Contents:
- Successes and Challenges
- Web and TV IG HTML 5 Proposals
- web content interoperability
- Agenda building
- Sharing and Advocacy Plenary
- Wrap up
<matt> scribe: Matt
Jeff: Today will be breakout sessions mostly.
<FabGandon> Venue of the TPAC next year : http://www.ccc-lyon.com/home
Jeff: Two discussions today, one on Web and TV and another on Interoperability.
Successes and Challenges
Jeff: In thinking about what to present to this
group, I spent a lot of time sharing a focus that we have within W3C on the
business model of the W3C.
... I wanted to do something different, as many of you have heard about the
business model for quite some time. Plus the TP audience is mostly the
innovators, who are more interested in how we create standards at W3C.
... You all see pieces of that with your team contacts and WGs, but many of
you haven't seen the broad process.
... I don't have all of the answers here. I have some answers, some open
questions, but we want your feedback.
<inserted> [ Jeff's Slides -- http://www.w3.org/2011/Talks/jj-tpac-20111102.pdf ]
Jeff: W3C Organization Focus, just two slides on
this.
... The rest is on how to improve the creation of standards.
... The basis for a sustainable business model is the importance of the
Web.
... Thank you for creating the next ten technologies for the Web. It is those
technologies that create the sustainable business model of the W3C.
Jeff: We've focused over the last year on how the
Web isn't just technical, but transformative.
... The important thing about the Web today, the Open Web Platform, is going
to transform every single business once again.
... Industries are changing from the work we do in these rooms here. Devices,
Web of Data, security… all of these companies need to be aware of that.
... The core of the success of the messaging we've put together can be
evaluated in several ways. The way I prefer to evaluate it, because it's
succinct, is what I call 18 in 18.
... We've added 18 new Full Members to the W3C in the last 18 Months. 25% of
our Full Members are now brand new.
... There is plenty of renewed interest. Significant brand names across a wide
set of industries.
... 2011 Focus on HOW we create standards
... Getting started early, finishing on time, headlights, getting the right
participants/stakeholders, how we talk to one another, developer conference,
and to end, is it time for us to re-evaluate W3C process?
... Getting started earlier: Community Groups. We looked at the difficulty of
getting innovators to the W3C. We started with Incubator Groups, which were
good, but not good enough. So, we launched Community Groups.
... CGs are free, open, and easy to get developers to W3C.
... Anyone can participate, even non-members for free.
... There's latitude in how CGs work is structured. RF and IPR are different
than WGs, but can still lead to Rec.
... 30 CGs formed, 12 more proposed.
... Timeliness: Missing schedule hurts
... Charters list when recommendations come out. We usually miss the
schedule.
... Good or bad?
Roger: Bad.
Jeff: On average it is bad. We have to be careful
in the terminology. There's a balance between right standard late and wrong
standard on time.
... After looking at lots of data, we were too late.
... Sometimes things change, and they have to be late, but that is a minority
of the situations.
... The cost is that we can't get as much done, damages our reputation,
etc.
... Metrics, measured the number of projects that I looked at. Looked at the
dates on those projects, and what we originally targeted.
... What percentage are on schedule, and how late were we.
... Looked at 2 categories of projects: how many got to rec in the last 12
months: 16. How many are sitting there waiting to be completed: 147.
... Of the 16 we completed in the last 12 months, 9 of them we have an
original date for, and of the 141 we know 91 of them.
... We finish 10-20% of things on time, roughly.
... We're talking 100 things and finishing just 10-15% of them on time. That
might be okay if we were just consistently 6 weeks late.
... But we're not.
... On average they were three years later than originally chartered.
... Things we completed were almost 3 years late. On going is 27 months, but
that's not less than 3 years, because it's 27 months and counting.
... Ideas for Chairs
... We have some ideas of what the team can do better, and what W3C management
can do better.
... I want your input on this, that in an hour or so when Ian and Tantek talk
about the breakouts that they propose one on this question.
Kai: Just wanted to point out that we already have a breakout session for that called: "Revisiting the way W3C creates specifications"
[[Session 3 in California room 1]]
Jeff: We'll leave it up to Ian and Tantek to
determine if they're the same, if they are great.
... How do we make sure we're noticing it on time. We're doing work internally
to the team, but presented to membership in time, to make sure the right topics
are chartered in time.
... We're getting better about getting new things started quickly, WebRTC,
Security and Privacy, etc.
... But we can do better.
