46:31 [shadi]
...QA lead not typically write policy
14:46:46 [shadi]
David: mention of policy important, though
14:46:55 [shadi]
...want to encourage use of repository
14:47:14 [shadi]
Alistair: this group is not designed to do that
14:47:33 [shadi]
...it is this group plus auto-WCAG
14:47:48 [shadi]
...suggest to drop out what is not being done by ACT TF
14:48:08 [shadi]
Katie: think keep together
14:48:24 [shadi]
...large organizations will be thinking "what is the least I could do"
14:48:46 [shadi]
Alistair: need to decide which tests are good or bad
14:48:49 [shadi]
q+
14:49:15 [shadi]
...repository open to any contribution
14:49:28 [shadi]
...concerned about watch-keeping
14:49:49 [shadi]
Wilco: put this in because expected this discussion
14:49:57 [shadi]
...want to clarify scope
14:50:21 [shadi]
...repository will be developed by ACT but who will maintain it is still open
14:50:35 [jongund]
q+
14:50:42 [shadi]
...will decide which get included and which not
14:51:00 [shadi]
...will need at least a set of acceptance criteria to get to REC
14:51:15 [shadi]
...need to figure how to maintain that repository
14:51:30 [shadi]
Alistair: did not realize that this is part of ACT
14:51:52 [shadi]
ack jon
14:52:13 [shadi]
Jon: had trouble with Techniques on which ones get in and which not
14:52:25 [shadi]
...some get left out for whatever reason
14:52:35 [shadi]
...hope that there will be a clear process
14:52:43 [shadi]
q-
14:52:55 [shadi]
...to ensure transparency and reduce frustration
14:53:16 [Alistair]
q+
14:53:17 [shadi]
...also to know which kind of rules should be submitted and which not
14:53:58 [shadi]
Wilco: looking at how this is done for Techniques will be important
14:54:06 [shadi]
...will come later down the road
14:54:08 [shadi]
ack al
14:54:20 [jongund]
i need to leave a little early
14:54:22 [shadi]
Alistair: still concerned about scalability
14:54:46 [shadi]
...took me a year to get a Technique accepted
14:54:55 [shadi]
...lots of discussion
14:54:59 [shadi]
q+
14:55:14 [shadi]
...didn't realize we are going to vet rules
14:55:36 [shadi]
Wilco: not sure we will come up with a set that is definitive
14:55:50 [shadi]
...but have a benchmarking deliverable
14:56:04 [shadi]
...still have to figure out exactly how
14:56:17 [shadi]
...will need to consider implementation time
14:56:34 [shadi]
...also manage the quantity of rules
14:56:58 [shadi]
Alistair: talking about industry consortium rather than W3C group
14:57:05 [shadi]
Wilco: don't see why
14:57:35 [shadi]
Alistair: because knock-effect on entire industry
14:57:54 [shadi]
Wilco: again, manufacturers can go beyond
14:58:08 [shadi]
...this is a minimum set that we all agree on
14:58:27 [shadi]
...document these agreed rules in a repository
14:58:31 [shadi]
q-
14:58:34 [cpandhi]
q+
14:58:41 [Alistair]
q-
14:58:46 [shadi]
ack cp
14:59:14 [shadi]
Charu: reiterated that ACT will deliver framework, benchmark, and repository
14:59:33 [shadi]
...repository includes test rules developed by auto-WCAG
14:59:57 [shadi]
Wilco: rules in the repository is at least test rules we agree on
15:00:33 [shadi]
....figure out how to maintain ACT after we've solved the acceptance
15:00:54 [shadi]
Charu: trying to understand the relationship to auto-WCAG
15:01:21 [shadi]
Wilco: auto-WCAG writing rules but rules can come from other organizations as well
15:01:35 [shadi]
Topic: Closure
15:01:56 [shadi]
Wilco: please use Discussion Page to comment on these
15:02:27 [shadi]
Shadi: need to join ACT TF
15:02:41 [shadi]
Rob: next auto-WCAG meeting?
15:03:02 [shadi]
Wilco: 29 September
15:03:10 [shadi]
...same time
15:03:37 [shadi]
Wilco: next ACT TF meeting next Thursday same time
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16:30:56 [shadi_]
rrsagent, make logs world
16:31:02 [shadi_]
rrsagent, make minutes
16:31:02 [RRSAgent]
I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2016/09/08-auto-wcag-minutes.html shadi_
16:31:21 [shadi_]
rrsagent, bye
16:31:21 [RRSAgent]
I see no action items