14:43:15 <RRSAgent> RRSAgent has joined #lvtf
14:43:15 <RRSAgent> logging to http://www.w3.org/2015/12/02-lvtf-irc
14:43:17 <trackbot> RRSAgent, make logs public
14:43:17 <Zakim> Zakim has joined #lvtf
14:43:19 <trackbot> Zakim, this will be
14:43:19 <Zakim> I don't understand 'this will be', trackbot
14:43:20 <trackbot> Meeting: Low Vision Accessibility Task Force Teleconference
14:43:20 <trackbot> Date: 02 December 2015
14:43:31 <allanj> rrsagent, set logs public
14:43:43 <allanj> rrsagent, make minutes
14:43:43 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2015/12/02-lvtf-minutes.html allanj
14:44:00 <allanj> rrsagent, set logs public
14:44:34 <allanj> chair: Andrew and Jim
14:44:46 <allanj> present+ jim
14:45:24 <allanj> regrets+ Alan
14:45:36 <allanj> regrets+ Chuck
14:49:25 <jeanne> jeanne has joined #lvtf
14:57:31 <AWK> AWK has joined #lvtf
14:57:47 <JohnRochford> JohnRochford has joined #lvtf
15:17:55 <allanj> agenda?
15:18:01 <allanj> Agenda+ scribe
15:18:03 <allanj> Agenda+ Framework for requirements document
15:18:04 <allanj> Agenda+ Laura's sectional summaries
15:18:06 <allanj> Agenda+ gather example images or online simulators for requirements as necessary.
15:18:07 <allanj> Agenda+ Review questions posed in Yellow Notes sections. They need to be addressed.
15:20:13 <JohnRochford> Jim, I can't get in to the conf call.
15:20:25 <JohnRochford> access codes being reported as invalid
15:20:34 <JohnRochford> I'm using the ones in your message
15:20:53 <JohnRochford> Has the meeting started?
15:20:58 <JohnRochford> That might be it
15:21:10 <JohnRochford> Good morning to you too!
15:23:04 <laura> laura has joined #lvtf
15:23:37 <JohnRochford> I'm trying. Now finding password.
15:26:28 <shawn> zakim, who is on the phone?
15:26:28 <Zakim> Present: jim
15:26:34 <shawn> present+ Shawn
15:26:46 <allanj> present+ Jeanne
15:26:54 <JohnRochford> Hi, yes, I used that password. Unbelievably, I was just presented with a CAPTCHA, which is inaccessible to me.
15:27:08 <JohnRochford> I shall try by phone again.
15:29:21 <JohnRochford> I will send it to you, Jim, via email.
15:31:24 <shawn> Agenda 2 =  Framework for requirements document https://www.w3.org/WAI/GL/low-vision-a11y-tf/wiki/Overview_of_Low_Vision#Categories
15:32:25 <laura> present+ Laura
15:33:19 <JohnRochford> I'm in WebEx now
15:35:51 <AWK> +AWK
15:35:53 <Wayne> Wayne has joined #lvtf
15:35:57 <AWK> +Erich_Manser
15:36:08 <AWK> Zakim, agenda?
15:36:08 <Zakim> I see 5 items remaining on the agenda:
15:36:09 <Zakim> 1. scribe [from allanj]
15:36:09 <Zakim> 2. Framework for requirements document https://www.w3.org/WAI/GL/low-vision-a11y-tf/wiki/Overview_of_Low_Vision#Categories
15:36:09 <Zakim> 3. Laura's sectional summaries [from allanj]
15:36:09 <Zakim> 4. gather example images or online simulators for requirements as necessary. [from allanj]
15:36:10 <Zakim> 5. Review questions posed in Yellow Notes sections. They need to be addressed. [from allanj]
15:36:15 <AWK> Zakim, take up item 1
15:36:15 <Zakim> agendum 1. "scribe" taken up [from allanj]
15:36:17 <shawn> zakim, who is on the phone?
