13:31:09 <RRSAgent> RRSAgent has joined #swcg
13:31:09 <RRSAgent> logging to http://www.w3.org/2011/01/12-swcg-irc
13:31:15 <Zakim> Zakim has joined #swcg
13:31:21 <ivan> zakim, this will be swcg
13:31:21 <Zakim> I do not see a conference matching that name scheduled within the next hour, ivan
13:44:17 <manu> manu has joined #swcg
13:47:39 <ivan> zakim, room for 15 for 90 minutes?
13:47:41 <Zakim> ok, ivan; conference Team_(swcg)13:47Z scheduled with code 26633 (CONF3) for 90 minutes until 1517Z
13:50:15 <ivan> zakim, code?
13:50:15 <Zakim> the conference code is 7924 (tel:+1.617.761.6200 tel:+33.4.26.46.79.03 tel:+44.203.318.0479), ivan
13:50:25 <ivan> rrsagent, set log public
13:52:53 <ivan> Meeting: SWCG Telco, 2011-01-12
13:52:58 <ivan> Chair: Ivan
13:53:02 <TomB> TomB has joined #swcg
13:53:26 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2011/01/12-swcg-minutes.html TomB
13:53:36 <ivan> ivan has changed the topic to: SWCG Telco, 2011-01-12, agenda at http://www.w3.org/mid/297ED6A1-462E-48B8-BAA6-FC9B3990B9A2@w3.org
13:54:27 <ivan> Regrets: Michael, Chris
13:55:12 <ivan> -> http://www.w3.org/mid/297ED6A1-462E-48B8-BAA6-FC9B3990B9A2@w3.org Agenda call
13:57:41 <ivan> zakim, dial ivan-voip
13:57:41 <Zakim> ok, ivan; the call is being made
13:57:42 <Zakim> Team_(swcg)13:47Z has now started
13:57:43 <Zakim> +Ivan
13:58:17 <Zakim> +manu
13:58:18 <Zakim> -manu
13:58:18 <Zakim> +manu
14:01:30 <Zakim> + +62427aaaa
14:02:52 <mscottm> mscottm has joined #swcg
14:02:56 <Zakim> +??P15
14:02:56 <Zakim> +??P12
14:02:58 <manu> zakim, who is on the call?
14:02:58 <manu> zakim, are you alive?
14:02:59 <Zakim> On the phone I see Ivan, manu, +62427aaaa, ??P15, ??P12
14:03:01 <Zakim> I don't understand your question, manu.
14:03:07 <IanH> IanH has joined #SWCG
14:03:08 <ivan> zakim, who is here?
14:03:09 <Zakim> On the phone I see Ivan, manu, +62427aaaa, ??P15, ??P12
14:03:15 <Zakim> On IRC I see IanH, mscottm, manu, Zakim, RRSAgent, danbri, ivan, sandro
14:03:15 <TomB> TomB has joined #swcg
14:03:40 <mscottm> Zakim, +62427aaaa is mscottm
14:03:40 <Zakim> +mscottm; got it
14:03:51 <ivan> zakim, ??P15 is Ian
14:03:51 <Zakim> +Ian; got it
14:04:01 <ivan> zakim, ??P12 is Tom
14:04:01 <Zakim> +Tom; got it
14:04:10 <ivan> zakim, who is here?
14:04:10 <Zakim> On the phone I see Ivan, manu, mscottm, Ian, Tom
14:04:11 <Zakim> On IRC I see TomB, IanH, mscottm, manu, Zakim, RRSAgent, danbri, ivan, sandro
14:05:37 <Zakim> +Ian_Davis
14:06:18 <Zakim> +??P9
14:07:46 <Zakim> +[IPcaller]
14:09:05 <mscottm> mscottm has joined #swcg
14:09:09 <IanH> IanH has joined #SWCG
14:09:27 <TomB> TomB has joined #swcg
14:09:32 <ivan> scribenick: mscottm
14:09:32 <ivan> scribe: Scott
14:09:32 <ivan> Topic: Last meeting minutes
14:09:32 <ivan> -> http://www.w3.org/2011/01/12-swcg-minutes.html Last meeting's minutes
14:09:32 <danbri> danbri has joined #swcg
14:09:45 <mscottm> last meeting minutes are ok to be accepted
14:09:47 <ivan> zakim, who is here?