... We're going to get a little more focus.
... We're going to look at new conferences, etc, and figure out where to do
new work. Some will be incremental and get automatically get put into W3C
process.
... In some cases there may be a whole breakthrough new dimension that
requires new outreach and innovation.
... In that case we'll go through a new W3C "Headlights" process. Every winter
we'll see if there are new big things happening.
... The hope would be then to socialize it and get it to the members at the
spring AC meeting.
... Then every summer we have our internal strategy conference. There we
decide resources, etc.
... Another thing we'll do for new things is that we sometimes get a situation
where a WG has started, but it doesn't get traction or doesn't get adopted. Or
maybe there are a handful of people in the WG that implemented it, but no
traction because critical stakeholders aren't participating.
... That is something we need to manage better at W3C.
... I've asked the AB if this is something they should be doing, and they said
no, we should be, so we're doing it.
... So team contacts have to assess their WGs, identify lapses, keep in touch
with implementers and report weekly.
... Domain leads track that and reports to W3M quarterly or as needed.
... W3M figures out where we need help.
... Purpose of TPAC is for developers to work together.
... We've heard in the past that a full day of presentations or panels or just
being talked to wasn't as meaningful as some would like. The purpose of TPAC is
face to face meetings, many WGs working together. The generalization is that
we're all people and need to be talking to one another.
... So, let's make TPAC a giant opportunity to get people to talk to one
another, we'll see how it works out.
... I am hopeful and anxious about how it works out.
... After brief plenary, there will be breakouts, then a brief closing plenary
for sharing breakout info.
... A few announcements:
... We've created our first conference to focus on the needs of developers and
designers. W3Conf!
... Thanks to Doug for driving this internally at W3C and thanks to Microsoft
for their generous sponsorship.
... You can still register to be in the audience or join the streaming.
Doug: And thanks AT&T, Nokia and Adobe for
also sponsoring!
... There are still a few seats available. If you register with code 'tpac'
you get $50 off the registration.
Jeff: That's two weeks from now.
... Next week we have the W3C Social Business Jam.
... That's where we figure out what social means to business.
... Of the items I talked about we probably spent the most time talking about
Community Groups.
... We need to understand whether some of the CG practices can filter in to
W3C WGs as well.
... Changing our WG process isn't something that changes on a dime, but I am
interested in what changes are needed. Who should be involved? Who are the
stakeholders? What are the priorities for what gets solved?
... I hope this was useful. I went a little over time, but let's take one or
two questions.
... Let's go directly to the panels then.
Web and TV IG HTML 5 Proposals
Mark Vickers, Comcast
Mark: I am Mark Vickers from Comcast, we've been
running an interest group on Web and TV.
... Focus has been to look at use cases and compare them to the specs.
... Most use cases were fully supported, but there were gaps.
... The members of the group, I've split into three categories:
media/operator, research/government and electronics/software products.
... The group is about the media and operator folks delivering content to
electronics and software groups.
... There's nothing specific in this group about TV as a specific device.
There's no TV specific API.
... However there have been TV and media related gaps that have been
identified, but they apply to all devices.
... Media delivery has been moving to the cloud over the public internet,
rather than private networks.
... The HTML 4 world is pretty much what we deliver today.
Mark: There's nothing in the HTML 4 spec that
gets you video. All video is done through plugins.
... Our world is between HTML 4 and the plugin.
<tantek> I disagree with the assertion that "There's no TV specific API" - TVs often have various hardware capabilities that are not common on other devices, e.g. multiple video/audio inputs to choose from, picture-in-picture etc. All of those could inform the design of a "TVAPI" in the broader category of WebAPIs.
Mark: In television there's a mixed world, we
deliver to televisions now. Some are HTML 4, just binary, some widget like
things, apps.
... We've been working towards new hope of HTML5.
<Alan> ArtB: Clarke Stevens (CableLabs) & Giuseppe Pascale (Opera)
Mark: We want to deliver content to any HTML5
Client.
... You can add subscription based, on demand, or broadcast, but this group
has been focusing on where the issues are.
... The first area is about the delivery.
... In professional video we don't have just one video and one audio, but
through the work of the XG people and W3C, HTML 5 has good multi-track.
... And there are many many data tracks associated too, captions, interaction,
content advisories, etc.
... So it's really a bundle of things that are sent out together. That support
is in there, and you'll hear Clark talk about that and what tweaks are
needed.