15:36:17 <Zakim> Present: jim, Shawn, Jeanne, Laura, AWK, Erich_Manser
15:36:31 <shawn> present+ JohnR
15:37:07 <Wayne> present+ WayneD
15:37:48 <AWK> Scribe: Laura
15:38:01 <AWK> Zakim, close item 1
15:38:01 <Zakim> agendum 1, scribe, closed
15:38:02 <Zakim> I see 4 items remaining on the agenda; the next one is
15:38:02 <Zakim> 2. Framework for requirements document https://www.w3.org/WAI/GL/low-vision-a11y-tf/wiki/Overview_of_Low_Vision#Categories
15:38:06 <AWK> Zakim, take up item 2
15:38:06 <Zakim> agendum 2. "Framework for requirements document https://www.w3.org/WAI/GL/low-vision-a11y-tf/wiki/Overview_of_Low_Vision#Categories" taken up
15:38:11 <Wayne> I am having trouble getting in. Working on it.
15:38:36 <shawn> s/I am having trouble getting in. Working on it./
15:39:27 <laura> AWK: Looking at overview of lowvision Wikii page. Want to move it to Git Hub.
15:40:33 <laura> AWK: How do we want to use it in the overview?
15:41:03 <allanj> Shawn categories:
15:41:04 <allanj>     Luminance and color
15:41:06 <allanj>     Visual acuity
15:41:08 <allanj>         Perceiving (Letter Characteristics)
15:41:09 <allanj>         Spacing for Reading
15:41:11 <allanj>         Distinguishing
15:41:12 <allanj>     Perceptual area
15:41:14 <allanj>         Tracking
15:41:15 <allanj>         Point of Regard and Proximity
15:42:59 <laura> AWK: Initially had some other factors.
15:43:11 <allanj> Printing is missing from list above
15:43:29 <JohnRochford> q?
15:43:31 <laura> AWK: What makes the most sense?
15:43:53 <Wayne> is there a different code?
15:44:51 <laura> John: list near sighted and farsighted under visual acuity?
15:45:33 <laura> Shawn: maybe in the overview as it is related to all.
15:45:59 <Erich> Erich has joined #lvtf
15:46:18 <laura> Jim: Should focus on: can’t see the screen.
15:46:39 <laura> AWK: Far more nuanced.
15:47:38 <Ryladog> Ryladog has joined #lvtf
15:48:27 <allanj> Katie+
15:49:04 <shawn> q+
15:49:17 <Ryladog> Present+ Katie Haritos-Shea
15:49:19 <shawn> ack me
15:50:00 <JohnRochford> q+
15:50:06 <laura> Shawn: We need to find the link to piror minutes
15:50:12 <AWK> ack jo
15:50:40 <laura> John: Do we need to figure this out now?
15:50:51 <laura> AWK: Good point.
15:53:28 <laura> AWK: Is everything captured in the second group?
15:54:23 <laura> AWK: Don’t think it is a problem.
15:54:58 <laura> Katie: Think it may be too broad.
15:55:43 <laura> AWK: Distinguishing may not fit.
15:57:09 <laura> Katie: Barriers to distinguishing. Or ability to distinguish.
15:57:15 <shawn> q+
15:57:24 <Wayne> One issue is that individual impairments may imply multiple categories
15:57:24 <laura> John: why are we going int solutions?
15:57:48 <shawn> ack me
15:58:26 <laura> Shawn: 2 different things.
16:00:04 <laura> AWK: Feels like the distinguishing section is more about perceiving element characteristics.
16:00:16 <allanj> Illumination/contrast discussion link added to the Overview Wiki
16:00:16 <Wayne> Fatigue occurs in almost conditions.
16:01:18 <laura> Katie: How about distinguishing and identifying?
16:02:20 <laura> AWK: The 3 things are definitely related.
16:02:47 <laura> Jim: Distinguishing is part of the spacing.
16:03:37 <shawn> how about Distinguishing Elements (e.g., headings)
16:03:43 <laura> Jim: All closely related.