14:09:47 <Zakim> On the phone I see Ivan, manu, mscottm, Ian, Tom, Ian_Davis, ??P9, [IPcaller]
14:09:49 <ivan> Present+ dave, danbri
14:09:49 <Zakim> On IRC I see danbri, TomB, IanH, mscottm, Zakim, RRSAgent, ivan, sandro
14:09:51 <mscottm> Happy New Year to all
14:09:53 <ivan> -> http://www.w3.org/2011/01/rdfa-wg-charter.html RDFa new charter
14:09:57 <ivan> -> http://www.w3.org/2011/01/rdfa-wg-charter-diff.html RDFa diff
14:10:03 <ivan> zakim, Ian_Davis is David
14:10:03 <Zakim> +David; got it
14:10:10 <ivan> zakim, ??P9 is Paul
14:10:10 <Zakim> +Paul; got it
14:10:22 <manu> manu has joined #swcg
14:10:41 <manu> RDFa WG charter: http://www.w3.org/2011/01/rdfa-wg-charter.html
14:10:58 <mscottm> Continuing discussion from december: a need for javascript support in RDFa
14:11:38 <pgroth> pgroth has joined #swcg
14:11:39 <mscottm> RDF working group is continuing, RDFa working on RDFa API, extending the timeline a little bit
14:12:13 <mscottm> Would like feedback on 1) we would need another co-chair
14:13:14 <mscottm> <waiting for suggestions..?>
14:13:38 <danbri> so this is a general RDF API? or just .js?
14:13:54 <manu> good question, danbri - that's one of the things we need to discuss.
14:14:34 <mscottm> <anonymous> suggests that a name might be suggested in the coming week.
14:16:00 <mscottm> The other thing Ivan wants feedback on was mentioned by danbri above: general RDF API or just .js
14:16:10 <manu> q+ to discuss current design direction
14:17:57 <mscottm> One possibility is to influence several programming languages by creating RDF API's for each of them
14:17:59 <ivan> q?
14:17:59 <ivan> ack manu
14:18:01 <Zakim> manu, you wanted to discuss current design direction
14:18:08 <mscottm> vs. keep it in javascript
14:18:42 <mscottm> manu: it isn't much of an issue to implement in python and ruby, although C and C++ are trickier
14:22:48 <Zakim> -David
14:24:30 <mscottm> mscottm has joined #swcg
14:24:34 <IanH> IanH has joined #SWCG
14:24:49 <danbri> danbri has joined #swcg
14:24:58 <mscottm> would we expect Jena to take up the API?
14:25:02 <mscottm> we already have enough legacy support issues with vendors
14:25:04 <TomB> TomB has joined #swcg
14:25:05 <mscottm> this all seems to indicate that we shouldn't try to make a generic API
14:25:11 <mscottm> please look at the current charter to see if that message comes through.
14:25:17 <mscottm> [somebody leaving] look at the provenance stuff
14:25:18 <manu> manu has joined #swcg
14:25:47 <mscottm> I'm hesitant to start the provenance because Luc Moreau isn't here yet but maybe he will join in a minute
14:25:53 <danbri> (re APIs, draft text "There is scope for cross-language collaboration on APIs, eg. Python and Ruby are very similar environments. Rather than attempt a design-by-committee API to work identically in all languages, instead we will encourage community collaboration on adapting the Javascript API to the idioms and constraints of different languages.")
14:26:15 <TomB> > http://www.w3.org/2011/01/prov-wg-charter-diff.html - Sorry, Not Found.
14:26:17 <TomB> The URL path in your request doesn't match anything we have available.