... There's also adaptive streaming based on available bandwidth.
... Then there's content protection.
... In HTML4 this happened through plugins.
... In the open web there is DRM, which is done with plugins. Those have been
approved by the studios.
... For home use there's DTCP-IP, and there are plugins for those too.
... HTML 5 supports content protection, but it's up to the browser to support
it.
... Other options for content protection, something open source and open
standards based, but new protection can be brought to the studios and approved
over time.
... All of those are in the Media Pipeline Task Force, which has been focused
on that.
... The other aspect is that there is another cloud. There's a different
cloud, maybe a fog or something, the cloud of the home.
... The connected devices of the home.
... These are connected through technologies that Giuseppe will be talking
about.
... Browsers haven't had access to these technologies, but could. Phone as
remote, or bluetooth connections, etc.
... That is the Home Network Task Force, extensions to provide support for the
standard Web.
<scribe> scribe: MichaelC
Clarke Stevens, CableLabs
cs: my kids watch video on the web now, not tv devices
some of it is proprietary formats
no standard holds back professional industry
industry cares about content rights
basically, if you don't have a DRM solution, you won't get the content
it's also not practical to support arbitrary number of protocols
features from mainstream TV like content advisories, authorization need to be built
accessibility solutions not standardized yet
but of course we want to go beyond the traditional model, if we're moving to the Web
e.g., multi-screen
multiple content types
platform customizations
interactivity
context awareness
(such as location, have program follow you as you move among devices)
strategic use of available bandwidth
-- requirements for the above --
Combined main and descriptive audio track
Handling in-band tracks
(program, ads, etc. all coming together)
Ability to pass parameters to server such as device capabilities
to adapt bit rate etc.
and send feedback about how things are working within those parameters, to adjust
Content protection (i.e., DRM)
planning to file issues on HTML 5 to address gaps in above requirements
need to work with HTML WG, accessibility WGs, etc. to move these requirements forward
Giuseppe Pascale, Opera
<inserted> http://people.opera.com/giuseppep/hntf-usecases-gaps/
<dom> Giuseppe's slides
gp: Q: What do all the devices people use have in common?
A: they all run a browser, and all run on home network
huge percentage of people watch TV and surf internet at same time
use cases for multi-screen
select video to watch on PC, then send to TV
stick everything onto one screen
use smartphone as device remote control
supplemental content to program on auxiliary devices
when we have connected devices, can meet these use cases and others
the technology is almost there
but you have to download application, it has to discover your devices and be able to communicate with them
no way for device discovery exists right now
both their existence, and available services
existing mechanisms can support communication between devices
but need to address communication between two client user agents, wrt same origin restriction
Home Network Task Force has determined the device discovery is the primary gap needs focus
could use XHR if relaxing same origin restriction
There have been a series of Web & TV workshops
today, want to explore some of the results with groups here
Friday there is a joint Web&TV and DAP meeting to start technical work
Clarke Stevens, CableLabs
cs: have implemented API from CableLabs as an applet
<dom> Discovery API demo (Member-only)
which tries to address issues raised in the presentations this morning
Roger_Cutler: think there could be security implications, is this being investigated?
Mark_Vickers: not really being explored yet, but now is the time
Ileana_Leuca: suggest meet with WebRTC
some areas of common interest in the technical solutions
Ralph_Brown: how do we instill urgency in this work?
mv: many of the issues already filed on HTML 5, as tweaks of existing features
Home Networking API is new
looking for where that would go
cs: demoing 2 UPnP servers and a DAP server
start discovery
<technical issues scupper demo>
UA should present a dialog box listing discovered devices
user indicates which ones to tell Web page exist
then can use XHR to communicate between them
use can change which devices exposed to the network at any time
<dsr> scribenick: dsr
web content interoperability
chaired by Bryan Sullivan
Why worry about content interoperability? There a somewhat accurate perception among developers that developing for the web is hard, especially for the mobile web.
why does that perception exist/persist? What are your expectations for content interoperability? what are the top issues for W3C to focus on?
e.g. the role of the W3C Testing activity for verifying consistent behavior across browsers.
Developers want it to just work! It doesn't have to be totally easy - after all we live in the real world.
So what do you think are the key interoperability issues?
what can be addressed by more/better testing
what can be done with better specs or improved W3C processes?
what issues can be addressed by supplemental approaches, e.g. JavaScript libraries, developer guidelines etc.
