IRC log of wpay on 2015-08-06

Timestamps are in UTC.

14:00:17 [RRSAgent]

RRSAgent has joined #wpay

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logging to http://www.w3.org/2015/08/06-wpay-irc

14:00:20 [manu]

rrsagent, make logs public

14:00:29 [manu]

Meeting: Web Payments Use Cases Task Force

14:01:42 [manu]

Present+ Matt

14:01:45 [manu]

Present+ Manu

14:02:13 [AdrianHB]

Present+ AdrianHB

14:05:36 [padler]

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14:08:43 [padler]

q+

14:09:25 [Ian]

10 seconds

14:10:14 [Ian]

De Nederlandsche Bank just joined the IG! :)

14:11:52 [manu]

Agenda: https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-webpayments-ig/2015Aug/0032.html

14:12:00 [manu]

scribenick: AdrianHB

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14:12:16 [AdrianHB]

agenda+ WPWG Charter

14:12:16 [DJackson]

Present+ DJackson

14:12:41 [manu]

Present+ AdrianHB

14:12:44 [AdrianHB]

Agenda+ WPWG Charter blog post

14:12:54 [AdrianHB]

Agenda+ TPAC f2f

14:12:59 [manu]

Topic: Web Payments WG Charter to W3C Membership

14:13:10 [manu]

https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Member/w3c-ac-members/2015JulSep/0031.html

14:13:21 [AdrianHB]

agenda+ WPIG -> WPWG knowledge transfer

14:14:04 [AdrianHB]

Ian: WPWG charter has been put out for AC review

14:16:24 [AdrianHB]

ian: I will be following up and ensuring AC are considering charter

14:16:41 [AdrianHB]

... Nick TR has been named as one co-chair

14:16:46 [AdrianHB]

... others TBD

14:16:53 [AdrianHB]

manu: when does review end

14:16:57 [AdrianHB]

ian: Sept 15

14:16:58 [Ian]

https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-new-work/2015Aug/0001.html

14:17:21 [AdrianHB]

... you may wish to notify people of this but also suggest people subscribe to the new-work mailing list

14:18:10 [AdrianHB]

manu: I have a list of W3C member companies I like to contact if there is stuff I think they need to see when should I contact them

14:18:35 [AdrianHB]

ian: there are auto-reminders sent to AC reps a week before the review ends

14:18:37 [AdrianHB]

...

14:18:39 [manu]

q+ to say that I get so many of those that I ignore all of them.

14:19:22 [AdrianHB]

... secondly our plan, with Doug, is to reach out to individual IG member's AC rep and also those that were at the March workshop but aren't in the IG

14:19:40 [AdrianHB]

... we will also contact those that supported the IG charter

14:19:50 [manu]

ack padler

14:19:55 [manu]

ack manu

14:19:55 [Zakim]

manu, you wanted to say that I get so many of those that I ignore all of them.

14:20:03 [AdrianHB]

... feel free to reach out but the staff will also be doing some of this and there are auto-reminders

14:20:27 [AdrianHB]

manu: auto-reminders are a bit overwhelming

14:20:34 [AdrianHB]

... i find direct emails work better

14:20:53 [AdrianHB]

... but sounds like the staff have this under control

14:21:01 [manu]

Ian: In terms of the member review

14:21:26 [manu]

Ian: For the member review part, if you have a personal relationship w/ people - and you think they've missed it - by all means, ping them.

14:21:58 [AdrianHB]

ian: it will be most helpful for members to do outreach at the launch

14:22:01 [manu]

Ian: If you know if they're aware of it, don't need to ping them. I think more importantly - we need to reach out to rest of industry after launch. We'll have conversations on that launch, testimonials, develop some stories, etc.

14:22:29 [AdrianHB]

manu: got it, thanks

14:22:39 [manu]

zakim, take up agendum 2

14:22:39 [Zakim]

agendum 2. "WPWG Charter blog post" taken up [from AdrianHB]

14:22:40 [AdrianHB]

... anythign further on this topic?

14:22:50 [manu]

http://www.w3.org/blog/wpig/2015/08/05/web-payments-working-group-charter-in-review/

14:23:13 [AdrianHB]

manu: Ian has put a blog post together. Do you want to discuss it at all Ian?

