15:55:55 <RRSAgent> RRSAgent has joined #audio
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15:56:00 <ot> Zakim, this will be Audio
15:56:00 <Zakim> ok, ot; I see RWC_Audio()12:00PM scheduled to start in 4 minutes
15:56:08 <ot> Meeting: Audio WG Teleconference
15:56:11 <ot> Agenda: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-audio/2012OctDec/0125.html
15:56:20 <ot> Agenda+ Publishing FPWD of MIDI spec
15:56:28 <ot> Agenda+ Web Audio API: AudioParam Automation
15:56:35 <ot> Agenda+ Web Audio API: Channel handling / naming
15:56:43 <ot> Chair: Olivier
15:57:59 <jernoble> jernoble has joined #audio
15:59:37 <ot> zakim, code?
15:59:37 <Zakim> the conference code is 28346 (tel:+1.617.761.6200 sip:zakim@voip.w3.org), ot
15:59:43 <chris> chris has joined #audio
16:00:29 <Zakim> RWC_Audio()12:00PM has now started
16:00:37 <Zakim> +??P38
16:00:41 <cwilso> cwilso has joined #audio
16:00:43 <Zakim> +[IPcaller]
16:00:44 <jernoble> zakim, ??P38 is me
16:00:44 <Zakim> +jernoble; got it
16:00:56 <ot> Zakim, [IPcaller] is me
16:00:57 <Zakim> +ot; got it
16:01:41 <Zakim> + +1.862.201.aaaa
16:01:52 <cwilso> zakim, aaaa is me
16:01:53 <Zakim> +cwilso; got it
16:02:22 <Zakim> +??P18
16:02:23 <Zakim> +Doug_Schepers
16:02:27 <chris> zakim: what is conference code?
16:02:29 <tmichel> tmichel has joined #audio
16:02:59 <gcardoso> zakim ??P18 is me
16:03:01 <ot> zakim, ??P18 is gabriel
16:03:02 <Zakim> +gabriel; got it
16:03:50 <chris> anybody know the conference code?
16:03:55 <ot> audio
16:03:57 <gcardoso> 28346
16:04:01 <ot> yup
16:04:04 <chris> thanks!
16:04:38 <Zakim> + +1.510.334.aabb
16:04:51 <ot> zakim, aabb is crogers
16:04:51 <Zakim> +crogers; got it
16:04:58 <Zakim> +??P75
16:05:34 <ot> agenda?
16:05:40 <tmichel>  zakim, ??P75 is me
16:05:40 <Zakim> +tmichel; got it
16:06:03 <tmichel> zakim, who is here ?
16:06:04 <Zakim> On the phone I see jernoble, ot, cwilso, gabriel, Doug_Schepers, crogers, tmichel
16:06:04 <Zakim> On IRC I see tmichel, cwilso, chris, jernoble, RRSAgent, Zakim, gcardoso, automata, colinbdclark, ot, shepazu, paul___irish, trackbot
16:06:13 <shepazu> agenda+ reminding members to rejoin Audio WG
16:06:48 <Zakim> -jernoble
16:07:28 <ot> zakim, take up agendum 1
16:07:28 <Zakim> agendum 1. "Publishing FPWD of MIDI spec" taken up [from ot]
16:07:35 <Zakim> +??P87
16:07:45 <jernoble> zakim, ??P87 is me
16:07:45 <Zakim> +jernoble; got it
16:08:31 <tmichel> https://dvcs.w3.org/hg/audio/raw-file/tip/midi/specification.html
16:08:46 <ot> CWilson: still work to do
16:08:56 <ot> … but now the spec has a bit of intro, which was missing
16:09:03 <ot> … not concerned about going to FPWD
16:09:33 <ot> Olivier: no showstopper issue?
