IRC log of educ on 2015-02-06
Timestamps are in UTC.
- 14:40:15 [RRSAgent]
- RRSAgent has joined #educ
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- logging to http://www.w3.org/2015/02/06-educ-irc
- 14:40:24 [ivan]
- rrsagent, set log public
- 14:40:42 [Zakim]
- Zakim has joined #educ
- 14:40:49 [ivan]
- zakim, this will be 3382
- 14:40:49 [Zakim]
- ok, ivan; I see Team_JEFF(EDUCATION)10:00AM scheduled to start in 20 minutes
- 14:41:22 [ivan]
- Meeting: Education & W3C
- 14:41:33 [ivan]
- Chair: Pierre Dannet
- 14:48:10 [Crispin]
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- 14:49:21 [Pierre]
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- 14:53:27 [shorton]
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- Team_JEFF(EDUCATION)10:00AM has now started
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- +??P30
- 14:55:27 [Pierre]
- Crispin and Pierre in London connected
- 14:59:08 [Zakim]
- + +1.603.252.aaaa
- 15:00:17 [ivan]
- zakim, dial ivan-voip
- 15:00:17 [Zakim]
- ok, ivan; the call is being made
- 15:00:18 [Zakim]
- +Ivan
- 15:01:04 [Zakim]
- +[IPcaller]
- 15:01:34 [Pierre]
- do we have Judy ?
- 15:02:09 [Zakim]
- +Judy
- 15:02:15 [Zakim]
- +mhakkinen
- 15:02:16 [davidsloan]
- davidsloan has joined #educ
- 15:02:25 [Judy]
- Judy has joined #Educ
- 15:02:32 [mhakkinen]
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- 15:03:08 [Zakim]
- +Sylvie_Duchateau
- 15:04:13 [Judy]
- zakim, who's making noise?
- 15:04:24 [Zakim]
- Judy, listening for 10 seconds I heard sound from the following: ??P30 (67%), Ivan (29%), Sylvie_Duchateau (9%)
- 15:04:42 [ivan]
- zakim, mute me
- 15:04:42 [Zakim]
- Ivan should now be muted
- 15:06:25 [Zakim]
- +MarkS
- 15:06:31 [Pierre]
- I can try to be a scribe
- 15:06:59 [MarkS]
- MarkS has joined #educ
- 15:07:18 [ivan]
- zakim, unmute me
- 15:07:18 [Zakim]
- Ivan should no longer be muted
- 15:08:16 [Pierre]
- So, who can be the scribe ?
- 15:09:05 [Judy]
- scribe: Judy
- 15:09:12 [ivan]
- zakim, mute me
- 15:09:12 [Zakim]
- Ivan should now be muted
- 15:09:25 [Judy]
- Pierre: Introductions please.... around the room....
- 15:09:36 [Judy]
- Pierre: Crispin will now present
- 15:09:58 [Judy]
- Crispin: I'll talk first about the history of edtech, then standardization opportunity
- 15:10:15 [Judy]
- ...slides were distrib by email
- 15:10:26 [Judy]
- ...edtech not extensive impact yet on education
- 15:10:37 [Judy]
- ...backed up by recent study from the UK
- 15:10:58 [Judy]
- ...for standards org, difficult to assess market need then.
- 15:11:09 [Judy]
- ...first must ask why not more effective.