14:23:44 [AdrianHB]

ian: It's already been posted, please have a look. Nothing that required IG input it's just facts and links to the IG's work so far (FAQ and charter)

14:23:56 [AdrianHB]

manu: any q?

14:24:10 [AdrianHB]

ian: please retweet my tweet about it

14:24:10 [Ian]

https://twitter.com/w3c/status/628951869059108864

14:24:45 [Ian]

https://twitter.com/w3c/status/628858287102930945

14:24:47 [AdrianHB]

manu: anything else?

14:25:04 [AdrianHB]

ian: nederlansde bank just joined the IG

14:25:43 [padler]

q+

14:26:10 [AdrianHB]

manu: ian, do you get a feeling that the bank will be heavily involved?

14:26:22 [AdrianHB]

ian: not sure, I was not involved in the recruitment

14:26:51 [AdrianHB]

manu: would be valuable to understand how they got to joining. Would help with other recrutiment efforts

14:27:20 [AdrianHB]

pat: Fed will be publishing articles in Fedfocus (large c-suite finserv readership)

14:27:23 [AdrianHB]

...

14:27:33 [AdrianHB]

... intro article in early septemeber about IG

14:28:04 [AdrianHB]

... will try to leverage time at TF meeting or Chicago symposium to highlight the work

14:28:17 [AdrianHB]

... another article asking people to join the WG in october

14:28:33 [AdrianHB]

... followed up on note from Ian re getting more central banks

14:28:53 [AdrianHB]

... possible opportunity at SIBOS where we will be talking to central banks

14:29:10 [AdrianHB]

... agneda is liely fixed now but we could prepare something to share there for central banks specifically

14:29:54 [AdrianHB]

ian: TPAC is coming up, we need to drum up momentum for that too

14:30:26 [AdrianHB]

... we are now trying to decide how we get the next charter done and that means looking at proposals for the next 6 months

14:31:23 [manu]

zakim, take up agendum 3

14:31:23 [Zakim]

agendum 3. "TPAC f2f" taken up [from AdrianHB]

14:31:36 [manu]

https://www.w3.org/Payments/IG/wiki/Main_Page/FTF_Oct2015

14:32:17 [AdrianHB]

ian: this feels like a discussion we shoudl have on Monday with the whole IG

14:32:32 [AdrianHB]

manu: we can skip but if we want but we can use this time to prep

14:32:45 [AdrianHB]

ian: june was great because we had a specific outcome in mind

14:32:50 [manu]

q+ to raise concern about WPIG + WPWG to be "too much Web Payments" for TPAC.

14:32:54 [AdrianHB]

... to that end let's set some goals

14:33:02 [manu]

ack padler

14:33:13 [AdrianHB]

... I think the IG goal is to establish what the next charter will be

14:33:31 [AdrianHB]

... don't think we will have a charter by the end of TPAC though

14:33:40 [AdrianHB]

... need proposals as input to that process

14:34:24 [AdrianHB]

... for the WG the gaol will be a knowlegde transfer, opportunity to meet other groups with which it has some liason reqs and start setting our work plan

14:34:54 [AdrianHB]

... as an example we have in teh charter that we will build test suites so let's use that opportunityt o get Phillipe's time for an hour

14:35:02 [manu]

ack manu

14:35:02 [Zakim]

manu, you wanted to raise concern about WPIG + WPWG to be "too much Web Payments" for TPAC.

14:35:11 [AdrianHB]

... notes welcome form members

14:35:24 [AdrianHB]

manu: have concern about the amount of participation

14:35:32 [AdrianHB]

... might be an overdose of payments

14:35:50 [AdrianHB]

... will we have IG and WG meetings at every TPAC for the next few years

14:36:01 [AdrianHB]

... should we only have the WG meet after this year?