Kai (Deutsche Telekom) we care about content interoperability and our designers traditionally cared about pixel for pixel accuracy.
It was a battle to convince them that that isn't the big issue.
Dealing with variations across browser versions would cost about one million euros, something no one will pay for,
We therefore focus on a small number of browsers and versions.
Bryan: those costs get in the way of other work, e.g. on improved accessibility.
Soonho Lee, SK Telecom, mentions the ability for developers to sell apps in app stores.
customers will be upset if the applications that they have paid for turn out not to work properly.
Bryan: the economic model for native and web apps is different.
Soonhoo Lee: we need to reduce the costs of testing, better interoperability will help that.
Claudio Venezia (Telecom Italia) if there is a core set of interoperable features that would help. This is better than large but poorly implemented specs.
Bryan: if the specs take too long to finish, interop testing can't happen in a timely way.
<Josh_Soref> [ Laughter ]
Wilhem Joys Andersen (Opera) In the late 90s, we taught web
developers that specs cannot be trusted. We taught them that each browser
required different instructions to perform as intended. In part because browser
vendors implemented their own thing with no regards to the standardization
process and in part because the standards bodies failed to write specs and
standards for the technologies that were actually used.
We've spent the past 15 years cleaning up the mess we created. Browser vendors
have had to make the web more interoperable one broken site at the time. It's
been expensive. It's been painful.
But I believe both the W3C and browser vendors have learned from all these
mistakes.
We have mostly, but not completely, stopped writing fiction. A spec without a
good test suite is fiction. A spec without implementations is fiction. A spec
without content is fiction.
We have learned that no plan ever survives contact with the enemy, and no spec
ever comes unharmed from implementation, testing and content production. Specs
are not delivered on stone tablets from the heavens. They are developed through
a chaotic, frustrating, iterative process. The spec influences implementations
and content, but is also influenced by them. Even after REC.
We have learned that the Web is fragile. It's a wonder this thing even works.
If you fix a browser bug on Facebook, you are likely to break GMail. To ensure
that implemenatations remain interoperable, we need the official W3C test
suites to be good and extensive. HTML4 had a few hundred test cases. Based on
my experience through seven years of testing browsers, I believe we need no
less than one million test cases to properly test the Web platform.
Ann Bassetti (Boeing) we have the same problem in big companies and our developers struggle to understand how to address the interop issues for the Web.
Kai (DT) W3C's mission to lead the Web to its full potential - this is being hurt by the interop problems
Roger: W3C seems fixated on the browser, there is a lot more to consider
Ann: we also are interested in a wider range of devices than desktop and mobile.
<brutzman> not hearing an accessibility story... are they thinking interoperability first, maybe accessibility later?
Noah (TAG) this community puts a huge amount of effort into being liberal in what the browsers accept,
but perhaps less on other aspects.
Mary Brady (NIST) testing is hard! We would be happy to share our past experiences with you.
<ArtB> ACTION: Mary Brady get NIST to submit the 1,000,000 test cases Wilhelm said we will need for HTML5 [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2011/11/02-tpac-minutes.html#action01]
Charles (Opera) there is a feeling that real men write HTML in a text editor, but good authoring tools are a really important part of the puzzle.
Bryan: the integration of Web APIs in to good authoring tools is really valuable.
Philippe (W3C) millions of dollars spent on testing for big websites. If at W3C we don't put the required effort into testing for HTML5 we will be suffering for a long time into the future.
<koalie> Web Testing interest group
Kai: the answer doesn't lie in perfect specifications that take a long time to finish, better to crowd source smaller specs.
Daniel Glazman (Disruptive Innovations) we lack editing coordination across W3C specs
Bryan thanks everyone for their comments.
[ Applause ]
Agenda building
<koalie> BarCamp/BreakOut Session Grid
Ian explains how the rest of the day will work
Ian thanks the members of the TPAC plenary program committee
Tantek explains about bar camps. Every session today have been written up on the wiki, see http://www.w3.org/wiki/TPAC2011/PlenaryBreakouts
Tantek asks people to introduce themselves to the people seated behind them.
(lots of noise as everyone starts talking)
Tantek calls us all to order....
Ian: we are going to spend the next 20 minutes to work on scheduling the break out sessions.
<dom> Schedule of the break out sessions
Each session is about an hour long and the first will run until Lunch
<Josh_Soref> [ Crickets ]
There will then be 3 more sessions and we will then come back for a show and tell report back.
<dbaron> Should there be a time limit for the sharing presentations?