16:04:25 <JohnRochford> q+
16:04:32 <AWK> ack j
16:05:56 <laura> John: Suggest don’t get into detail at this point.
16:07:17 <laura> AWK: look at tweaking these. Perhaps change the headings.
16:07:24 <laura> John: yes.
16:08:16 <laura> Katie: the need is the inability to distingusish.
16:09:31 <allanj> awk - requirement is the user needs to be able to distinguish
16:09:39 <JohnRochford> Clarification: I said "yes" to the characterization that this is a user needs doc, not a solutions doc.
16:09:40 <laura> AWK: Need to look at categories more.
16:10:23 <Ryladog> q+ to add that the NEED is to be able to Distinguish and Identify
16:12:28 <laura> AWK: Tracking feels like they may be needs or solutions.
16:13:33 <laura> AWK: Overview is general document and a frame work.
16:14:03 <laura> AWK: shouldn’t be about the solutions.
16:14:05 <JohnRochford> +1
16:14:14 <laura> +1
16:14:15 <shawn> +1 agree to Andrew's overview of the sections & this doc , and next
16:14:17 <allanj> overview of low vision issues - broad strokes, general. set up a framework/categories
16:14:19 <allanj> requirements of specific user needs based on framework
16:14:20 <allanj> solutions - techniques
16:14:57 <Wayne> q+
16:15:19 <AWK> ack ry
16:15:19 <Zakim> Ryladog, you wanted to add that the NEED is to be able to Distinguish and Identify
16:15:28 <shawn> s/ solutions - techniques/separate doc:  solutions - techniques
16:15:49 <AWK> ack wa
16:15:53 <laura> Katie: Need is to distinguish and identify.
16:16:36 <laura> Wayne: Wonder if we need a middle section and think of these in terms of POUR.
16:17:55 <shawn> Wayne: Visual acuity is @@ whereas Luminance is @@
16:18:04 <laura> AWK: one topic for overview is perceptual area
16:20:03 <laura> AWK: Can have things fit together.
16:20:39 <laura> AWK: Move text around so that we only have one list
16:21:50 <shawn> s/Visual acuity is @@ whereas Luminance is @@/Visual acuity is physical limitation whereas Luminance is @@
16:22:06 <laura> Wayne: Kind of losing things with luminance and color. Contrast sensitivity and light sensitivity.
16:22:19 <shawn> Wayne: contrast sensitivity, light sensitivity, color perception
16:22:52 <laura> AWK: For overview talk about 3 bullets.
16:23:35 <laura> …Categories and desired outcomes.
16:24:43 <laura> Wayne: Hard to measure fatigue. But we need to address it as it is a barrier for users.
16:25:24 <laura> AWK: Yes, we need to address the fatigue issue.
16:26:06 <laura> Wayne: Environmental issues are important.
16:27:43 <laura> AWK: Can move categories to GitHub. Are people okay with that?
16:28:35 <laura> Shawn: maybe work in the Wiki for a while.
16:28:38 <JohnRochford> q+
16:29:33 <shawn> [ thinking about POUR... most of these are P I think... I agree save this until later ]
16:29:45 <shawn> ack j
16:31:14 <allanj> jim tackle acuity overview
16:31:43 <allanj> wayne - luiminance and color
16:32:09 <allanj> andrew - perceptual
16:32:27 <laura> Wayne: Luminance and color
16:32:34 <laura> Jim: Visual acuity
16:32:38 <AWK> Trackbot, end meeting
16:32:38 <trackbot> Zakim, list attendees
16:32:38 <Zakim> As of this point the attendees have been jim, Shawn, Jeanne, Laura, AWK, Erich_Manser, JohnR, WayneD, Katie, Haritos-Shea
16:32:46 <trackbot> RRSAgent, please draft minutes
16:32:46 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2015/12/02-lvtf-minutes.html trackbot
16:32:47 <trackbot> RRSAgent, bye
16:32:47 <RRSAgent> I see no action items
16:32:48 <laura> AWK: Perceptual area