14:26:25 <Zakim> +Nigel
14:26:31 <mscottm> Paul Groth [introduction]: work at the VU Amsterdam, intensively on provenance on the web in the incubator group
14:26:37 <ivan> ivan has joined #swcg
14:27:20 <TomB> But http://www.w3.org/2011/01/prov-wg-charter.html works...!
14:28:26 <danbri> re fast/lite WG ... basically no WG launches without people saying "this one'll be quick and easy"
14:28:29 <pgroth_> pgroth_ has joined #swcg
14:28:32 <ivan> zakim, who is here?
14:28:32 <Zakim> On the phone I see Ivan, manu, mscottm, Ian, Tom, Paul, [IPcaller], Nigel
14:28:35 <Zakim> On IRC I see pgroth_, ivan, manu, TomB, danbri, IanH, mscottm, Zakim, RRSAgent, sandro
14:28:42 <TomB_> TomB_ has joined #swcg
14:29:40 <manu> Our company is dealing with provenance issues right now... we're using graph literals to talk provenance.
14:35:12 <Luc> Luc has joined #SWCG
14:35:16 <LeeF> LeeF has joined #swcg
14:35:45 <danbri> danbri has joined #swcg
14:35:51 <mscottm> mscottm has joined #swcg
14:35:58 <IanH> IanH has joined #SWCG
14:36:19 <pgroth> pgroth has joined #swcg
14:36:27 <manu> manu has joined #swcg
14:36:33 <manu> Not necessarily on board with "Named Graphs"
14:36:35 <manu> What about Graph Literals? http://webr3.org/blog/semantic-web/rdf-named-graphs-vs-graph-literals/
14:36:40 <ivan> ivan has joined #swcg
14:36:42 <TomB__> TomB__ has joined #swcg
14:37:12 <manu> No, we shouldn't be talking about Quad stores.
14:37:19 <ivan> q?
14:37:51 <Zakim> +??P19
14:37:56 <manu> We talk about Graph Literals in the RDF API: http://www.w3.org/2010/02/rdfa/sources/rdf-api/
14:37:58 <Zakim> +Sandro
14:38:00 <LeeF> zakim, ??P19 is me
14:38:00 <Zakim> +LeeF; got it
14:38:12 <manu> http://www.w3.org/2010/02/rdfa/sources/rdf-api/#graph-literals
14:38:26 <danbri> (portions of the graph is another nameable graph?)
14:38:55 <manu> GraphLiterals should be allowed in RDF subject/object position ( end of rant :P )
14:39:08 <mscottm> Luc: summarizes efforts leading up to the WG charter for provenance
14:39:12 <mscottm> Authors of Provenir, PML, etc. will likely all be part of working group
14:39:15 <mscottm> The provenance working group would not add anything to the RDF model - there is room for coordination between RDF and Provenance
14:39:18 <mscottm> Ivan: Only RDF issue that the XG identified as necessary is named graphs - correct?
14:39:22 <mscottm> Paul: Yes, we need named graphs as a way to point at things
14:39:25 <mscottm> Paul: You can do something with RDF as it stands now
14:39:44 <mscottm> ..but it would be nice to have something official
14:40:20 <mscottm> Scott: <check in on what is meant by named graphs, points out that some people mean different things>
14:41:16 <mscottm> Paul: named graphs are the parts of a graph that we want to describe, can do some things with quad stores but don't want to specify implementation
14:41:59 <mscottm> Luc: not sure about <company X> participating in the WG
14:42:56 <mscottm> ..There was an 'interest in having standards appear'.
14:43:26 <mscottm> Ivan: Tom, do you have industrial partners that might be interested?
14:44:14 <mscottm> Tom: Not unless you consider OCLC to be an industrial partner. 
14:44:19 <Luc> can we also add that NASA has expressed strong interest in the WG and will implement the standard in one of theirprojects
14:45:32 <mscottm> Scott: What level of NASA (Ames Research for example)?
14:45:38 <mscottm> Luc: Sandro?
14:45:53 <mscottm> Sandro: It's coming from the upper echelons. 
14:46:06 <mscottm> ..NASA is in the process of joining.
