14:05:43 RRSAgent has joined #aapi 14:05:43 logging to http://www.w3.org/2010/07/13-aapi-irc 14:05:59 rrsagent, make logs public 14:06:07 rrsagent, make log world 14:06:15 Scribe: Andi 14:06:23 Meeting: AAPI 14:06:31 Chair: Cynthia 14:06:48 +Cynthia_Shelly 14:07:22 davidb 14:07:37 1 min 14:07:49 s/davidb// 14:07:56 s/1 min// 14:09:11 +[Mozilla] 14:09:40 Zakim, Mozilla has David_Bolter 14:09:40 +David_Bolter; got it 14:10:05 topic: Events table in events.doc that Cynthia sent out 14:10:59 DB: reviewed events.doc 14:11:06 CS: have not reviewed it with the IE team 14:11:42 +Michael_Cooper 14:12:18 CS: HTML element types that support certain events, ARIA semantics that map to similar HTML elements should support the same events 14:12:28 DB: modifying the DOM events? 14:12:43 DB: don't like the premise of modifying DOM events 14:12:54 DB: think ARIA's place is primarily for the HTML 14:13:11 CS: don't necessarily have to change DOM events but ... 14:13:23 CS: DOM events create OS events 14:14:03 CS: look at onchange or onsubmit events, some get mapped up to OS level, not mapped to API events 14:14:55 DB: if
has role=combobox, selection via ARIA attribute, need to fire event.... 14:15:04 DB: Firefox goes right to platform event 14:15:46 CS: when semantics of element have been modified by ARIA such that they are the same as HTML element... 14:16:08 CS: if the corresponding HTML element would throw platform events, then the ARIA element should fire the same events 14:16:09 s/primarily for the HTML/for desktop events/ 14:16:51 CS: third table in events.doc is the one that is like what we need in the UAIG 14:19:31 DB: would be good to know if Safari is firing DOM events 14:19:56 CS: need to compare this to the tables we have and see if we have covered everything 14:20:25 DB: something that someone else could do - go through various attribute changes and see what the implementations do in terms of firing desktop events 14:22:09 CS: what do ARIA test suites test? 14:22:21 MC: still in planning stage, started wiki page for test planning 14:22:22 cyns has joined #aapi 14:22:30 I'm in 14:22:34 -> http://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/wiki/ARIA_Test_Plan ARIA test plan 14:22:42 MC: need some unit tests for what UAs do for a given role and properties - several hundred unit tests 14:23:01 MC: also need to do feature tests with combinations of roles, states, properties working together 14:23:18 MC: don't know if this is required for implementation or not but certainly required for interoperability 14:23:38 MC: might be room for adding suggestions to wiki page 14:23:44 DB: suggest adding events 14:24:06 MC: going to add a third category for dynamic tests 14:24:36 MC: plan is to be able to import these into a test tool 14:25:01 DB: FF runs on three platforms so have internal event model 14:25:32 MC: adding to the wiki page: "reaction to events (fairly UA specific, need to expand on this)" 14:25:59 DB: testing would be UA specific but want to aim for interoperability 14:26:40 CS: many will have to be operating system specific - something happening outside the browser that AT has to react to. 14:27:06 CS: ARIA is a bridge from Web application to platform implementation 14:28:04 MC: hoping to generate using XSLT, Jon G. has tests, want to automate what we can but there will be lots of human created tests 14:28:35 DB: created FF tests in Dojo 14:29:10 MC: hard to focus on test suite until test harness is done 14:29:52 MC: for human created tests, need a way to ensure they are valid 14:30:34 CS: writing a spec for each test, could be done without the test harness 14:31:55 MC: send note to Rich - UAI TF has thoughts about testing 14:32:35 action: Cynthia to send note to Rich about prioritizing testing on Monday's agenda 14:33:39 topic: bug 7019 14:33:46 CS: section 4.7 rules 14:34:14 CS: element is focusable - doesn't necessarily mean there are actions 14:36:48 CS: why are menus treated differently? do any of the roles in the first table in 4.7 need this level of description? 14:37:16 DB: nice keeping the menu things in their own space 14:37:39 CS: we have a bunch of things that are separate one off things - the menu section is one of the last ones of those 14:39:43 DB: what does the actions column mean? 14:40:55 CS: aria states/properties that cause elements to have additional actions associated with them in the browser 14:41:15 CS: doDefaultAction on a button clicks 14:41:42 CS:
with aria-expanded, doDefaultAction comes in from OS, what should the UA do? 14:42:03 DB: in FF, doDefaultAction simulates a mouse click 14:43:05 CS: maybe the format we use for menu events is a better way to describe the actions tables 14:43:49 DB: Javascript is between user action and event 14:44:22 DB: browser has to fire event if state (aria-expanded) changes 14:44:45 DB: Javascript is handling actions 14:45:27 CS: if AT simulates arrow behavior... 14:46:07 DB: AT should let user keystrokes go through 14:46:25 CS: but what about things that simulate a keyboard - voice reco or onscreen keyboard 14:46:33 DB: they just synthesize the keystrokes 14:47:00 CS: for UA, keystrokes and mouse clicks need to get passed through 14:47:27 DB: for 2nd table in 4.7, specifying the default action might be useful, might depend on the role 14:47:35 CS: most are going to be click 14:47:49 CS: grabbed is interesting, exposed "grab" action 14:47:58 s/exposed/exposes/ 14:48:52 CS: back to bullet list at top of 4.7 14:49:54 CS: what actions get exposed when these are true 14:50:26 CS: just because something is focusable, doesn't mean there are actions associated with it 14:50:34 CS: click handler is obvious 14:52:01 DB: if it's in the tab order, FF exposes click as the default action 14:53:38 remove the xlink bullet 14:54:12 CS: maybe we need a table of user events 14:54:27 CS: but is that ARIA? 14:54:32 DB: more like HTML 14:55:22 CS: some discussion about moving authoring advice out of HTML spec and into a separate document 14:56:32 CS: been talking about doing a mapping document for HTML to accessibility APIs 14:58:05 topic: prep for Monday's call - what can others help us with? 14:58:49 CS: actions and events topic could be given to someone else 14:59:56 9363 could be given to someone else 15:01:31 DB: could work with Joseph on events/actions bugs that are assigned to Cynthia 15:05:48 -Andi_Snow-Weaver 15:05:49 -[Mozilla] 15:05:49 -Michael_Cooper 15:05:50 -Cynthia_Shelly 15:05:50 WAI_PFWG(AAPI)10:00AM has ended 15:05:52 Attendees were Andi_Snow-Weaver, Cynthia_Shelly, David_Bolter, Michael_Cooper 16:24:21 Zakim has left #aapi 18:16:11 Andi has joined #aapi 18:16:39 rrsagent, make minutes 18:16:39 I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2010/07/13-aapi-minutes.html Andi