- 15:11:26 [Pierre]
- instruction is interaction
- 15:11:32 [Judy]
- Crispin: basis of ed is child interacting with a bicycle
- 15:11:49 [Judy]
- ...and there are other natural instructive partners
- 15:12:33 [Pierre]
- will try
- 15:12:48 [Judy]
- Crispin: We haven't seen sufficient development of complex interactive software
- 15:12:53 [Judy]
- scribe: Pierre
- 15:13:10 [Pierre]
- Slide 5 representation of Bllom 's taxonomy
- 15:13:54 [Pierre]
- Instructional stack for digitizing interactions
- 15:14:10 [Zakim]
- -Sylvie_Duchateau
- 15:14:42 [Pierre]
- Traditionnal teaching is managed by the teacher
- 15:14:53 [Pierre]
- Publisher providing textbooks
- 15:15:05 [Pierre]
- Teacher responsible for implementations
- 15:15:16 [Zakim]
- +??P11
- 15:15:20 [Pierre]
- Digital Education : we do not want to replace the teachers
- 15:15:30 [Pierre]
- Slide 6
- 15:15:41 [Pierre]
- More process management type
- 15:15:48 [pomerol]
- pomerol has joined #Educ
- 15:16:04 [Pierre]
- Slide 7 : other way to characterize that
- 15:16:24 [Pierre]
- Activities embedded in a management cycle
- 15:16:43 [Pierre]
- Adaptive learning select next activities
- 15:17:11 [Pierre]
- Multiple activities in order to cover the curriculum
- 15:17:29 [Pierre]
- Interface between the two need standard (Red arrows)
- 15:17:47 [Pierre]
- Slide 8 : Pedagogy us activity sequencing
- 15:18:08 [Pierre]
- There are many sorts of sequences : according to performance, ...
- 15:18:27 [Pierre]
- Independent activities can be dependent on each other
- 15:19:14 [Pierre]
- ...There are many sorts of sequencing...
- 15:19:36 [Pierre]
- Slide 10 : abstract slide : around assessment
- 15:20:00 [Pierre]
- ...... Assement is a continuum....
- 15:20:22 [Pierre]
- .....two triangles....
- 15:20:40 [Pierre]
- .....Failure is key concept....
- 15:20:56 [Pierre]
- ....we learn from failure....
- 15:21:49 [Pierre]
- ...... Reliable method to more integrated continuous assessment...
- 15:22:05 [Pierre]
- Slide 11 : Supply chain
- 15:22:47 [Pierre]
- .... Interactive courseware based on information and activity softwares....
- 15:23:09 [Pierre]
- ....there are gaps in this edtech supply chain...
- 15:23:26 [Pierre]
- Slide 12 : expressing learning objectives
- 15:23:50 [Pierre]
- ....people based on paper and digital....
- 15:24:20 [Pierre]
- .....Education is interested by capabilities...
- 15:24:53 [Pierre]
- ...we often certificate people on performance and not on capability..
- 15:25:21 [Pierre]
- ..... Capability representation is needed...
- 15:25:56 [Pierre]
- ..... Capabilities taxonomies could be defined by different people...
- 15:26:09 [Pierre]
- Slide 17 : Moderation
- 15:27:08 [Pierre]
- ......An authority is mamanging a process...
- 15:27:24 [Pierre]
- Slide 18 : moving to standards
- 15:27:37 [Pierre]
- We do not have the management system we need
- 15:27:58 [Pierre]
- We do not have any interoperability between LMS and activity softwares
- 15:28:11 [Pierre]
- Slide 19 : Key standards in this area
- 15:28:39 [Pierre]
- History of the SCORM initiative, which was a collection of many standards
- 15:29:21 [Pierre]
- OILS : UK initiative
- 15:29:58 [Pierre]
- There were a lot of organizations involved
- 15:30:11 [Pierre]
- American department of Defense
- 15:31:13 [Pierre]
- SCorm 1.2 included CMI, content packaging
- 15:31:26 [Pierre]
- Legal disputes between IMS and EDL
- 15:31:38 [Pierre]
- Everything stopped
- 15:32:01 [Pierre]
- A lot of disccusions there
- 15:32:16 [Judy]
- zakim, who's making noise?
- 15:32:19 [Pierre]
- Slide 20 : how SCORM works
- 15:32:34 [Zakim]
- Judy, listening for 17 seconds I could not identify any sounds
- 15:32:49 [Pierre]
- ......Within the content package, you have a manifest and SCOs
- 15:33:05 [Pierre]
- ...you can launch individual SCOS...