<dom> Session ideas on W3C wiki
Tantek: some months back we decided to invite topic proposals on a wiki. We preselected a small set of them. You don't have to go to them.
The actual schedule is picked today.
You will be invited to come to the front and write your breakout proposal on the green sheets: please write 3 things - the subject of the session, the name of the discussion leader(s) and the hashtag for the IRC channel and for twitter if you plan to use that as well.
You don't need to take a full hour slot if you don't need that.
There is a record number of people at this TPAC, so space is at a premium. This makes it a good idea to merge closely related sessions.
There are also some overflow areas for smaller sessions.
Ian encourages people to come to the summary session at the end of the day and for each breakout to assign scribes to take notes on the IRC channel.
Tantek - be sure that the scribe links to the grid on the wiki.
Tantek invites people to come forward now to post the proposals on the whiteboard.
<Josh_Soref> [ Cricket ]
<Josh_Soref> Anne: We want to reserve a time slot
<koalie> [people break to break-out rooms]
<jeff_> Where is the grid posted?
<amy> grid: http://www.w3.org/wiki/TPAC2011#Session_Grid
<shawn> pointer to page with sessions?
<hober> shawn: http://www.w3.org/wiki/TPAC2011#Session_Grid
<shawn> thanks!
<hober> np
Sharing and Advocacy Plenary
<jeanne> scribe: jeanne
Laura: Building Cloud Applications. Started on cloud security, but the group was more interested in standards around cloud applications. How can we leverage existing standards to apply to cloud
<koalie> TPAC2011/Building Apps in the Cloud
Laura: what can W3C do in addressing issues now and going forward.
Doug: Developer documentation and education: We
talked about the need for better documentation
... to help people create content.
... discontinuity between developer documentation and specifications.
... HTML5 has a mode that hides and just shows developer documentation
<brutzman> can someone please link "Declarative 3D" on the meeting matrix at 1430 in room B to http://www.w3.org/community/declarative3d/
<dom> [the W3C cheatsheet extracts data from specs to build a dictionary of markup elements, css properties, etc, cf http://dev.w3.org/2009/cheatsheet/doc/developer.html ]
Doug: how summaries in working groups would be
very useful. "This week in X working group" so people would understand issues
in specs
... reaching out to international contacts to increase translations
<dom> http://w3c-test.org
plh: Testing in Web Browsers: update on status on
the current work. There is framework on a mercurial server w3c-test.org. There
are a few working groups using it.
... showing testharness.js
<dom> http://w3c-test.org/html/tests/resources/testharness.js
Bryan: API Design Approach: Data minimization for privacy protection
Brian: make sure API is targeted to the
audience
... the design should follow a progressive path
<RalphS> [Bryan reviews -> http://www.w3.org/wiki/TPAC2011/API_Design_Approaches_and_the_Rationales_for_Them Results ]
[summary on the web page]
<koalie> minutes of Global Participation Breakout
Ann: Encourage more global participation in w3c
and web
... we think people should speak more slowly with simpler English
[applause]
Ann: part is the W3C does very technical work.
Timezones. Email thread that is fast-moving, may have a decision before
participants in Asia even wake up. Unfair.
... quiet voiced people have a hard time getting attention on a call
<brutzman> Japanese gamer in the HTML5+Games breakout described "globish" = Global English 8)
Mani: Challenge of Identity
... enabling good user experience is to insure that the user knows who they
are talking to. Two-way communication with privacy safeguards.
... applicable models like OpenID for authentication.
... we don't trust the service provider, the email ID is the most ubiquitous
identifier.
Alan: Social Business Jam: we talked about how the JAM will work, it is international, there will be 6 topics and anyone can participate 24/7 for three days
Tab: Agile Standardization within the W3C Process
<RalphS> Agile Standardization Summary
Tab: Modularize - interconnects can kill you.
FOcus on a bedrock spec as fast and small as possible.
... then build modules on top of that that only refer to the bedrock spec and
limit the interdependencies between them
... stages: Exploratory, Stable and Recommended
... blog post from fantasai
Hadley: Open Gov Data
... governments decided that anonymous data should be available for others to
use. But it is not standardized
... we discussed transfer between formats, documentation of the data
... proprietary formats and licensing problems
... linking to new formats of the data created by a 3rd party
... need for new vocabularies - different language used by govs and
developers
Paul: HTML WG Decision Policy
... explained the history, why WG needed more than the W3C process
... a surprise that the decision policy could evolve without a charter
change
Paul: concern that the editor handled the bugs
and then the bugs can be escalated
... informative session
Jeff: Fixing Schedule Delays
... started with Jeff's ideas, which were thrown out and started with a blank
slate.
