14:51:28 <RRSAgent> RRSAgent has joined #forms
14:51:28 <RRSAgent> logging to http://www.w3.org/2012/06/20-forms-irc
14:51:30 <trackbot> RRSAgent, make logs public
14:51:30 <Zakim> Zakim has joined #forms
14:51:32 <trackbot> Zakim, this will be IA_XForms
14:51:32 <Zakim> ok, trackbot; I see IA_XForms()11:00AM scheduled to start in 9 minutes
14:51:33 <trackbot> Meeting: Forms Working Group Teleconference
14:51:33 <trackbot> Date: 20 June 2012
14:51:49 <Steven> Agenda: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-forms/2012Jun/0026
14:51:53 <Steven> Chair: Steven
14:55:32 <Steven> Steven has changed the topic to: #forms Agenda: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-forms/2012Jun/0026 (Steven)
14:56:17 <alain> alain has joined #forms
15:01:18 <Zakim> IA_XForms()11:00AM has now started
15:01:22 <Zakim> +??P6
15:01:48 <Zakim> +??P24
15:01:55 <Steven> zakim, I am ??P6
15:02:03 <nvdbleek> nvdbleek has joined #forms
15:02:06 <Zakim> +Steven; got it
15:02:10 <Steven> zakim, ??p24 is alain
15:02:11 <alain> zakim, i am ??p24
15:02:15 <nvdbleek> zakim, code?
15:02:15 <ebruchez> ebruchez has joined #forms
15:02:23 <Zakim> +alain; got it
15:02:24 <Steven> code is xform
15:02:25 <Zakim> sorry, alain, I do not see a party named '??p24'
15:02:33 <Zakim> the conference code is 93676 (tel:+1.617.761.6200 sip:zakim@voip.w3.org), nvdbleek
15:03:09 <Zakim> + +1.650.919.aaaa
15:03:13 <Zakim> + +1.323.425.aabb
15:03:24 <ebruchez> zakim, +1.323.425.aabb is ebruchez
15:03:24 <Zakim> +ebruchez; got it
15:03:47 <nvdbleek> zakim, I am +1.6
15:03:48 <Zakim> + +44.782.483.aacc
15:03:52 <Zakim> +nvdbleek; got it
15:04:16 <Steven> https://www.quixey.com/
15:06:13 <Steven> zakim, +44 is Philip
15:06:13 <Zakim> +Philip; got it
15:07:07 <Steven> zakim, who is here?
15:07:07 <Zakim> On the phone I see Steven, alain, nvdbleek, ebruchez, Philip
15:07:08 <Zakim> On IRC I see ebruchez, nvdbleek, alain, Zakim, RRSAgent, Steven, trackbot
15:07:09 <pfennell> pfennell has joined #forms
15:08:19 <Steven>  Topic: "XForms for Business and Government"
15:08:26 <pfennell> pfennell - Minutes Taker
15:09:06 <Steven> Scribe: pfennell
15:09:07 <pfennell> Seneca interested in support an event in using XForms for Business and Government.
15:10:28 <pfennell> Let Steven know about speakers for the event.
15:11:24 <pfennell> Philip to enquire if there are any UK people who would be interested in this event.
15:11:56 <pfennell> Event to, probably, be held at CWI.
15:12:45 <pfennell> Possible time-frame late September or beginning October.
15:13:17 <Steven> Topic:  xsl:function/@override
15:13:19 <Steven> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-forms/2012Jun/0023.html
15:14:37 <pfennell> Mike Kay confirmed usage of the function 'override' attribute.
15:15:49 <pfennell> Consensus is that this is not required for XForms 2.0. There are no good use-cases for this.
15:17:08 <pfennell> What should be the behaviour if two functions, with matching names/namespaces and arity are in scope?
15:18:23 <ebruchez> "It is a static error [err:XQST0034] if the expanded QName and arity (number of arguments) of the declared function are equal (as defined by the eq operator) to the expanded QName and arity of another function in function signatures."
15:18:30 <ebruchez> http://www.w3.org/TR/xquery/#FunctionDeclns
15:18:47 <pfennell> Xquery does not have 'override'. Xquery raises a static error.