14:36:17 [AdrianHB]

... we may be a burnt out by the end of the week

14:36:44 [AdrianHB]

ian: if we have good agenda we will be "tired but energised" otherwise it won't feel worthwhile

14:36:55 [AdrianHB]

... we need to go in with clear goals

14:37:16 [AdrianHB]

... there is a lot we need to work thoguh on this occasion

14:37:29 [AdrianHB]

... and the location is an opportunity to bring in new participants

14:37:46 [AdrianHB]

... don't want to make a balnket statement let's deal with on a case by case

14:38:06 [AdrianHB]

... we need to do stuff in prep to ensure we get to the f2f with work to do

14:38:12 [manu]

q+ to ask about demos and input to WG

14:38:24 [manu]

ack manu

14:38:24 [Zakim]

manu, you wanted to ask about demos and input to WG

14:38:33 [AdrianHB]

... need to think about what's important and who will do the work (writing proposals)

14:39:10 [Ian]

q+

14:39:11 [AdrianHB]

manu: there is a body of work that exists outside the IG which we have been talking about abstractly to date. Would some demos help us solidify our ideas?

14:39:34 [AdrianHB]

... i.e. We show the things we are talking about as a way to start conversations.

14:39:46 [AdrianHB]

... do we do that in the IG and WG or one or the other?

14:40:40 [padler]

q+ to think out loud about meeting ideas.

14:40:41 [manu]

ack Ian

14:40:55 [AdrianHB]

ian: at the june meeting Evan's demo was a great conversation piece and we also say Apple's demo of Apple Pay which helped us feel out our thoughts

14:41:10 [AdrianHB]

... so anything that helps do that is welcome

14:41:36 [AdrianHB]

... just demos will be less important if it's not driving the agenda

14:41:45 [manu]

ack padler

14:41:45 [Zakim]

padler, you wanted to think out loud about meeting ideas.

14:41:47 [AdrianHB]

... so, if demos support the goals, sounds great

14:42:43 [AdrianHB]

pat: wrt june meeting and last TPAC (my read on things), if we can somehow focus the portions of the agenda around specific examples

14:42:55 [AdrianHB]

... use cases beyond the scope of the WG charter

14:43:20 [AdrianHB]

... i saw a lot of indecision around use cases that were not imprtant to everyone

14:43:40 [AdrianHB]

... perhaps industry focused agenda sessions would help

14:43:59 [AdrianHB]

... eg: b2b vs c2b vs g2b etc

14:44:32 [dsr]

dsr has joined #wpay

14:44:50 [AdrianHB]

manu: industry focused in the same room or separate rooms

14:44:54 [AdrianHB]

...?

14:45:28 [AdrianHB]

pat: perhaps we just need to identify which perspective we are taking at particular time, perhaps different tracks

14:46:11 [manu]

q+ to +1 industry specific discussions in same room.

14:46:13 [AdrianHB]

padler: need to think about how to focus sections of the agenda for specific groups of memebers in the IG

14:46:45 [AdrianHB]

padler: we need to deliniate between IG and WG (IG needs to have wide scope)

14:47:03 [Ian]

q+

14:47:04 [manu]

ack manu

14:47:04 [AdrianHB]

... IG needs to focus on the new WGs we will be forming etc

14:47:05 [Zakim]

manu, you wanted to +1 industry specific discussions in same room.

14:47:12 [AdrianHB]

manu: +1 to padler

14:47:53 [AdrianHB]

... helpful to have industry specific sections of the agenda (eg: retail perspective for an hour talking about digital receipts)

14:48:12 [AdrianHB]

... it frames the discussion and keeps the discussion focused

14:48:25 [AdrianHB]

... another session on identity and banking

14:48:50 [AdrianHB]

... in that session we'd specifically not talk about KYC for MNOs etc

14:49:04 [AdrianHB]

padler: yes, thats what I'm looking for

14:49:31 [manu]

q+ to say that having the discussion in the same room is important.

14:49:40 [AdrianHB]

... in june the conversation was a bit tangled because of the diversity of people in the conversations

14:50:00 [manu]

ack Ian

14:50:21 [AdrianHB]

ian: yes, scopes should not overlap (IG vs WG)

14:50:55 [AdrianHB]

... as far as strcuturing the rest of the agenda, not sure sepeartion along stakeholder lines is right but open to proposals

14:50:59 [padler]

maybe base it on "scenarios"

14:51:09 [manu]

ack manu

14:51:09 [Zakim]

manu, you wanted to say that having the discussion in the same room is important.