14:47:03 <mscottm> Luc: You had some interest from Google?
14:49:15 <mscottm> Sandro and Ivan have some contacts there, might be interested. We'll see.
14:49:54 <mscottm> general question of where is the "bar" for WG going through: enough if we have OCLC, NASA, and IBM?
14:51:45 <mscottm> <scribe is temporarily gagged>
14:56:55 <IanH> Have to go -- another meeting starting.
14:57:02 <IanH> Bye.
14:57:06 <mscottm> Bye.
14:57:09 <Zakim> -Tom
14:59:58 <mscottm> questions: What now? How much further do we have to go?
15:00:37 <mscottm> Ivan: We send out for public comments. At some point, Sandro and Ivan take it to management, once approved, it goes to vote in approx. 4 weeks
15:01:41 <mscottm> ..We will look at whether we have to create a new mailing list.
15:04:17 <mscottm> Lee: SPARQL, looking to finish. A bit too much work. Some remaining notes to finish.
15:04:23 <mscottm> Manu: RDF, RDFa API
15:05:26 <mscottm> Ivan: notes that there will be a new draft from RDB2RDF
15:05:34 <Zakim> -Paul
15:05:56 <mscottm> Scott: HCLS IG is large. Lots of progress. A few publications just going out, a few more on the way. Expect to see about 2 more notes.
15:07:01 <Zakim> +??P53
15:08:09 <Zakim> -[IPcaller]
15:08:36 <Zakim> -manu
15:08:42 <Zakim> -Nigel
15:08:43 <ivan> rrsagent, draft minutes
15:08:43 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2011/01/12-swcg-minutes.html ivan
15:08:44 <Zakim> -??P53
15:08:45 <Zakim> -Ian
15:10:07 <Zakim> -LeeF
15:12:09 <Zakim> -mscottm
15:14:47 <ivan> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Member/member-semweb-comment/
15:15:14 <ivan> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Team/w3t-semweb-review
15:30:34 <danbri> danbri has joined #swcg
15:30:54 <LeeF> LeeF has joined #swcg
15:35:49 <Zakim> -Sandro
15:35:51 <Zakim> -Ivan
15:35:51 <Zakim> Team_(swcg)13:47Z has ended
15:35:53 <Zakim> Attendees were Ivan, manu, mscottm, Ian, Tom, [IPcaller], David, Paul, Nigel, Sandro, LeeF
15:40:02 <danbri> danbri has joined #swcg
15:41:31 <LeeF> LeeF has joined #swcg
15:51:00 <danbri> danbri has joined #swcg
15:51:22 <LeeF> LeeF has joined #swcg
15:54:32 <manu> manu has joined #swcg
16:02:28 <danbri> danbri has joined #swcg
16:03:14 <manu> manu has joined #swcg
16:03:46 <LeeF> LeeF has joined #swcg
16:14:38 <danbri> danbri has joined #swcg
16:16:18 <manu> manu has joined #swcg
16:16:25 <LeeF> LeeF has joined #swcg
16:27:11 <danbri> danbri has joined #swcg
16:27:18 <manu> manu has joined #swcg
16:28:49 <LeeF> LeeF has joined #swcg
16:39:39 <danbri> danbri has joined #swcg
16:40:10 <LeeF> LeeF has joined #swcg
16:40:14 <manu> manu has joined #swcg
16:44:35 <Zakim> Zakim has left #swcg
16:47:16 <manu> manu has left #swcg
16:58:47 <danbri> danbri has joined #swcg
16:59:00 <LeeF> LeeF has joined #swcg
17:17:34 <LeeF> LeeF has joined #swcg
17:17:34 <danbri> danbri has joined #swcg
17:25:08 <danbri> danbri has joined #swcg
17:25:31 <LeeF> LeeF has joined #swcg
17:36:11 <danbri> danbri has joined #swcg
17:38:23 <LeeF> LeeF has joined #swcg
17:46:13 <danbri> danbri has joined #swcg
17:49:20 <LeeF> LeeF has joined #swcg