15:19:35 <nvdbleek> nvdbleek has joined #forms
15:22:14 <ebruchez> http://wiki.orbeon.com/forms/doc/developer-guide/xforms-xpath-functions
15:24:15 <pfennell> Nick wants the 'override' attribute.
15:25:09 <nvdbleek> http://www.w3.org/TR/xslt20/#element-function
15:25:54 <Steven> The optional override attribute defines what happens if this function has the same name and arity as a function provided by the implementer or made available in the static context using an implementation-defined mechanism. If the override attribute has the value yes, then this function is used in preference; if it has the value no, then the other function is used in preference. The default value is yes.
15:26:11 <ebruchez> http://www.w3.org/TR/xslt20/#function-function-available
15:26:58 <pfennell> Does anyone object to the addition of the 'override' attribute?
15:27:52 <pfennell> There were no objects to the addition of the 'override' attribute.
15:29:18 <pfennell> Steve: The convincing case is declaring a function that's supported all but one implementation.
15:29:46 <Steven> s/Steve/Steven/
15:31:42 <pfennell> RESOLUTION: We will adopt @override, from XSLT 2.0, for function declarations.
15:31:43 <Steven> rrsagent,make minutes
15:31:43 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2012/06/20-forms-minutes.html Steven
15:32:40 <pfennell> Override will only apply to extension functions.
15:32:46 <Steven> Topic: Common @model and @context
15:32:48 <Steven> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-forms/2012Jun/0013.html
15:32:50 <nvdbleek> ACTION nvdbleek to specify that you can't override build-in functions
15:32:50 <trackbot> Created ACTION-1908 - Specify that you can't override build-in functions [on Nick Van Den Bleeken - due 2012-06-27].
15:34:45 <Steven> No reply from Leigh about checking schemas yet.
15:34:51 <Steven> Topic: Spec review
15:34:52 <Steven> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-forms/2012Jun/0006.html
15:36:04 <ebruchez> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-forms/2012Jun/0012.html
15:38:15 <pfennell> Erik: ID conflicts can occur if the same fragments is loaded via load/@embed
15:38:19 <Steven> (Sometimes I wish we had never used ID)
15:41:23 <pfennell> Steven: 'XML was not designed for the things we use it for'. 
15:42:20 <pfennell> Steven: Could remove the xs:ID type from the @id?
15:43:24 <pfennell> Nick: 'Shadow Trees' are a possible solution to ID attribute scope.
15:45:54 <pfennell> Erik: Java has strong encapsulation which is an example of a possible approach.
15:46:47 <pfennell> Erik: We also need to consider the 'escape' of events.
15:48:11 <pfennell> Erik: XForms 2.0 is defining 'simple' inclusions and more advance solutions should be added via extensions.
15:50:35 <pfennell> Steven: Where simple enclusions have been implemented it is possible to have ID clashes.
15:56:05 <pfennell> Steven: A helpful solution for the XForms user is to not to have to worry about ID clashes but this is at the expense of the implementer. 
15:56:56 <pfennell> Repeating IDs are currently handled within xf:repeat.
15:58:13 <pfennell> Steven: To Alan, do you see any disavantages to this?
16:00:02 <pfennell> Steven: more discussion required for IDs.
16:00:36 <pfennell> Steven: Hopefully the problem with requesting the first working draft for XForms 2.0 will be fixed.
16:01:45 <Zakim> -Steven
16:01:47 <Zakim> -alain
16:01:48 <Zakim> -nvdbleek
16:01:50 <Zakim> -Philip
16:01:52 <Zakim> -ebruchez
16:01:54 <Zakim> IA_XForms()11:00AM has ended
16:01:56 <Zakim> Attendees were Steven, alain, +1.650.919.aaaa, ebruchez, +44.782.483.aacc, nvdbleek, Philip
16:01:58 <Steven> rrsagent, make minutes
16:01:58 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2012/06/20-forms-minutes.html Steven
16:02:18 <Steven> Regrets: John
16:02:27 <Steven> rrsagent, make minutes
16:02:27 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2012/06/20-forms-minutes.html Steven
16:32:42 <ebruchez> ebruchez has joined #forms
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