16:09:40 <ot> CWilson: no
16:10:01 <ot> CRogers: one of the things which is confusing, there isn't really much of an introduction
16:10:12 <ot> CWilson: have you looked at it in the past week and half
16:10:23 <ot> CRogers: intro section now is short - one sentence
16:11:43 <Zakim> +gmandyam
16:11:43 <ot> CRogers: not a showstopper
16:12:11 <ot> … but even the structure is a little confusing, starts directly with getMIDIAccess
16:12:15 <gmandyam> gmandyam has joined #audio
16:12:25 <ot> … would be good to start with consideration about security etc
16:12:56 <ot> s/etc/security and privacy/
16:12:59 <shepazu> q+
16:13:36 <ot> CWilson: I can take another round explaining the character of the API in the intro
16:13:44 <ot> … like the webaudio API, explain how it works
16:13:59 <ot> … re security and privacy, there's some big disconnects and need more thoughts
16:14:11 <ot> q+
16:14:18 <ot> ack shep
16:14:55 <ot> Doug: in general, FPWD can be quite sketchy
16:14:57 <gmandyam> Giri Mandyam, Qualcomm Innovation Center, has joined
16:15:09 <ot> … this one would be quite complete already
16:15:28 <ot> … would benefit from having a little more explanation
16:15:36 <ot> … expanding intro would be goo
16:15:43 <ot> … as would some caveat in security section
16:16:05 <cwilso> q+
16:16:12 <ot> … but I think current draft probably sufficient for FPWD
16:16:18 <ot> ack ot
16:17:20 <ot> Olivier: would be good to publish before TPAC
16:17:25 <ot> ack cw
16:17:47 <ot> CWilson: we've had discussion internally about section for privacy/security
16:18:13 <ot> … the whole design has implication about privacy
16:18:15 <shepazu> q+
16:18:28 <ot> … but e.g Java exposes such MIDI info without warning
16:18:54 <ot> … hence "this may be a privacy concern" rather than "this is a privacy concern" or "you must pop a dialog"
16:19:02 <ot> … happy to publish before TPAC
16:19:16 <ot> … and could work on the two sections today
16:20:13 <cwilso> q?
16:20:18 <cwilso> ack shepazu
16:20:32 <ot> Olivier: if we can do edits today, we can have a CfC and move to publish if no objection
16:20:45 <ot> Doug: changes required are mostly editorial, not normative
16:20:49 <ot> … and we can play with later
16:20:59 <ot> … so we can resolve to publish as is, ask that you make the changes
16:21:26 <ot> … about security/privacy, the draft should ack that we are still thinking about the implications, that the section is work in progress
16:22:03 <ot> Doug: as side note, just because Java does thing in a specific way doesn't mean it's a good privacy model
16:22:20 <ot> CWilson: agree, it just means this info has been exposed and we need to think about it
16:23:04 <ot> CRogers: might be a difference between MIDI input and output
16:23:24 <ot> no need to get permission for e.g joystick API
16:23:43 <ot> CRogers: but for writing MIDI it would probably need permission
16:23:46 <shepazu> q+
16:23:55 <ot> ack d
16:23:57 <ot> ack s
16:24:14 <ot> Doug: could I control my home security/audio/lighting system? or even in a facility?
16:24:30 <ot> CWilson: if you have a MIDI system hooked up that way
16:24:35 <ot> … e.g stage control
16:25:07 <ot> Doug: wondering if the scope is implicitly/explicitly mentioned
16:27:00 <ot> [CWilson explains how you could plug in a whole MIDI system]
16:27:20 <ot> Doug: given the focus on IoT, we should at some point try to look at that use case
16:28:09 <ot> CWilson: there is a section about this, explaining the API gives you access to MIDI devices
16:28:16 <ot> … what you do with them is up to you
16:29:35 <ot> Olivier: may be worth mentioning that in the intro
16:29:54 <ot> Doug: also, may be worth dispelling the notion that "MIDI is crappy audio playback"
16:30:12 <ot> CRogers: explain that it has nothing to do with .mid files
16:30:19 <ot> Doug: exactly right
16:31:35 <gmandyam> +q
16:31:43 <ot> ack g
16:32:18 <ot> Giri: is a call for exclusion going to come with FPWD?
16:32:30 <ot> Doug: yes, that will be the first opportunity for exclusion
16:32:45 <ot> … which is why it's important to have most features in FPWD
16:34:22 <ot> zakim, close agendum 2
16:34:22 <Zakim> agendum 2, Web Audio API: AudioParam Automation, closed
16:34:23 <Zakim> I see 3 items remaining on the agenda; the next one is
16:34:23 <Zakim> 1. Publishing FPWD of MIDI spec [from ot]
16:34:33 <ot> zakim, reopen agendum 2
16:34:33 <Zakim> I don't understand 'reopen agendum 2', ot
16:34:40 <ot> zakim, close agendum 1
16:34:40 <Zakim> agendum 1, Publishing FPWD of MIDI spec, closed
16:34:41 <Zakim> I see 2 items remaining on the agenda; the next one is
16:34:41 <Zakim> 3. Web Audio API: Channel handling / naming [from ot]
16:34:51 <ot> agenda?
