See also: IRC log
<trackbot> Date: 25 April 2014
<scribe> scribe:Detlev
<scribe> scribe: Detlev
<Jan_> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-mobile-a11y-tf/2014Apr/0008.html
<Jan_> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-mobile-a11y-tf/2014Apr/0007.html
Kim: Jan walking though Comparison BBC - WCAG table
Jan: Standard operating system
alerts must be used where available - not covered in WCAG but
in UAAG
... Touch events must only be triggered when touch is removed
from a control - not covered there might be a future touch
interface technique for that
Detlev: Question on place of touch interaction in WCAG hierarch<
Jan: indieUI forcuses on that - in this case its related to focussing SC
Jon: This requirement may have
exceptions, not intended for screen reader use
... requirment addresses users without fine motor control
Jan asking whether SC 3.2.1 On focus is the right place for touch related techniques
Jon: Was originally thinking of 2.1.1 keyboard but not the ideal place
Jan: So either find a place
within scheme of SCs or say it's outside WCAG hierarchy
... better out it in and wait to updated WCAG
... Touch events must only be triggered when touch is removed
from a control - was removed frm WCAG 2.0 - still in in BBC
guidelines
Jon: Maybe an issue in some
markets (lack of modern kit?)
... There are some SCR Techniques - we need to ensure that
these are supported on mobile browsers with AT
<jeanne> I agree that we should not include this requirement to remove Javascript.
<Jan_> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Opera_Mini#JavaScript_support
Jeanne: Javascript support is not a direct accessibility issue
<jon_avila> +1 with Jeanne
Jeanne: So much negative views of accessibility in the developer community that requirng requiring non-JS would be setting us backward.
<KimPatch> +1
Jeanne: Nearly everything is based on JS these days...
General agreement
<Jan_> http://trends.builtwith.com/docinfo/Javascript
Opera mini has a high level of JS suport
Jan: "Audio must not play
automatically unless the user is made aware this is happening
or a pause/stop button is provided" - WCAG similar
... "Metadata should be provided for media" - points to a
technique for 1.2.3 Audio Description or Media Alternative
(Prerecorded):
Jon: There are other places within WCAG for metadata (in 1.1.1)
<jon_avila> http://www.w3.org/TR/UNDERSTANDING-WCAG20/text-equiv-all.html
<Jan_> http://www.w3.org/TR/UNDERSTANDING-WCAG20/text-equiv-all.html#non-text-contentdef
Jan: will change/ include in
mapping
... BBC: Recommendations more related to usability, less to
a11y
Jon: The point was to determine
where within the WCAG scheme one could slot in BBC
techniques
... Captions weren't perhaps covered because they are linked to
different req.
... Bypass blocks proably not covered because of the smaller
screen on mobile
Multiple ways probablly not covered because mobl apps not considered a collection of pages
Jan: BBC guidelines cannot claim the same universality as WCAG - corporate perspective
Jon: Guidelines good, can be used as gudance, not adopted directly
Kim: Not sure whether BBC has been asked to 'donate' techniques
Jeanne: Gap analysis serves to identify need for additional techniques
<Zakim> jeanne, you wanted to say that is not an accessibility issue and to discuss background of what we are doing with the gap analysis
Kim: Spot the things that need attention
Jan: Differnet content may be loaded at different breakpoints, things may be switched
Jeanne: Discussion going on responsive image rec. - allowing change of images where img would require different alt
Jon: menu normally on screen
becomes a flyout - will adress this in talk
... Form design: placeholder issues - have smaller label appear
above the input
... tables may be dynamically formatted at different
breakppoints
... so the assumption that some things stay the same may be
incorrect
Kim: Other things?
Detlev: wonders whether navigation related differences between browsers may entre the picture somewhere - may not be an a11y issue
<jeanne> ack [GVoice
Jon - acknowledges differences to desktop - gestures mimicking back button
Kim: basic point was navigation mechanisms are diverse and often diferent from desktop
Jeanne: Responsive design is not the same as delivering custom designs to particular assistive technologies
Jon: Responsive design could go further by being responsive to user preferences (such as prefer desktop site=
<jeanne> +1 to Jon's comment
Jan: Trigger breakpoints to have larger text in one column
Jon: Agrees that detection of AT not desirable - more listening to user prefs
Detlev: Mentioning customisabilty options
This is scribe.perl Revision: 1.138 of Date: 2013-04-25 13:59:11 Check for newer version at http://dev.w3.org/cvsweb/~checkout~/2002/scribe/ Guessing input format: RRSAgent_Text_Format (score 1.00) Succeeded: s/suport of non-JS would be foolish/requiring non-JS would be setting us backward./ Found Scribe: Detlev Inferring ScribeNick: Detlev Found Scribe: Detlev Inferring ScribeNick: Detlev Default Present: Kim_Patch, Jeanne, [IPcaller], Detlev, jon_avila Present: Kim_Patch Jeanne [IPcaller] Detlev jon_avila Kim Jan Jon Regrets: Kathleen_Anderson Gavin Kathleen_Wahlbin Alan_Smith Agenda: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-mobile-a11y-tf/2014Apr/0025.html Found Date: 25 Apr 2014 Guessing minutes URL: http://www.w3.org/2014/04/25-mobile-a11y-minutes.html People with action items: WARNING: Input appears to use implicit continuation lines. You may need the "-implicitContinuations" option.[End of scribe.perl diagnostic output]