... 23 ideas, narrowed down to 16
... create a separate role of test editor for every document
... create concept of a living working group that will last forever
<koalie> TPAC2011/Fixing schedule delays
Jeff: implementors need to make commitments earlier in the process
<ArtB> Minutes from scheduling delays: http://www.w3.org/2011/11/02-schedule-minutes.html
Johannes - Declarative 3D. Only Community Group breakout session.
Johannes: put 3D as a declarative language in the
DOM.
... how the system evolved over the last few years and what could be the
outcome of the community group
... the main plan is to get the requirements and use cases
... then showed demos
Dan: Right to Link
... copyright and publishing data on the web
... inform opinion of people in regulatory and policy arena, on what it means
to host web sites. So that policy makers understand web publishing.
... definitions of terms
... guidance for terms of service
... fair use, reuse of data, content, and publishing
... contribute thought to Dan or TAG mailing list
Kim: Explosion of Input Methods
<koalie> TPAC2011/Adjusting to explosion of input methods
Kim: there were the keyboard and the mouse. Now
there are 5 input methods - touch, speech and gesture
... less hacking, most systematic approach, giving users more choice
... we need to talk across groups. Intentional Events, EMMA
HTML5 and Games: Game programming HTML5 for Kids. Shows cartoon showing W3C
<koalie> TPAC2011/HTML5 and Games
Raman: Evolving web platform Web APIs and accessibility
<koalie> minutes of breakout on Web APIs and Accessibility
Raman: web platform is being to include very rich interaction APIs, speech. Web apps do all the work instead of letting the UI appear elsewhere.
<brutzman> (late entry) the Declarative 3D breakout session description is at http://www.w3.org/wiki/TPAC2011/SessionIdeas#Declarative_3D_Graphics_on_the_Web
Raman: services on the web - google maps, twitter
- allow the developer to build light weight web apps with different UIs based
on the service.
... now we have the ability to deliver apps that meet the needs of every
individual user.
<dom> re HTML Speech in the browser, cf http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-xg-htmlspeech/2011Oct/att-0064/speechwepapi_1_.html
Kai: Revisiting how W3C creates standards
Kai: we had so many input points we decided to brainstorm
<dom> [A community Group has been created in result of the session Kai is presenting: http://www.w3.org/community/w3process/ ]
Kai: specs are too large, too complex, and too long
<RalphS> [Kai summarizes -> http://www.w3.org/wiki/TPAC2011/Revisiting_how_W3C_creates_standards Revisiting how W3C creates standards ]
Kai: the process document doesn't match the
development
... hard to fix charter
... drafts are continuously outdated
... hard to determine what the changes are
... specs are only looked at during Last Call
Kevin: HTML5 AV Club session - as opposed to putting more DRM in HTML5
<koalie> minutes of breakout on HTML5 AV Club
Kevin: missing - the ability to create a
playlist
... adaptive streaming discussion
... the difference between a short news program vs. a streaming movie.
Kevin: the ability to save media
Paul: jQuery and js developers want from web
standards:
... feature detection
<koalie> minutes of breakout on What jquery and js developers want from web stds.
Paul: detecting what the best features are of
each browser
... documenting
... use cases of benefits of the spec
... community for authors to interact with the standards community and getting
their feedback listened to
... standards work email lists are scary, and there need to be ways to attract
their input.
... a safe place to propose ideas
IanJ: this is the second community group, and it may be an option for your group as a next step
Alex: Linked Data
<koalie> TPAC2011/Linked data
Alex: how can we communicate to people. We don't
have the right resources.
... what is the difference with Open Linked Data.
... we put more emphasize on enterprise and linked enterprise linked data
especially data integration
... there will be a workshop in December
... TimBL's 5 stars of Linked Data
... discussed forming a community group.