14:51:22 [AdrianHB]

... our job this month is to figure out the best way to do the IG f2f

14:52:04 [padler]

-1 to break out groups in the way that we did them in June..

14:52:24 [AdrianHB]

manu: we should stay in the same room

14:52:35 [padler]

+1 to staying in same room..

14:52:58 [AdrianHB]

... it results in some common understanding

14:53:04 [AdrianHB]

+1 to staying together

14:53:46 [AdrianHB]

padler: industry vertical is perhaps not the right way to do it, I like the idea of scenarios/settings eg: retail

14:53:59 [AdrianHB]

... helps to identify out of context comments and defer those

14:54:15 [AdrianHB]

manu: let's move on

14:54:16 [manu]

Topic: WPIG -> WPWG Knowledge Transfer

14:54:29 [AdrianHB]

zakim, take up agenum 4

14:54:29 [Zakim]

I don't understand 'take up agenum 4', AdrianHB

14:54:54 [shepazu]

present+ Doug

14:55:02 [AdrianHB]

manu: there is another set of docs we need to point the WG at which is those in the WPCG

14:55:20 [AdrianHB]

... q1: are we planning on mentioning those?

14:55:35 [AdrianHB]

... q2: how will we do that if we don't discuss them in the IG first?

14:56:01 [AdrianHB]

ian: in the IG context, what is the right time to cover the work of the CG?

14:56:21 [AdrianHB]

... has it worked on APIs that look like the APIs the WG is going to work on

14:56:24 [AdrianHB]

manu: yes

14:56:48 [AdrianHB]

ian: then we should have a session in the WG meeting to hand-over work that has been done previously (in the CG or other)

14:56:56 [AdrianHB]

q+ to ask who will comiple that?

14:57:05 [AdrianHB]

manu: is there work for the IG to do?

14:57:16 [AdrianHB]

ian: no, that's now in the WG's scope

14:57:25 [manu]

ack AdrianHB

14:57:25 [Zakim]

AdrianHB, you wanted to ask who will comiple that?

14:58:02 [manu]

AdrianHB: There is a bunch of source material for that WG to consume which the IG hasn't looked at because it has been considered too technical. Isn't it the role of the IG to compile that list?

14:58:21 [manu]

Ian: That may be an optimization because of timing...

14:58:43 [manu]

Ian: The WG group should launch September 28th, and then develop that list in the WG - it may be impractical to have it formally defined that way.

14:58:55 [AdrianHB]

ian: that may be an optimization but it's not a req of the IG. The group will launch pre-TPAC so theoretically it could be done by WG participants pre-TPAC

14:59:27 [AdrianHB]

manu: I can take an action to compile this list and engage the CG

15:00:28 [AdrianHB]

ian: fine but the framing is important. The charter has no "starting point" defined so this is input but not mandatory for the WG to consider

15:01:10 [AdrianHB]

... it's probabaly useful to share the material in advance but I think the WG needs to establish itself

15:01:11 [manu]

rrsagent, draft minutes

15:01:11 [RRSAgent]

I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2015/08/06-wpay-minutes.html manu

15:01:23 [AdrianHB]

... so sharing this stuff should be done in a light touch way

15:02:06 [Ian]

manu: I'm ok to meet briefly

15:02:35 [AdrianHB]

manu: short admin call tomorrow on capabilities doc

15:03:28 [manu]

rrsagent, draft minutes

15:03:28 [RRSAgent]

I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2015/08/06-wpay-minutes.html manu

15:03:45 [manu]

Present+ Ian

15:03:55 [manu]

Chair: Everyone!

15:04:16 [manu]

s/10 seconds//

15:04:25 [manu]

s/De Nederlandsche Bank just joined the IG! :)//

15:04:49 [manu]

rrsagent, draft minutes

15:04:49 [RRSAgent]

I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2015/08/06-wpay-minutes.html manu

15:04:59 [manu]

rrsagent, bye

15:04:59 [RRSAgent]

I see no action items