16:35:01 <ot> agenda+ Web Audio API: AudioParam Automation
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16:35:08 <ot> zakim, take up agendum 3
16:35:08 <Zakim> agendum 3. "Web Audio API: Channel handling / naming" taken up [from ot]
16:35:37 <ot> https://www.w3.org/Bugs/Public/show_bug.cgi?id=17396
16:35:37 <ot> https://www.w3.org/Bugs/Public/show_bug.cgi?id=17351
16:36:33 <Zakim> +??P50
16:36:48 <ot> zakim, ??P50 is Jussi
16:36:48 <Zakim> +Jussi; got it
16:37:30 <ot> https://www.w3.org/Bugs/Public/show_bug.cgi?id=17379
16:39:31 <ot> Looking at https://www.w3.org/Bugs/Public/show_bug.cgi?id=17396 AudioDestinationNode.numberOfChannels
16:39:42 <ot> CRogers: we haven't defined the channel layout
16:39:57 <ot> … we have a few, mono, stereo, quad etc
16:40:11 <ot> … but devices can have unusual channel mappings
16:40:29 <ot> … so automated downmixing doesn't make sense
16:40:46 <ot> … you could take the first 2 and drop all the rest
16:41:01 <ot> … would be better when we have implementations going beyond 2 channels
16:41:44 <ot> … expecting that even for e.g mono smartphones, the audiocontext could still say 2, and the implementation would mix down to one
16:42:47 <ot> Olivier: so do we want more than 2 channels in "v1"?
16:43:04 <ot> CRogers: you can process large numbers of channels in the middle of the graph
16:43:17 <ot> … at the minimum the representation should probably say stereo
16:44:19 <ot> Olivier: that leads us to https://www.w3.org/Bugs/Public/show_bug.cgi?id=17379
16:44:34 <ot> CRogers: yes, we need to add something to describe the channel layout
16:44:47 <ot> … we should expose that information through a channel layout attribute
16:45:01 <ot> … so that developers can mix accordingly
16:46:40 <ot> Olivier: any thought on how to describe the channel layout?
16:46:56 <ot> CRogers: for example, CoreAudio has a way to get a list of channels and tag
16:47:19 <ot> … but there is a simpler approach where typical setups are numbered
16:47:40 <ot> … the approach with an array of channels and label for each one feels overkill ATM
16:48:02 <ot> … could be a readonly value for the time being
16:48:58 <ot> … has to be readonly since it maps the physical output
16:51:04 <ot> Olivier: how would implementation deal with plugging a sound card with 16 channels
16:51:24 <ot> CRogers: max number of channels would be 16, and there would be a constant for "undefined" or "not applicable" layout
16:51:58 <ot> ACTION: CRogers to summarise channel layout discussion into Bug 17379
16:51:58 <trackbot> Created ACTION-50 - Summarise channel layout discussion into Bug 17379 [on Chris Rogers - due 2012-10-24].
16:52:22 <ot> zakim, close agendum 3
16:52:22 <Zakim> agendum 3, Web Audio API: Channel handling / naming, closed
16:52:24 <Zakim> I see 2 items remaining on the agenda; the next one is
16:52:24 <Zakim> 4. reminding members to rejoin Audio WG [from shepazu]
16:52:37 <ot> zakim, take up agendum 4
16:52:37 <Zakim> agendum 4. "reminding members to rejoin Audio WG" taken up [from shepazu]
16:53:10 <ot> ACTION: Olivier to send reminder for group participants to re-join
16:53:10 <trackbot> Sorry, ambiguous username (more than one match) - Olivier
16:53:10 <trackbot> Try using a different identifier, such as family name or username (eg. ot, folivier3)
16:53:32 <ot> ACTION: OT to send reminder to send to all AC reps for group participants to re-join
16:53:32 <trackbot> Created ACTION-51 - Send reminder to send to all AC reps for group participants to re-join [on Olivier Thereaux - due 2012-10-24].
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16:54:24 <gmandyam> q+
16:54:36 <ot> ack gm
16:55:03 <gmandyam> q+
16:56:03 <ot> Agenda+ AOB
16:56:05 <Zakim> +??P10
16:56:15 <chrislowis> Zakim: p10 is chrislowis
16:56:26 <ot> Giri: there is a comment on recording media streams in GetUserMedia
16:56:48 <gcardoso> zakim, ??P10 is chrislowis
16:56:48 <Zakim> +chrislowis; got it
16:57:42 <gmandyam> See http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-media-capture/2012Oct/0066.html
16:57:45 <Zakim> -gmandyam
16:58:27 <Zakim> -cwilso
16:58:31 <Zakim> -Doug_Schepers
16:58:33 <Zakim> -ot
16:58:33 <Zakim> -Jussi
16:58:34 <Zakim> -crogers
16:58:36 <Zakim> -gabriel
16:58:43 <ot> rrsagent, make logs public
16:58:45 <Zakim> -chrislowis
16:58:54 <ot> rrsagent, draft minutes
16:58:54 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2012/10/17-audio-minutes.html ot
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