- 15:33:48 [Pierre]
- ...SCO is an activity, with a beginning and an end
- 15:34:49 [Pierre]
- .... 2004 : add of simple sequencing to that...
- 15:35:17 [Pierre]
- .....it became complex.....
- 15:35:32 [Pierre]
- .....need for in house implementation....
- 15:36:03 [Pierre]
- ...othe people did not implement the runtime as well..
- 15:36:11 [Pierre]
- ..... dry TOC...
- 15:36:21 [Pierre]
- Slide 21 : Probles with SCORM
- 15:36:56 [Pierre]
- Legal disputes with IMS + Javascript API +
- 15:37:15 [Pierre]
- ....Fixed Data Model in CMI was a pbm....
- 15:37:27 [Pierre]
- ..... as knewton in the last Educ call...
- 15:38:31 [Pierre]
- ...key point to draw out : field SCORM : SCO + Asset
- 15:39:26 [Pierre]
- You really can't have a fixed data model for innovation
- 15:39:56 [Pierre]
- ....more technical information needed (Transportation mechanism for example)...
- 15:40:11 [Pierre]
- Poor sequencing specification
- 15:40:43 [Pierre]
- Single learner model => No multi players ... gaming ??
- 15:40:59 [Pierre]
- 2008 : attempt to move beyond that
- 15:41:19 [Pierre]
- Slide 22 : Tin Can replaced Javascript
- 15:41:49 [Pierre]
- The Data model was very simple (Inspired by Social Networks)
- 15:42:03 [Pierre]
- Tin Can does not deal with object launches
- 15:42:13 [Pierre]
- Does not deal with metadata
- 15:42:32 [Pierre]
- Slide 23 : Standard issues
- 15:42:43 [Pierre]
- SCORM covered all the basis
- 15:43:00 [Pierre]
- We need multi player for pair learning
- 15:43:14 [Pierre]
- Datamodel definition language is necessary
- 15:43:32 [Pierre]
- LMS could basically discover
- 15:43:39 [Pierre]
- ...sequencing...
- 15:43:54 [Pierre]
- .... elephant to the room : Privacy for Data
- 15:44:12 [Pierre]
- Yes, Judy, could be cool
- 15:44:25 [Pierre]
- Transparency at minimum
- 15:45:13 [davidsloan]
- I can do it
- 15:45:30 [davidsloan]
- Discussion begins
- 15:45:41 [Judy]
- scribe: davidsloan
- 15:46:15 [davidsloan]
- Crispin focusing on interoperability, application development is a separate requirement
- 15:46:39 [davidsloan]
- interoperability needs to be agnostic with regard to application platform
- 15:47:04 [davidsloan]
- difficult to get consensus on something that hasn't happened yet, so standards creation is challenging
- 15:47:30 [davidsloan]
- need to allow framework for innovation, and then specifications emerge from that
- 15:47:58 [Pierre]
- My question on privacy
- 15:48:15 [Judy]
- q+
- 15:48:28 [ivan]
- ack Judy
- 15:48:40 [davidsloan]
- Crispin: privacy is a key factor in this framework. Suggests create a description language that allows adaptation for different jurisdictions and legislatory environments
- 15:49:45 [davidsloan]
- Judy: when W3C looks at taking on standardisation activity it needs to consider pressing needs; which organisations are active in this area and could partner; existing technical work in the area
- 15:50:30 [davidsloan]
- Judy: may be overlap with digital publishing activity
- 15:50:33 [ivan]
- q+
- 15:51:12 [ivan]
- ack ivan
- 15:53:15 [davidsloan]
- Ivan: W3C has focus of work, i.e. core web technologies. Difficult now to define what this is, but W3C does have some sense of what this is. Of standardisation questions raised in this and previous call's presentations, which are in areas within W3C expertise?