... also about studying patterns
<koalie> TPAC2011/Web-based Digital Signage
Shinji: Web-based Digital Signage
... features and functions, use cases in Japan
Robin: Improving W3C Publications Ecosystem
<koalie> TPAC2011/W3C Publications Ecosystem
Robin: hard in terms of producing specs that
match existing specifications
... style and boilerplate
<dom> Follow up conversations on publication ecosystem will happen on http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/spec-prod/
Robin: some css hackers are going to work on that
and develop some icons to improve understanding of status
... html5 will soon be able to be used in specs
<anne> yay
Robin: rich UI in specs - linking to test suites,
comment on spec, etc
... tooling - common output, inserting references
... wikis to create specs, rich semantics
... W3C needs a Managing Editor to be a go-to
Debbie: Demos of W3C technologies
... CSS regions, layouts
... Open Stream, medical history on tablet or handheld medical history tool
that can dictate or add videos
... InkML - interoperability of Powerpoint, HTML5 and chat
Ted: HTML5 and Games
... new community group of people who were interested in games on top of
HTML5.
<koalie> TPAC2011/HTML5 and Games
Ted: report from the HTML.next for Games
... need better audio support for games
Ted: developers don't know what to use, and
browsers don't know what to use, so we are trying to improve the
communication
... make real requirements to go to working groups
minutes of breakout on Content Protection
Mark: Content Protection
... it is clearly not an objective to standardize in HTML5, but there are
capabilities that need to be exposed so that commercial services can be
supported.
... if you try to play back protected content, the key exchange can be
mediated at the service layer
... need for more descriptive error codes when things go wrong
... this can be reported back to the customer service of commercial
companies.
... there will be more discussion about this.
IanJ: please give feedback
... thanks to the program committee
<koalie> Feedback survey
<fukuno> W3C girl here -> http://fukuno.com/w3c_girl.html
Wrap up
<koalie> scribenick: amy
TimBL: I got mutiny/desertion. Jeff pointed out
that he'd been jumping up and down all the time and I had hoped he hadn't
noticed I'd be sitting there having fun
... he's dropped out of the wrapup. just me
... I wanted to say thank you. i want to say my own thank you to Ian and
Tantek for the unconference thing (clapping)
TimBL: I've done a few unconferences. this one, I
think, though I may be biased. i feel people were really engaged
... I didn't go to every room but the ones I felt the vibe from, people were
there w/ acute interest, acute need to communicate or resolve.
... from my point of view, from my own need to get connected into things, it
passed the connected sessions test. the urge to be in more than you really can
be. i regret missing some
... that made me feel to a certain extent that my thirst had been quenched but
my appetite whetted to learn more.
... this is a massive task, building the next web. there is a huge amount of
work. there is a huge amount of coordination
... one of the interesting things it to take this and ask to what extent W3C
can be an un-organization
... if we can do this f2f, to what extent can we do this to W3C
... W3C has always been a group that decides it's own process, makes it's own
agenda.
... i have a feeling that lots of groups were talking about architecture,
modularity, etc. ".which way should we take things?"
... different groups are working out what it is we need in the future. can we,
you, us, together, when we go home, when we go back online, can we work in a
distributed fashion to address communal things.
... communal things like consistent architecture. testing. i love that
everyone is talking about testing. that's great. it's great that we're taking
testing seriously
... doing architectural design, that's more of a test of the
un-organization
TimBL: another issue, managing process. i liked the group meeting by the bar from which I was politely excluded. they re-engineered the W3C, reconstructed
TimBL: different places where people are looking
at publication, HTML5 group
... difficult things but very important
TimBL: I'd like to leave w/ you to be communal.
think about this being an unconference. think that if you don't do it maybe
someone will.
... if you organize other people's lives/architecture. you have to be
respectful
... i hope people will find this a good time for talking not to people you
think are right. but also to those you think are wrong. go find them. find out
where they're coming form.
... you have alcohol at your disposal.
... this happened because of tantek and Ian. Jeff also had a lot to do w/
this. Thank you Jeff for running the org
... mainly it is the admin team.. all the stuff we never heard about
... i leave you w/ this challenge. we've had one day of unconference. think
about your role in an unorganization. think about the process. let's make it
something w/ works on mutual respect. something peer-to-peer.
... everywhere we've made a rule (sometimes because we've done something
wrong). we put constraints and boilerplate. let's review them. love the idea of
replacing w/ icons. let's think about new ones. we'll get them wrong but on
balance. we should be constantly be modifiying our thoughts about
architecture
... last people that I thanked, front half of the room stand up!! stand up (I
mean it!)
... everyone stand up, up to Coralie, stand up, turn around everyone else
stand up, as you're able
... everybody clap (clapping). well done. thank you for coming
TimBL: until next time
... reception, 6pm end of the hall