- 15:54:37 [Pierre]
- Data interoperability Platform
- 15:54:42 [davidsloan]
- Crispin: depends on what you see the Web as. TinCan as an example provides a web service API. Real crying need in edu is what the Web can offer as data interoperability platform
- 15:55:20 [Judy]
- q+
- 15:55:26 [davidsloan]
- Crispin: web services is a key are
- 15:55:42 [ivan]
- ack Judy
- 15:56:21 [davidsloan]
- s/are/area
- 15:56:23 [ivan]
- zakim, mute me
- 15:56:23 [Zakim]
- Ivan should now be muted
- 15:57:13 [davidsloan]
- Judy: mhakkinen may be able to comment on edu standards and core web technologies
- 15:57:48 [davidsloan]
- mhakkinen: currently in transition from paper based delivery to web based rich assessments
- 15:58:24 [davidsloan]
- mhakkinen: concerns over lack of harmonization in accessibility across different standards for assessment
- 15:58:30 [Judy]
- q+
- 15:58:57 [davidsloan]
- mhakkinen: example new initiative of interest is AQTI (Accessible QTI)
- 16:00:21 [Pierre]
- Open learning XML
- 16:00:46 [ivan]
- q+
- 16:00:47 [davidsloan]
- MarkS: right now, EdX started own standard on Open Learning XML (OLX), would be good to see commonalities with goals of this group
- 16:00:51 [ivan]
- ack Judy
- 16:01:30 [davidsloan]
- Pierre: we suggest using wiki to propose ideas for standardisation in education, for open discussion
- 16:02:09 [ivan]
- zakim, unmute me
- 16:02:09 [Zakim]
- Ivan should no longer be muted
- 16:02:22 [davidsloan]
- Pierre: next call on 20 February will focus on discussion of wiki
- 16:03:06 [mhakkinen]
- need to drop. thanks and bye!
- 16:03:20 [Zakim]
- -mhakkinen
- 16:03:21 [Pierre]
- Pierer Danet Hachette
- 16:03:25 [MarkS]
- Mark Sadecki - edX
- 16:03:29 [davidsloan]
- David Sloan, The Paciello Group
- 16:03:31 [mhakkinen]
- mark hakkinen - educational testing service (ETS)
- 16:03:37 [shorton]
- Sarah Horton, The Paciello Group
- 16:04:00 [Pierre]
- Jean Charles Pomerol will participate
- 16:04:17 [davidsloan]
- update for 20 Feb—subject will be MOOCs
- 16:04:17 [Zakim]
- -MarkS
- 16:04:25 [davidsloan]
- Judy: thanks to Crispin for presentation
- 16:04:29 [Zakim]
- -Judy
- 16:04:31 [Zakim]
- - +1.603.252.aaaa
- 16:04:33 [Zakim]
- -[IPcaller]
- 16:04:33 [Zakim]
- -Ivan
- 16:04:38 [davidsloan]
- davidsloan has left #educ
- 16:04:41 [Zakim]
- -??P30
- 16:04:42 [Judy]
- Judy Brewer W3C WAI
- 16:04:43 [ivan]
- rrsagent, draft minutes
- 16:04:43 [RRSAgent]
- I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2015/02/06-educ-minutes.html ivan
- 16:04:45 [Zakim]
- -??P11
- 16:04:46 [Zakim]
- Team_JEFF(EDUCATION)10:00AM has ended
- 16:04:46 [Zakim]
- Attendees were +1.603.252.aaaa, Ivan, [IPcaller], Judy, mhakkinen, Sylvie_Duchateau, MarkS
- 16:05:23 [Pierre]
- https://www.w3.org/wiki/AB/2014-2015_Priorities/w3c_most_important#Education_task_force
- 16:05:50 [Pierre]
- Tnks Judy for helping me
- 16:06:53 [ivan]
- rrsagente, draft minutes
- 16:06:58 [ivan]
- rrsagent, draft minutes
- 16:06:58 [RRSAgent]
- I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2015/02/06-educ-minutes.html ivan
- 16:21:20 [Judy]
- Judy has left #educ
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